Five Star Leather Jackets

[KBlake]

Some pictures of Shawn’s current black horsehide Which he describes as
“Horsehide Leather Semi Veg Tanned thickness of hide 1.2mm Drum Dyed Semi Aniline finish”

To me any my limited horsehide handled I would say it compares equally to regular black horsehide from Aero and SB and maybe the Jerky
View attachment 404400 View attachment 404401 View attachment 404402 View attachment 404403 View attachment 404404 View attachment 404405
This is real rain not simulated lol

I have two jackets in this HH both from the past month or so of production and the weight of one of the jackets is significantly heavier. Also there's major variation within the same jacket in terms of grain and texture. It's still their best material imo.

 

[Bahabp100]

My goodness, the black looks good too. Any pics of the whole jacket?

the road master is not my jacket but Shawn’s “sample” replica

 

[KBlake]

I did some tinkering with the shine. Left side coat of vaseline, right side nothing:
View attachment 404260

After the full vaseline treatment front and back:
View attachment 404261
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Compare to Aero's Russet Jerky Horse
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Compare to Lewis Chrome Tan Horsehide brown
View attachment 404264

Will take some photos in daylight tomorrow. Shawn's new horsehide is a pleasant surprise. A wax topcoat from the factory will blurs the lines of what is considered premium.

This might be a dumb question but wouldn't Vaseline make the jacket sticky?

 

[hughesovka]

Finally got everything confirmed with Shawn, looking forward to seeing the good work he and his team do. I just ordered a stock size and had the sleeve length and body length modified slightly, so nothing too crazy

 

[Hobbes1]

Finally got everything confirmed with Shawn, looking forward to seeing the good work he and his team do. I just ordered a stock size and had the sleeve length and body length modified slightly, so nothing too crazy

Good news for you. Good luck!
Is 5* upcharging for these types of tweaks to their stock jackets?

 

[hughesovka]

Good news for you. Good luck!
Is 5* upcharging for these types of tweaks to their stock jackets?

As far as I know, they aren't. No one has said anything to me at least. I just asked for the sleeve and body length to shortened slightly to fit more in line with other jackets I have

 

[Griemersma]

I got uncharged $100 for horsehide, but haven't heard anything about being charged for any of the other minor tweaks I requested (angled pockets and a simplified back yoke).

 

[Canuck Panda]

@Bahabp100 Good man. Your CHP looks awesome.

@Kenneth Blake The amount of Vaseline I used is very small. Like a dab for the entire jacket. Same amount to moisturize my hands I spread out on the entire jacket. I used the sponge pads. It can be misleading and confusing because you probably saw what I did with CHL, that is still under works and it did have a jar of Vaseline. But the horsehide just needs a small dab for the shine. totally different.

@Hobbes1 I think Shawn can imitate Horween's midnight blue CXL the same way he did the pull up for you, just navy blue instead of brown. That's the thing with his operation, he hand dye/paint/wax russet leather crust. Some of the US repro makers do this too, they hand dye their russet leather into seal or brown before cutting and sewing. Must be a military jacket thing. Many moons ago he did some custom top coat for me with his conic goatskin base. It doesn't hurt to ask. I wanted a "arctic issue" leather jacket then. Haha.

The following is my bias opinion on Shawn's new horsehide:
It is worthy. Period.
However, a few things to keep in mind about horsehide:
1) It has both smooth and scrotum grain. And there are healed scars. And there is variance in thickness.

2) Some grains will look looser / tighter than others:

Some people will say that's bad, that's loose grain, that's scar, that's sanded/corrected... blah blah blah. And premium makers panel match blah blah blah. That is only 10% of the truth. The other 90% truth is that the premium makers has enough margin in their pricing to either take the "defective" (it's not, it's just horsehide) jacket back, or offer it at a discounted rate with a different label. I know I am gonna get persecuted for this, but in my experience, all leather, all, have some type of cosmetic work done to the most outer (full/top) grain layer. Flawless full grain leather is as real as flawless (human) skin (head to toe).
When the cutter cuts the panel, he is just trying to avoid the obvious holes and maximize use of each leather skin. Period. In premium shoes manufacturing, there is a guy that examines the incoming leather before it gets to cutting. If he feels they'd be losing money on that batch, they send it back to the supplier. AFAIK none of the jacket makers have that kind of economic leverage over their leather supplier. A pair of premium dress shoes that cost 600 dollars uses 3 square feet of leather. A 600 dollars leather jacket needs at least 35 square feet of leather. I am quite certain the shoe guys pay more for square footage and hence have bigger leverage than the jacket guys.
And I believe this is why horsehide was the original leather jacket material of choice back a century ago. The jacket guys simply couldn't compete with the shoe guys for material, so they had to make lemon into lemonade. And surprise, grit wins, horsehide, although coarser, is much stronger leather than cows. The steer hides were only mass produced later on because of the economic recovery that lead to a boom in beef industry that lead to leather everything from car seats to sofas...etc. I am no historian, but this is how I saw it and understood it.

