A-2 leather jacket, looking for guide

[TLW '90]

I think I'll just get an A2 from cockpitusa. I'm not much of a stickler for historical accuracy. And don't feel like paying an arm and a leg either! The Real McCoys? Real Expensive!

I think the cheapest they offer is $600 something.
US WINGS ( formerly cooper ) has offerings in the $400 range, but the sizes seem to just be S M & L and the jackets look overly billowy in the stock photos.
I'm weary of the current cooper stuff, but maybe somebody knows if they're a good buy or not.


If the quality on Cockpit USA ( formerly Avirex) A2's is significantly better or you can get a different leather that you like or something then I'd go for it, but if not I would definitely get a USN saddlery or 90's orange label cooper for 1/3 the price or less.

I payed about $150 shipped for my cooper 2 years ago and couldn't be happier with it.

There are a couple deals on Ebay right now, but they may or may not be your size.

 

[jeepTj98]

I think the cheapest they offer is $600 something.
US WINGS ( formerly cooper ) has offerings in the $400 range, but the sizes seem to just be S M & L and the jackets look overly billowy in the stock photos.
I'm weary of the current cooper stuff, but maybe somebody knows if they're a good buy or not.


If the quality on Cockpit USA ( formerly Avirex) A2's is significantly better or you can get a different leather that you like or something then I'd go for it, but if not I would definitely get a USN saddlery or 90's orange label cooper for 1/3 the price or less.

I payed about $150 shipped for my cooper 2 years ago and couldn't be happier with it.
View attachment 725957
There are a couple deals on Ebay right now, but they may or may not be your size.

I’ve had older copper jackets and I always like the quality and the fit. That looks really good on you, the fit is perfect!

 

[TLW '90]

I’ve had older copper jackets and I always like the quality and the fit. That looks really good on you, the fit is perfect!

The cut looks better than the new stuff seems to be, and they are overall better than anything you can get new for the money.
I've seen lots of $200ish repro's online that look really good in the stock photo's but logic tells me that the actual jackets won't look as good.

 

[jeepTj98]

The cut looks better than the new stuff seems to be, and they are overall better than anything you can get new for the money.
I've seen lots of $200ish repro's online that look really good in the stock photo's but logic tells me that the actual jackets won't look as good.

Better than anything coming out of Pakistan in my opinion .. I know the jackets I had were made in USA. Thinner leather but comfortable and well made.

 

[TLW '90]

Better than anything coming out of Pakistan in my opinion .. I know the jackets I had were made in USA. Thinner leather but comfortable and well made.

Maybe 5 star can do something good? but I know nothing about their pricing.

All I really do know is that these 90's Coopers capture that WW2 A2 look well enough to me, they fit like I've seen in period photos, and are easy to find between $75-$200.
I'm sure thhe knits could be better, but they aren't bad at all.

 

[jeepTj98]

Maybe 5 star can do something good? but I know nothing about their pricing.

All I really do know is that these 90's Coopers capture that WW2 A2 look well enough to me, they fit like I've seen in period photos, and are easy to find between $75-$200.
I'm sure thhe knits could be better, but they aren't bad at all.

They are 100 percent better than anything from 5 star.. I would buy used before I would consider them. I did purchase a couple of 5 star jackets a couple yrs ago because I was curious. I immediately sent them back. I mean no disrespect but yeah 90’s coopers way better!

 

[Camel24hrs]

Pardon my ignorance, but what is VLJ? First I'm hearing of that.

Vintage Leather Jackets Forum

 

[Technonut]

AVI Leather (Denmark) makes a few decent repros of original WW2 A-2 contracts at affordable prices: (EDIT: IIRC, the jacket contracts offered are directly patterned from originals, and made for AVI in Pakistan or perhaps India. According to members at VLJ, the quality is great for the $$...)

