Like everyone is saying it comes down mainly to the position of the collar, as determined by the pattern. If one collar seam is 2 inches higher than another then the back length needs to accommodate this. A fit jacket in the same pattern you are going for is the best bet to get it right.
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What determines back length?
- Thread starter torfjord
- Start date
To measure the collar with the back length I can not understand or does not make sense to me. The sleeves from the middle of the neck hole to the end of the sleeve to measure makes sense, the different shoulder width is thereby calculated with.
dudewuttheheck
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I think part of it is the patterning and the shape of the back and shoulders. I think some jackets sit differently and curve around or don't curve around someone's upper back and shoulders differently. This makes them longer or shorter in effect than the basic measurements suggest.
Basically, a leather jacket is 3d and therefore, a 2d measurement can't tell the full story.
Obviously the collar is the major thing, but I think its a little more than just that.
Basically, a leather jacket is 3d and therefore, a 2d measurement can't tell the full story.
Obviously the collar is the major thing, but I think its a little more than just that.
I think the biggest factor is shoulder slope, if the shoulder slope is big so the arm hole is lower, so you carry the back length more toward your neck and not toward your waist and vice versa.
another factor is probably sleeve rotation, if sleeve is a little bit pre rotated forward for riding purpose then on neutral pose with both arms down on your side the back of the jacket will ride up a bit toward the back of your neck, if the neck hole and collar pattern is not cut to accommodate this it will form a crescent moon crease on the upper back just bellow your collar, and this will also make the back hem curving up and appear shorter.
another factor is probably sleeve rotation, if sleeve is a little bit pre rotated forward for riding purpose then on neutral pose with both arms down on your side the back of the jacket will ride up a bit toward the back of your neck, if the neck hole and collar pattern is not cut to accommodate this it will form a crescent moon crease on the upper back just bellow your collar, and this will also make the back hem curving up and appear shorter.
Canuck Panda
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Aero stock size 42, including collar length is 27.75"
Vanson stock size 42, including collar length is 27.75"
See how a 18" collar vs 20" collar can change the back curve so differently.
Both measure very differently if only measure from collar down.
But the overall fit length is the same.
To get the overall back length. Wear a dress shirt, button up, clip a tape to the back of the dress shirt collar, and take a photo. And whatever your desire back length is, that's the one to go for, but collar included. You'll get your desire length every time, no matter what brand/pattern. I think I posted a photo of this in my Langlitz build because they double checked with me on my length numbers.
This is why in older catalogues they give the overall back length including collar. I was baffled until I came across this. Because every pattern is different from collar down, but all fit the same with the collar included. People also wore dress shirts more often then.
Japanese market jackets are one inch shorter than western market jackets. But their size 42 has the same big neck as the American ones, just one full size slimmer in the chest. Sleeves are also shorter by 1". So tall guys no Japanese jackets for you. Unfortunately.
When western brands does Japanese runs they are also one inch shorter. This is probably why you see a lot of shorter Vanson and Schotts. But if you buy them in the US they're one inch longer. If you are shopping for US jackets in Japan and want US lengths, make sure the seller say the jacket was purchased in the US, not from Japan retailer. Why buy US jackets from Japan, sometimes they have better deals on used stuff.
Vanson stock size 42, including collar length is 27.75"
See how a 18" collar vs 20" collar can change the back curve so differently.
Both measure very differently if only measure from collar down.
But the overall fit length is the same.
To get the overall back length. Wear a dress shirt, button up, clip a tape to the back of the dress shirt collar, and take a photo. And whatever your desire back length is, that's the one to go for, but collar included. You'll get your desire length every time, no matter what brand/pattern. I think I posted a photo of this in my Langlitz build because they double checked with me on my length numbers.
This is why in older catalogues they give the overall back length including collar. I was baffled until I came across this. Because every pattern is different from collar down, but all fit the same with the collar included. People also wore dress shirts more often then.
Japanese market jackets are one inch shorter than western market jackets. But their size 42 has the same big neck as the American ones, just one full size slimmer in the chest. Sleeves are also shorter by 1". So tall guys no Japanese jackets for you. Unfortunately.
When western brands does Japanese runs they are also one inch shorter. This is probably why you see a lot of shorter Vanson and Schotts. But if you buy them in the US they're one inch longer. If you are shopping for US jackets in Japan and want US lengths, make sure the seller say the jacket was purchased in the US, not from Japan retailer. Why buy US jackets from Japan, sometimes they have better deals on used stuff.
Measuring the collar seems illogical to me, unless the collar height is standardized.
Imagine you have a Karl Lagerfeld collar, then your jacket would probably be one inch longer than others, but would still not be longer on the body.
The reverse would be true for a jacket without a collar.
Imagine you have a Karl Lagerfeld collar, then your jacket would probably be one inch longer than others, but would still not be longer on the body.
The reverse would be true for a jacket without a collar.
Hère is an interesting text by wested leather about two different patterns of the Raiders jacket. Both have the same back measurements, but the hero one looks one or two inches longer because of the more backward position of the back of the collar. This is all a pattern matter (check part 4 : the sizing) :
https://wested.com/blogs/news/the-hero-vs-the-standard-raiders-edition
https://wested.com/blogs/news/the-hero-vs-the-standard-raiders-edition
That would be my theory too. If the neck hole is cut out further in the back, then the jacket has a shorter measurement than less cut out.
Was with my 5* Café Racer so. Had the same length as the Aero, but went down further. Aero's neck hole is cut out less wide.
tuanhng614
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It’s still true, isn’t it? (To a certain degree)
Posture will make the back looks shorter or longer even if it’s the same jacket.
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posture determines the whole look of your jacket, a perfectly fine jacket would look creased weirdly across the body or flaring out toward the hem if you are slouching in it, it may look like the jacket needs adjustment or doesn't flatter your figure while actually by just standing a bit straighter all the problems are gone.
I think whatever method is used there should be accompanied with picture on how/where the measuring is done
Canuck Panda
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When measured the vintage Sears Catalogue / Iconic Hercules way, from top of the collar down, my length range is 25" to 30", just covering the belt to covering half of my arse. I slouched forward in posture to get the get my minimum length including collar. Posture does matter, so does bagged out pants, but the linear distance between the top of my dress shirt collar to my waist/arse is constant - the linear "along the curve" distance.
I am a +1 for vintage Sears catalogue measuring way. All above jackets are so very different from each other, I was wearing almost different pants in each fit photo, some slouched some not, but the numbers works. Just like nape sleeve length (dress shirt used to be sold this way, neck diameter, then overall sleeve length from center back to end of cuff)
Interesting side finding, I tried to find a jacket in the 26" length range (include collar) but I can't find one. I'll keep looking...
I am a +1 for vintage Sears catalogue measuring way. All above jackets are so very different from each other, I was wearing almost different pants in each fit photo, some slouched some not, but the numbers works. Just like nape sleeve length (dress shirt used to be sold this way, neck diameter, then overall sleeve length from center back to end of cuff)
Interesting side finding, I tried to find a jacket in the 26" length range (include collar) but I can't find one. I'll keep looking...
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