Back to Shawn's new horsehide. It is worthy (finally) because it is thick enough. The temper is soft and drapes well. I am guessing it is some type of combination tannage. Chrome first to get it that soft, and then veg retan to get that brown core. I had first thought it was dyed through but the more I look at it, veg retan is more economical, and that's how he does his goatskin, I would assume the same for horsehide.
The only thing I would want more from it is a coat of wax. Not just for the shine. But it will also pretty up the coarse grains, giving it a better out of the box experience. That's how Horween does it. Sometimes putting a red lipstick on does the trick. The horsehide is still the same coarse horsehide. But the wax bends the perception of aging. Here is an example of my "beautifully aged CXL", it was smooth mirror shine out of the box, and "morphed" into this fine wine. Shawn's horsehide could use a coat of wax to give better out of box experience.

I feel like every 5star jacket I had, good or bad, has lead up to this point. This new horsehide made me feel better about all the experiment that didn't go so well. It's wax on time!

 

[Bahabp100]

@Bahabp100 Good man. Your CHP looks awesome.

@Kenneth Blake The amount of Vaseline I used is very small. Like a dab for the entire jacket. Same amount to moisturize my hands I spread out on the entire jacket. I used the sponge pads. It can be misleading and confusing because you probably saw what I did with CHL, that is still under works and it did have a jar of Vaseline. But the horsehide just needs a small dab for the shine. totally different.

@Hobbes1 I think Shawn can imitate Horween's midnight blue CXL the same way he did the pull up for you, just navy blue instead of brown. That's the thing with his operation, he hand dye/paint/wax russet leather crust. Some of the US repro makers do this too, they hand dye their russet leather into seal or brown before cutting and sewing. Must be a military jacket thing. Many moons ago he did some custom top coat for me with his conic goatskin base. It doesn't hurt to ask. I wanted a "arctic issue" leather jacket then. Haha.
View attachment 404652

The following is my bias opinion on Shawn's new horsehide:
It is worthy. Period.
However, a few things to keep in mind about horsehide:
1) It has both smooth and scrotum grain. And there are healed scars. And there is variance in thickness.
View attachment 404653
View attachment 404655
2) Some grains will look looser / tighter than others:
View attachment 404654
View attachment 404656

Some people will say that's bad, that's loose grain, that's scar, that's sanded/corrected... blah blah blah. And premium makers panel match blah blah blah. That is only 10% of the truth. The other 90% truth is that the premium makers has enough margin in their pricing to either take the "defective" (it's not, it's just horsehide) jacket back, or offer it at a discounted rate with a different label. I know I am gonna get persecuted for this, but in my experience, all leather, all, have some type of cosmetic work done to the most outer (full/top) grain layer. Flawless full grain leather is as real as flawless (human) skin (head to toe).
When the cutter cuts the panel, he is just trying to avoid the obvious holes and maximize use of each leather skin. Period. In premium shoes manufacturing, there is a guy that examines the incoming leather before it gets to cutting. If he feels they'd be losing money on that batch, they send it back to the supplier. AFAIK none of the jacket makers have that kind of economic leverage over their leather supplier. A pair of premium dress shoes that cost 600 dollars uses 3 square feet of leather. A 600 dollars leather jacket needs at least 35 square feet of leather. I am quite certain the shoe guys pay more for square footage and hence have bigger leverage than the jacket guys.
And I believe this is why horsehide was the original leather jacket material of choice back a century ago. The jacket guys simply couldn't compete with the shoe guys for material, so they had to make lemon into lemonade. And surprise, grit wins, horsehide, although coarser, is much stronger leather than cows. The steer hides were only mass produced later on because of the economic recovery that lead to a boom in beef industry that lead to leather everything from car seats to sofas...etc. I am no historian, but this is how I saw it and understood it.