Shop Authentic Flight Jackets - AVI LEATHER

Creators of authentic flight jackets and leather jackets inspired by the heritage of vintage leather jackets from years past.

www.avileather.com

For example, this Bronco contract for around $350.00 USD in goat:

Bronco A-2 Flight Jacket - Seal Brown Goatskin - AVI LEATHER

• 100% Goatskin • Seal brown colour-matched to originals • Bevelled pockets corners with scalloped flaps • Sleeves with less taper at the wrist • Slightly longer leather hanger strap • Epaulet box-stitching • Cotton lining colour-matched to originals • M-39 triple-marked Talon zipper

www.avileather.com

Or the same Bronco in horsehide for around $400.00 USD:

Bronco A-2 Flight Jacket - Seal Brown Horsehide - AVI LEATHER

Our Bronco A-2 Flight Jacket in Seal Brown Horsehide, is a reproduction of the original contract from WW2. The leather will become more beautiful with age.

www.avileather.com

 

[Edward]

Yeah Stuart sure has a way with words.. lol however I would be interested to know what is not historically correct. I am no expert but other than the leather being so dang thick, I would say it is as close to any good reproduction. Just like your B3, this a2 is built like a tank and is just now showing character like none of my other jackets. My daughter just came back from Beijing. Her mother is Chinese and she always wanted to visit.. they spent some time in Japan too.

Been a long time since I last looked at the details. The ones I saw way back weren't if memory serves contract repros, more 'house' styles. The biggest thing I've seen critiqued about the LW repros has probably been them being "over-engineered", of course. Absolutely not a drawback to them as a garment, though not ideal for the living history side. Horses for courses, as ever. If the distance and additional cost implications didn't make them more than I'm inclined to pay, I'd have been looking seriously at one of their B2s. The B2 is a design I've always appreciated, and only ever heard of done by a handful of Japanese labels (Buzz Rickson did a nice version) and LW. I'd be very keen if Aero did one; somebody asked Ken some years ago if Aero would bring one in, but the word was they didn't see a market for it. I suppose it's the old saw that the B2 never had a war - or, likely more significant internationally, Steve Macqueen - to make it ***y.

Beijing's a great place to be a tourist, especially if you're into the historical sites. Japan I have yet to reach, but one day....

 

[jeepTj98]

Been a long time since I last looked at the details. The ones I saw way back weren't if memory serves contract repros, more 'house' styles. The biggest thing I've seen critiqued about the LW repros has probably been them being "over-engineered", of course. Absolutely not a drawback to them as a garment, though not ideal for the living history side. Horses for courses, as ever. If the distance and additional cost implications didn't make them more than I'm inclined to pay, I'd have been looking seriously at one of their B2s. The B2 is a design I've always appreciated, and only ever heard of done by a handful of Japanese labels (Buzz Rickson did a nice version) and LW. I'd be very keen if Aero did one; somebody asked Ken some years ago if Aero would bring one in, but the word was they didn't see a market for it. I suppose it's the old saw that the B2 never had a war - or, likely more significant internationally, Steve Macqueen - to make it ***y.

Beijing's a great place to be a tourist, especially if you're into the historical sites. Japan I have yet to reach, but one day....

That’s interesting, I’ve never seen the a2 house styles. I’ve learned so much from this forum and find myself anxious for new posts. Lost worlds is one of those makers that I’ve discovered here and I originally wanted the b2 or b3, can’t remember which…. I’ve always loved aero far back as I can remember and of course there are so many others like vanson that make wonderful jackets. I thought once I would get my hands on the aero jackets I wanted, it would stop there. However I am more addicted to purchasing more jackets than ever!

 

[Edward]

I think the cheapest they offer is $600 something.
US WINGS ( formerly cooper ) has offerings in the $400 range, but the sizes seem to just be S M & L and the jackets look overly billowy in the stock photos.
I'm weary of the current cooper stuff, but maybe somebody knows if they're a good buy or not.


