New Goodwear Prices

[paulgt3]

As someone already said, its about natural supply and demand. John Tried like
I said, a year ago to expand output, but he couldnt get the trained help he needed
to keep up the standards that drove into the business in the first place,
and we would have received lesser jackets for the same price. That would have driven
John nuts, so he raised prices. Its the only tool outside of what he tried to control
demand. I was talking to him the other nite at Midnite PST and he signed off by
saying "Off to Sew some more!!!" So you know he is sewing like 7 days 365 days a year.
So either he raises prices to ease demand or
put out a lower quality jacket and thats not in his DNA. You can get a lesser A2
faster, and you can get a Corvette instead of a 911, they accomplish the same
goal but do it in different ways and with different levels of quality. The Corvette is
$50K less.

 

[Smithy]

Maybe he should just raise prices to an even $3,000 (in line with the insane price of some Japanese jacket makers) to REALLY perfect his business model? 

Well it's his business and for that reason he can do what he bloody well likes. He's not a charity after all.

I think he's been rather wise to do what he's done. He's pretty much a one man band and it must be incredibly daunting and not the least, stressful, to have 150 jackets in the waiting line that he has to get out over the next year or so. Add to that all the emails, phonecalls regarding these jackets and customers asking questions, tweaking sizing, etc, and added to communications from new, prospective customers and I'd say John has more than enough on his plate.

And ultimately if he thinks he can lower his workload whilst still maintaining his profit margins by upping the price, I say good on him.

 

[2jakes]

I placed my order/deposit in March 2012 with a scheduled time @ Jan.2013. Was informed last month that
due to machine breakdown in the summer 2012. My wait time would now be late this year. I never checked
on my status as to when my order would be complete because I figured that they were busy enough as it is.
I felt some disappointment in that no notice was given until I called to find out. Frustrated at the time , I
cancelled my order, hoping to recover the $300 deposit I made. The next day my deposit was received.
If you place an order try & keep a check on the progress so you won't be disappointed like I was. My fault
for not doing this. I hope everyone who places their orders have better luck.

 

[thor]

Well it's his business and for that reason he can do what he bloody well likes. He's not a charity after all.

I think he's been rather wise to do what he's done. He's pretty much a one man band and it must be incredibly daunting and not the least, stressful, to have 150 jackets in the waiting line that he has to get out over the next year or so. Add to that all the emails, phonecalls regarding these jackets and customers asking questions, tweaking sizing, etc, and added to communications from new, prospective customers and I'd say John has more than enough on his plate.

And ultimately if he thinks he can lower his workload whilst still maintaining his profit margins by upping the price, I say good on him.

A charity it certainly isn't. If GW is acclaimed as THE best A-2, John could easily boost prices to the Real McCoy levels (2K +) to reflect the status that GW has achieved in the repro market. Somewhat akin to the exotic car market (Bugatti, Maybach, etc) where THE best cars are custom made via special order to select few clientele who wait months for delivery. If you are the best you can charge whatever you want and some will pay (and wait) for the product.

 

[InsOma]

I don't think demand for luxury goods is any higher today than it was in the past. If you have evidence to the contrary, I'd like to hear it. Like I said, the price of an average leather jacket (say, Aero) is around $1000. In inflation-adjusted terms using the price of gold as a yardstick, that price hasn't changed in many decades. Yes, GW charges more, and maybe they get a little bump up because they're a luxury brand, not a more pedestrian brand, and I'm sure the internet helped spread the word, but I repeat: the real price of a leather jacket is unchanged from the past and no amount of internet buzz can change its value.

If I'm wrong and the real price of leather jackets was somewhat lower in the past, I would say it was because the materials that go into horsehide jackets (namely, horsehide) was more plentiful and therefore less expensive even in real terms. Internet hype has nothing to do with it, in my opinion.

Personally, my buying habits and practices have changed significantly with the advent of online forums and researching. I certainly wouldn't own an Aero jacket if it wasn't for the net, I wouldn't even have heard of Aero. The same is true for many if not most of my purchases these days: my coffee devices, my car, electronics, etc. I would probably still be buying these things if the net didn't exist, but the reasons for choosing one product over another would be different, and honestly I think I'd probably be less satisfied and certainly a less informed consumer.

 

[bretron]

I placed my order/deposit in March 2012 with a scheduled time @ Jan.2013. Was informed last month that
due to machine breakdown in the summer 2012. My wait time would now be late this year. I never checked
on my status as to when my order would be complete because I figured that they were busy enough as it is.
I felt some disappointment in that no notice was given until I called to find out. Frustrated at the time , I
cancelled my order, hoping to recover the $300 deposit I made. The next day my deposit was received.
If you place an order try & keep a check on the progress so you won't be disappointed like I was. My fault
for not doing this. I hope everyone who places their orders have better luck.

You should have scalped your "ticket"!!! I'm in the exact same boat having place my deposit the same month, but am cool with it. Just gives me an excuse to buy other jackets! Eg my soon to aquire aviator d pocket from Mr Mark Fisher

 

[paulgt3]

Smithy hit the nail on the head. Not only does he have the stress of the back log, but he answers phone calls and will explain everything, he wont short you for time on the phone thats for sure. From what I can tell he works till all kinds of wee hours of the morning, and handles his website the emails and everything else!! And then gives you a DAMN good product for the money. You can always buy a Ralph Lauren loose copy for $3,000. Its a one man show. But he did TRY to get some help. Its just they didnt have the passion about these pieces of history that he does.