Back to Shawn's new horsehide. It is worthy (finally) because it is thick enough. The temper is soft and drapes well. I am guessing it is some type of combination tannage. Chrome first to get it that soft, and then veg retan to get that brown core. I had first thought it was dyed through but the more I look at it, veg retan is more economical, and that's how he does his goatskin, I would assume the same for horsehide.
The only thing I would want more from it is a coat of wax. Not just for the shine. But it will also pretty up the coarse grains, giving it a better out of the box experience. That's how Horween does it. Sometimes putting a red lipstick on does the trick. The horsehide is still the same coarse horsehide. But the wax bends the perception of aging. Here is an example of my "beautifully aged CXL", it was smooth mirror shine out of the box, and "morphed" into this fine wine. Shawn's horsehide could use a coat of wax to give better out of box experience.
View attachment 404664
View attachment 404665
View attachment 404666

I feel like every 5star jacket I had, good or bad, has lead up to this point. This new horsehide made me feel better about all the experiment that didn't go so well. It's wax on time!

The LAPD HH - That leather is semi Veg and Semi Aniline But in that jacket we used shiny waxes. Also We have waterproof 2.5 mm Black HH seen in movie below

 

[born113]

waterproof 2.5 mm Black HH

mm? not 2.5oz? Then how much weight?

 

[TheDonEffect]

@Bahabp100 Good man. Your CHP looks awesome.

@Kenneth Blake The amount of Vaseline I used is very small. Like a dab for the entire jacket. Same amount to moisturize my hands I spread out on the entire jacket. I used the sponge pads. It can be misleading and confusing because you probably saw what I did with CHL, that is still under works and it did have a jar of Vaseline. But the horsehide just needs a small dab for the shine. totally different.

@Hobbes1 I think Shawn can imitate Horween's midnight blue CXL the same way he did the pull up for you, just navy blue instead of brown. That's the thing with his operation, he hand dye/paint/wax russet leather crust. Some of the US repro makers do this too, they hand dye their russet leather into seal or brown before cutting and sewing. Must be a military jacket thing. Many moons ago he did some custom top coat for me with his conic goatskin base. It doesn't hurt to ask. I wanted a "arctic issue" leather jacket then. Haha.
View attachment 404652

The following is my bias opinion on Shawn's new horsehide:
It is worthy. Period.
However, a few things to keep in mind about horsehide:
1) It has both smooth and scrotum grain. And there are healed scars. And there is variance in thickness.
View attachment 404653
View attachment 404655
2) Some grains will look looser / tighter than others:
View attachment 404654
View attachment 404656

Some people will say that's bad, that's loose grain, that's scar, that's sanded/corrected... blah blah blah. And premium makers panel match blah blah blah. That is only 10% of the truth. The other 90% truth is that the premium makers has enough margin in their pricing to either take the "defective" (it's not, it's just horsehide) jacket back, or offer it at a discounted rate with a different label. I know I am gonna get persecuted for this, but in my experience, all leather, all, have some type of cosmetic work done to the most outer (full/top) grain layer. Flawless full grain leather is as real as flawless (human) skin (head to toe).
When the cutter cuts the panel, he is just trying to avoid the obvious holes and maximize use of each leather skin. Period. In premium shoes manufacturing, there is a guy that examines the incoming leather before it gets to cutting. If he feels they'd be losing money on that batch, they send it back to the supplier. AFAIK none of the jacket makers have that kind of economic leverage over their leather supplier. A pair of premium dress shoes that cost 600 dollars uses 3 square feet of leather. A 600 dollars leather jacket needs at least 35 square feet of leather. I am quite certain the shoe guys pay more for square footage and hence have bigger leverage than the jacket guys.
And I believe this is why horsehide was the original leather jacket material of choice back a century ago. The jacket guys simply couldn't compete with the shoe guys for material, so they had to make lemon into lemonade. And surprise, grit wins, horsehide, although coarser, is much stronger leather than cows. The steer hides were only mass produced later on because of the economic recovery that lead to a boom in beef industry that lead to leather everything from car seats to sofas...etc. I am no historian, but this is how I saw it and understood it.