If the quality on Cockpit USA ( formerly Avirex) A2's is significantly better or you can get a different leather that you like or something then I'd go for it, but if not I would definitely get a USN saddlery or 90's orange label cooper for 1/3 the price or less.

I payed about $150 shipped for my cooper 2 years ago and couldn't be happier with it.
View attachment 725957
There are a couple deals on Ebay right now, but they may or may not be your size.

Coopers seem to crop up on eBay with great regularity. The main thing to watch out or seems to be which version it is if you want a historical pattern rather than the later USAF version with the side entry pockets and somewhat looser fit. I've seen some very nice ones on eBay in a range of sizes, some with great patches and things on them. Great deal if you're in the US (over here the significant rise in shipping prices in recent years from the US has greatly limited the value of buying from the States for me, unfortunately).

AVI Leather (Denmark) makes a few decent repros of original WW2 A-2 contracts at affordable prices: (EDIT: IIRC, the jacket contracts offered are directly patterned from originals, and made for AVI in Pakistan or perhaps India. According to members at VLJ, the quality is great for the $$...)

http://[URL]https://www.avileather.com/shop/

[/URL]


For example, this Bronco contract for around $350.00 USD in goat:

http://[URL]https://www.avileather.com/product/a2-flight-jacket-seal-brown-bronco/

[/URL]

Or the same Bronco in horsehide for around $400.00 USD:

http://[URL]https://www.avileather.com/product/bronco-a2-flight-jacket-horsehide/

[/URL]

They got quite a lot of attention when they first appeared. I remember there being quite the hoohah about them being very coy about where they were made. There was for a while a seller on ebay selling jackets factory direct from overseas that professed to be the manufacturer who made them for AVI, and radically undercut them on price. No idea of the veracity of the claim though.

Soldier of Fortune in the UK has some ones from Kay Canvas on the website that look nice, but the sizing comes up small for me, and they stop around a 46 (24" p2p).

That’s interesting, I’ve never seen the a2 house styles. I’ve learned so much from this forum and find myself anxious for new posts. Lost worlds is one of those makers that I’ve discovered here and I originally wanted the b2 or b3, can’t remember which…. I’ve always loved aero far back as I can remember and of course there are so many others like vanson that make wonderful jackets. I thought once I would get my hands on the aero jackets I wanted, it would stop there. However I am more addicted to purchasing more jackets than ever!

You'll find very quickly ther'es only one answer to "how many jackets is enough?": "One more." Be warned: we're a bunch of enablers!

 

[Brettafett]

Bit late to the party. Im a flight jacket guy, A-2s and USN types.
Own & owned originals and more repros than I have body parts.
Know all, if not, almost all of the people making these jackets.

VLJ (Vintage Leather Jacket Forum) is a great resource for more specific info on flight jackets, both originals and repros.

Further to the phenomenal link to the Mighty A-2 thread...

Heres a link to report manufactuers

A few signposts to threads about repro makers

Buying a “proper” repro flying jacket is for most people a big, and confusing, step. I've put this thread together with some wise words from other members to highlight some of the most read threads on this subject. It's not meant to be the last word on the subject and probably never could be...

www.vintageleatherjackets.org

 

[jeepTj98]

Bit late to the party. Im a flight jacket guy, A-2s and USN types.
Own & owned originals and more repros than I have body parts.
Know all, if not, almost all of the people making these jackets.

VLJ (Vintage Leather Jacket Forum) is a great resource for more specific info on flight jackets, both originals and repros.

Further to the phenomenal link to the Mighty A-2 thread...

Heres a link to report manufactuers

http://[URL]https://www.vintageleat...ignposts-to-threads-about-repro-makers.32417/

[/URL]

I like it over there..

 

[Brettafett]

Originals are becoming harder and harder to acquire, especially in decent, wearable condition.
Costs have become prohibitive.
Refurbishing them has become an exercise is frustration and expense.
Period correct zippers, hardware and replacement knit has become very difficult to acquire, let alone find someone knowledgable and experienced enough to do a proper job.