 

[Deleted member 16736]

Personally, my buying habits and practices have changed significantly with the advent of online forums and researching. I certainly wouldn't own an Aero jacket if it wasn't for the net, I wouldn't even have heard of Aero. The same is true for many if not most of my purchases these days: my coffee devices, my car, electronics, etc. I would probably still be buying these things if the net didn't exist, but the reasons for choosing one product over another would be different, and honestly I think I'd probably be less satisfied and certainly a less informed consumer.

In every era, buying decisions have been influenced by advertising and word of mouth. Maybe demand for horsehide jackets has picked up in the past ten years, but the supply has risen to meet it, and the price in real terms is basically the same. People are confusing dollar prices with real prices. The dollar is losing value; jackets aren't appreciating.

 

[Deleted member 16736]

You should have scalped your "ticket"!!! I'm in the exact same boat having place my deposit the same month, but am cool with it. Just gives me an excuse to buy other jackets! Eg my soon to aquire aviator d pocket from Mr Mark Fisher

I want to see this jacket. Please post pics if available. For the record, I ordered a jacket in Jan/Feb 2012 and my jacket will be made early March, as per my last update. So you may be seeing a jacket sooner than that. Keep hope alive.

 

[Smithy]

A charity it certainly isn't. If GW is acclaimed as THE best A-2, John could easily boost prices to the Real McCoy levels (2K +) to reflect the status that GW has achieved in the repro market. Somewhat akin to the exotic car market (Bugatti, Maybach, etc) where THE best cars are custom made via special order to select few clientele who wait months for delivery. If you are the best you can charge whatever you want and some will pay (and wait) for the product.

And that's what he might do in the end. If he can make the same amount of money if not more than he makes now by selling less volume at a higher unit price then it makes sense for him. Less effort for equal or more profit, a no brainer really.

 

[Edward]

Isn't it great, though, in this day and age to see somebody take their niche hobby business and do so well with it? Might be out of my reach, but I find it heartening to see it work.

 

[Smithy]

Isn't it great, though, in this day and age to see somebody take their niche hobby business and do so well with it? Might be out of my reach, but I find it heartening to see it work.

Spot on Edward. I'm not after a stitch perfect A-2 but I think it's great for those after such things that John is there doing his thing.

That he is making money out of it and has the "problem" of too many customers is encouraging. Now he's just tweaking his business model to make it work more efficiently for him.

 

[Aerojoe]

I placed my order/deposit in March 2012 with a scheduled time @ Jan.2013. Was informed last month that due to machine breakdown in the summer 2012. My wait time would now be late this year.

That's almost 2 years. It is crazy. :eusa_doh:

 

[Aerojoe]

And that's what he might do in the end. If he can make the same amount of money if not more than he makes now by selling less volume at a higher unit price then it makes sense for him. Less effort for equal or more profit, a no brainer really.

Yeah, the point of view of the seller is crystal clear, there is no argue about that. Another discussion would be the point of customer or ex-customers. Leaving aside GW product is top-notch, are we willing to drop 1500 and wait one year or more for a jacket?

 

[Smithy]

Yeah, the point of view of the seller is crystal clear, there is no argue about that. Another discussion would be the point of customer or ex-customers. Leaving aside GW product is top-notch, are we willing to drop 1500 and wait one year or more for a jacket?

Well that's what he's doing. He knows if, as he has done, and prices his product at such and such, the punters will line up in droves - to the point where he's ended up with large amounts of orders which stretch out the wait time and affect when he's able to deliver the product. John is now doing what all businesses do, calibrating how high he can set price and offset volume but maintain profit.

Yes he may price out some enthusiasts in doing so but if he is still making a profit and maintaining reasonable growth then he is doing what all businesses strive to do, and that is to survive at a managable level.

I don't know John but from what I know, he's an enthusiast with a huge love for making exceedingly accurate jackets. But he is also running a business and he obviously wants to run it in such a way that it is managable for his time and resources and is delivering a decent profit relevant to the time he puts in.

 

[Dr H]

Yeah, the point of view of the seller is crystal clear, there is no argue about that. Another discussion would be the point of customer or ex-customers. Leaving aside GW product is top-notch, are we willing to drop 1500 and wait one year or more for a jacket?

Plenty of repeat business with many buyers posting on VLJF. So, for a large number the answer is yes. I don't know of many (if any) 'ex customers'.

 

[Fletch]

As someone already said, its about natural supply and demand. John Tried like
I said, a year ago to expand output, but he couldnt get the trained help he needed
to keep up the standards that drove into the business in the first place,
and we would have received lesser jackets for the same price. That would have driven
John nuts, so he raised prices.

Apologies if I've said this before - in this thread anyway - but I can understand quite well if John might not have wanted help. Even trained help. Anyone you could trust with your standards might be someone you couldn't trust not to compete. He really was in a hell of a spot.

 

[Aerojoe]

Smithy, this is the seller's point of view again. I wonder what we customers think about it.

Before the price rise I was considering a GW. Back then the waiting time was a deal breaker for me. Now it is both, waiting time and four figures price. So you can count me out.

 

[nick123]

Would some kind of a "window" work for orders? Perhaps only taking a certain amount of orders per month? But I can see how it could get tricky.

 

[Smithy]

Smithy, this is the seller's point of view again. I wonder what we customers think about it.

But, as mercenary as it sounds, it doesn't really matter what the customers think so long as he is still receiving orders from those customers willing to pay for his product and therefore make it possible for John to be able to grow his business and maintain a reasonable level of profit compared to effort expended.

Welcome to the free market