Back to Shawn's new horsehide. It is worthy (finally) because it is thick enough. The temper is soft and drapes well. I am guessing it is some type of combination tannage. Chrome first to get it that soft, and then veg retan to get that brown core. I had first thought it was dyed through but the more I look at it, veg retan is more economical, and that's how he does his goatskin, I would assume the same for horsehide.
The only thing I would want more from it is a coat of wax. Not just for the shine. But it will also pretty up the coarse grains, giving it a better out of the box experience. That's how Horween does it. Sometimes putting a red lipstick on does the trick. The horsehide is still the same coarse horsehide. But the wax bends the perception of aging. Here is an example of my "beautifully aged CXL", it was smooth mirror shine out of the box, and "morphed" into this fine wine. Shawn's horsehide could use a coat of wax to give better out of box experience.
View attachment 404664
View attachment 404665
View attachment 404666

I feel like every 5star jacket I had, good or bad, has lead up to this point. This new horsehide made me feel better about all the experiment that didn't go so well. It's wax on time!

You should give Shawn your feedback if you haven't already. I imagine it's an easy addition and may be the very tweak that puts this over the top. A black teacore HH with your feedback may give all the high end leathers anxiety.

 

[Bahabp100]

The LAPD HH - That leather is semi Veg and Semi Aniline But in that jacket we used shiny waxes. Also We have waterproof 2.5 mm Black HH seen in movie below

View attachment 404669

He said that in the video of the waterproof horsehide it’s 2.0 but he can provide up to 2.5. There’s an example of a jacket made of it on his FB announce page

 

[ton312]

He said that in the video of the waterproof horsehide it’s 2.0 but he can provide up to 2.5. There’s an example of a jacket made of it on his FB announce page

Interesting. Shawn told me this leather was not economically feasible to offer. Too expensive to source. That jacket was a one off.

 

[Canuck Panda]

I think Shawn developed the new horsehide for his A2 customers and that's why its matte not shiny. It is just an Aero Jerky copy using semi gloss paint instead of gloss paint. I doubt he will make new runs using gloss paint just for his civilian customers. But it is not hard for him to coat it with wax at the factory. I've seen him do it on his black goatskin many pages back.
Aero jerky is dyed "red core" before paint finish on top. Shawn's jerky is just veg retan "teacore" before paint finish on top. The cross sections on the button holes show it best:

I've also got the waterproof 2mm video this afternoon. This is the only way to show how the leather is. But I didn't get any other info other than the video. 2mm is 5oz. I gotta sleep on this before getting too excited.

Has anyone ever done a real shearling lined trucker with horsehide outer shell? And reversible? Like this but in real horsehide and real shearling.

 

[Bahabp100]

I would like an indigo blue leather suede shearling lined. I’ve asked him several times but no dice. Like this Prada

 

[Bahabp100]

LAPD Jacket made of “Horsehide Leather Semi Veg Tanned thickness of hide 1.2mm Drum Dyed Semi Aniline finish. But in your jacket we used shiny waxes - 5*’s Shawn. The HH was semi/semi . The jacket is shiny but only in certain light. Workshop Pictures by Five Star the jacket is nice and definitely worth the money and time .

 

[Bahabp100]

Interesting. Shawn told me this leather was not economically feasible to offer. Too expensive to source. That jacket was a one off.

I think that Shawn has a hard problem saying NO to anything his customer wants .
Good policy

 

[hughesovka]

What's the average turnaround time for a stock jacket from Five Star these days? I know it used to be a week or so, but I'd have to assume the team is a lot busier these days

 

[Imuricecreamman]

What's the average turnaround time for a stock jacket from Five Star these days? I know it used to be a week or so, but I'd have to assume the team is a lot busier these days

Stock pattern, custom leather and custom collar was 4 days

 

[KBlake]

Stock pattern, custom leather and custom collar was 4 days

My experience is that all the criticism of 5* in terms of communication and delay is unwarranted. I've been blown away with their quick turn around and communication. I'm expecting my 4th jacket from them soon and couldn't be happier with their service and product. I plan to order a 5th before their prices (inevitably) go up.