Repros are the way to go, unless you fancy yourself as a collector or 'investor'.
If so, auction houses, occassionally Ebay, but beware. A-2s and older flight jacket are often fraught with issues unseen, until in hand then you sit with it.

Repros. Generally, you get what you pay for.
Income cases, there are exceptions.

Top/ high end
Goodwear, best of the best.
Bill Kelso & Eastman stand side by side, each having their pros & cons.
The Japanese brands (Real McCoy's, Buzz Rickson etc) make nice jackets, but they are not near as accurate as the above makers.

Mid range
Gizmo - Chinese brand, new to the scene. Jackets look nice, but hard to get a hold of, hard to communicate, often out of stock.
Aeroleather.
Headwind - But not sure he make jackets anymore.

Budget.
AVI leather - Hell, budget??? Maybe, but they make a great jacket. All of them.
Al their jackets are copied of originals in their collection. So pattern, leather, detailing etc is really good.
Budget is mainly in the leather (authentic, decent quality, but not the same as the mid or top end makers), budget hardware... Repro Talon zippers etc.
Bronco A-2 aside... Their USN M-422a is insanely good, as is their D-1 (yes Ice owned them all)
Again, a lot of original-maker jacket bang for the buck, but not in the same league as a Kelso, Eastman or Goodwear.

For context... Owned a few original A-2s, almost dozen original USN jackets, 40s, 50s to 70s, currently have 4.
Repros. Owned almost a dozen Goodwears (currently have 2), more Eastmans than I can count, (sold them all), had 4 Aeroleather A-2s (all sold) and 6 Bill Kelso (currently have 4, 2 for sale too small)...
And the AVI's
These besides other flight jacket types (B-10, B-15, L-2As etc).

 

[Brettafett]

Im a 40" chest and wear a 42 in original and top end repros mostly.
If you're a 38" and looking for an A-2, I have 2 recent Bill Kelso's that are in the Classifieds section.
These are BRAND NEW and unworn.
Waited a year for them, but they are too small. They are tagged 42, but more like size 40.
[with A-2s, always go one size up from your chest, two if you want to layer or want a classic roomy WW2 fit]

Bill Kelso Dubow 27798 GOATSKIN A-2 flight jacket Size 42 (40-41) NEW with Tags!!!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/177020090851 £800 plus postage PPFF NEW with TAGS & certificate. This has just been received and is 'right out the box'. I am selling it as unworn, although I have tried it on and to take the fit photos. Details: Russet GOATSKIN - To my knowledge, this is the ONLY...

www.thefedoralounge.com

Bill Kelso Dubow 1755 A-2 flight jacket Size 42 (40 or 41) NEW with Tags!!!

£750 plus postage PPFF Size 42 (more like 40 or 41) NEW with TAGS & certificates. This has just been received and is 'right out the box'. I am selling it as unworn, although I have tried it on and to take the fit photos. All details exactly as per originals; Seal Brown Liberty Horsehide Dark...

www.thefedoralounge.com

Cockpit are overpriced and low on the totem as far as authenticity goes.
Above jackets are a bit more $$ than a cockpit, but worlds a part in terms of accuracy, authenticity and originality.

 

[Brettafett]

Look on Ebay for secondhand jackets.
There are always a handful of Eastman's, Aeros and Real McCoy or Buzz jackets.
Secondhand purchases are tricky, unless you know what youre looking at.
Replacing zippers and knits can be a nightmare. Handing over to your local tailor is likely to ruin the jacket, unless it's a budget knock around.
Cleaning, refurbishing... Trust me. Tricky.
I played in this sandpit and I learned a lot, but unless you really want an original, recommend you steer clear.

On the VLJ and here, you can sometimes find a good jacket and the chaps are more likely to help.
Can place a Wanted ad.

If you want to test the A-2 waters, I'd recommend an AVI Bronco A-2.
Its a great jacket, copied off an original Bronco 29191, horsehide or goat etc.
It won't cost you a leg and you can wear the heck out of it, until you decide if the A-2 is for you or not.


O

 

[RDS]

Although not historically accurate Cooper orange label A-2’s can be very good value jackets. As they are pretty common, and not at all rare, there’s no need to overpay as some of the prices being asked are just way too much.
As always, I’d try to get the various measurements before buying and not just rely on the size tag because Cooper A-2’s generally come up short in the body but wide in the shoulders and the fit can be a bit ‘off’

 

[Edward]

Although not historically accurate Cooper orange label A-2’s can be very good value jackets. As they are pretty common, and not at all rare, there’s no need to overpay as some of the prices being asked are just way too much.
As always, I’d try to get the various measurements before buying and not just rely on the size tag because Cooper A-2’s generally come up short in the body but wide in the shoulders and the fit can be a bit ‘off’

Missed a rally nice one last year that went for just about a fiver over my last bid, around £150. Seal goat with a nice couple of AVG leather patches on it.

 

[TLW '90]

Although not historically accurate Cooper orange label A-2’s can be very good value jackets. As they are pretty common, and not at all rare, there’s no need to overpay as some of the prices being asked are just way too much.
As always, I’d try to get the various measurements before buying and not just rely on the size tag because Cooper A-2’s generally come up short in the body but wide in the shoulders and the fit can be a bit ‘off’

They are accurate enough to my eyes, and technically are historically accurate in the way that they were made to spec for the A2's recomission in 1988.

Anyways with that aside you are right about the fit, but keep in mind that there is a current US WINGS cooper orange label which as I understand ( and as they look in stock photos) are the ones that have that bad fit.
In my experience the late 80's-90's orange label coopers with ideal zippers should be better fitting.
Mine seems to fit me great, but I wear a 36 and have always assumed the A2 just isn't great in large sizes.
Maybe not all sizes but I'd definitely expect to find a decent fitting 90's cooper before I'd ever expect to find a more recent cooper that fits well.

I believe turn of the century is when they went to the fit you see today.
One can look at the current orange label and an original orange label to know what to look for, but you can also look for an Ideal zipper since the post 90's coopers went to a YKK.

 

[RDS]

They are accurate enough to my eyes, and technically are historically accurate in the way that they were made to spec for the A2's recomission in 1988.

Anyways with that aside you are right about the fit, but keep in mind that there is a current US WINGS cooper orange label which as I understand ( and as they look in stock photos) are the ones that have that bad fit.
In my experience the late 80's-90's orange label coopers with ideal zippers should be better fitting.
Mine seems to fit me great, but I wear a 36 and have always assumed the A2 just isn't great in large sizes.
Maybe not all sizes but I'd definitely expect to find a decent fitting 90's cooper before I'd ever expect to find a more recent cooper that fits well.

I believe turn of the century is when they went to the fit you see today.
One can look at the current orange label and an original orange label to know what to look for, but you can also look for an Ideal zipper since the post 90's coopers went to a YKK.

By ‘historically accurate’ I meant when generally compared with the style of original WW2 A-2 jackets.
My orange label Cooper jacket was a fairly early one and pre-dated those from US Wings. According to the Cooper Certificate of Authenticity which accompanied it my A-2 was ‘the actual jacket as issued to U.S. Air Force pilots - not a reproduction !’ Anyway, whatever it was the jacket was certainly wide in the shoulders and short in the body and despite having a pretty nice goatskin shell I subsequently sold it.
As others have noted unlike the slimmer fit of wartime style A-2’s the Cooper reincarnation can be looser, baggier or more ‘blousy’ (which might actually be more suitable for the larger body shape of today) but like any other jacket I’d always recommend getting the various measurements, rather than just going by whatever size was on the tag.
Even so, at the right price orange label Cooper A-2’s can still be great ‘bang for buck’ and, helpfully, are also found in a wide range of sizes.