Freewheelers worth it

[Jasonissm]

Brands do not necessarily do their own pattern work, an experienced pattern maker will do a better job. Often pattern makers work at or for the “factory” themselves (most sewing factories/workshops in Japan are quite small).

I have clothing made for my brand in Japan so I know how I work, but generally brand owners are designers and run the business side of things, i.e. coming up with new designs, running a store/website, fulfilling orders, returns, taking photos to post online, working with stockists, working with designers on tags, collecting vintage clothing for reference and to copy details/patterns, observing the market and keeping up with trends, running social media, etc.

You then get fabric swatches from the mills and find workshops/factories willing to take on an order for your clothing item. This might mean various different workshops as some specialize in just shirts, pants, tees, etc. You give them your drawings/CAD/patterns or they help you with ODM. You sort your tags and supply them, you contact the mill and order the requisite fabric, etc. Sewing makes samples for you and you make adjustments (additional rounds of samples if necessary) before bulk production and in the end you receive the product you wanted that’s then ready to sell.

Thanks for the insight Bryan, I love hearing your thoughts on this as you run your own brand.

I was just writing what I heard online, and from all the misinformation and speculation around Japanese brands especially ones which don't really give out much information online like Freewheelers does (also have heard some people use the words 'design' and 'pattern' interchangeably which I know is wrong, I'm guilty of this myself), I don't trust that as much as what you've said. It's good to hear straight from the source how most brands will generally run it.

Would it be possible they collaborate on pattern grading or would that be something that they give the design to the factory, and they check it based on samples? There are smaller shops which blend designing, pattern grading, and construction like Field Leathers, would it be possible Freewheelers does pattern work as well or unlikely?

It would also make sense why Freewheelers leather jacket patterns are quite good in my opinion as Rainbow Country also does very nice patterns themselves.

 

[RiteStuffBryan]

Thanks for the insight Bryan, I love hearing your thoughts on this as you run your own brand.

I was just writing what I heard online, and from all the misinformation and speculation around Japanese brands especially ones which don't really give out much information online like Freewheelers does (also have heard some people use the words 'design' and 'pattern' interchangeably which I know is wrong, I'm guilty of this myself), I don't trust that as much as what you've said. It's good to hear straight from the source how most brands will generally run it.

Would it be possible they collaborate on pattern grading or would that be something that they give the design to the factory, and they check it based on samples? There are smaller shops which blend designing, pattern grading, and construction like Field Leathers, would it be possible Freewheelers does pattern work as well or unlikely?

It would also make sense why Freewheelers leather jacket patterns are quite good in my opinion as Rainbow Country also does very nice patterns themselves.

Technically you could have an independent pattern maker make the pattern and grading for you; if you’re experienced enough yourself you could also do it. However, the factories are pros at this so when in doubt you can provide your design, a vintage or other garment for reference, and measurements for at least one size. In my case, I’m generally a Medium/40/33 waist, and I know what measurements go into what I want. So I would provide that to the factory and they’d make a sample for me to wear and take photos with, and then we’d also make a sample for the largest size.

I can’t speak for FW, but generally it comes down to finding what you like in a pattern, be it vintage or modern, and measuring every which way until you arrive at what you want. For example, how wide should a shirt pocket really be? Or a collar point? Or a collar stand? Or a cuff? So it can be a process of constant refinement.

 

[jeo]

(also have heard some people use the words 'design' and 'pattern' interchangeably…)

They kind of are interchangeable and that’s why it’s sometimes confusing when talking about these things.

When I reference pattern, it’s more in relation to how the jacket fits.

When I reference design, it’s more about the placement, size, angles etc..of all the different elements.

But the pattern itself is a design and dictates the placement, size, angles etc…

And someone please correct me if I’m wrong, but let’s take the “D” on a d pocket jacket for example. The pattern for that jacket will have a stencil of that d pocket. That dictates the shape which is part of the design. Pattern will also dictate size and placement which is also part of the design.

So essentially you could use just pattern but like I said it gets confusing.

 

[Jasonissm]

They kind of are interchangeable and that’s why it’s sometimes confusing when talking about these things.

When I reference pattern, it’s more in relation to how the jacket fits.

When I reference design, it’s more about the placement, size, angles etc..of all the different elements.

But the pattern itself is a design and dictates the placement, size, angles etc…

And someone please correct me if I’m wrong, but let’s take the “D” on a d pocket jacket for example. The pattern for that jacket will have a stencil of that d pocket. That dictates the shape which is part of the design. Pattern will also dictate size and placement which is also part of the design.

So essentially you could use just pattern but like I said it gets confusing.

Thanks for clearing that up Jeo, I'm learning so much from this thread!

I see they are not exactly the same, but very interconnected when discussing how it affects the end product.

 

[TheDonEffect]

Reading through this thread, I suppose the answer depends on how you value authenticity vs. elevated quality. Fit and therefore pattern/design and style is subjective as everyone's body and taste is different, the only constants for reference then becomes material and workmanship quality. I think most will agree materials are top notch, and workmanship is to the point of fault. So I suppose the answer then is yes?

 

[jeo]

Reading through this thread, I suppose the answer depends on how you value authenticity vs. elevated quality. Fit and therefore pattern/design and style is subjective as everyone's body and taste is different, the only constants for reference then becomes material and workmanship quality. I think most will agree materials are top notch, and workmanship is to the point of fault. So I suppose the answer then is yes?

These discussions have been rehashed time and time again since the dawn of TFL and I guess they will continue.

There shouldn't have been any more responses after Carlos's. He summed it up eloquently and concisely.

 

[ton312]

These discussions have been rehashed time and time again since the dawn of TFL and I guess they will continue.

There shouldn't have been any more responses after Carlos's. He summed it up eloquently and concisely.

You’re absolutely right of course but there’s been some interesting perspectives in the thread. At least it didn’t go to Hell in a hand basket like so many others have. All that said you are 100% correct. Carlos gave the only real answer, and did so like an old pro.

 

[jeo]

@ton312 Always good for an entertaining discussion, no doubt. Glad it didn't turn into a shitshow. Only reason I even responded was to mirror what he said but more so to give what I hoped would be helpful feedback regarding the model the op inquired about since it's pretty rare.

 

[MrProper]

Thanks for clearing that up Jeo, I'm learning so much from this thread!

I see they are not exactly the same, but very interconnected when discussing how it affects the end product.

In my definition, the design of a jacket is the WHAT and the pattern is the HOW.

 

[jeo]

In my definition, the design of a jacket is the WHAT and the pattern is the HOW.

I like that. Nicely put.

 

[torfjord]

Meanwhile OP hasn’t been seen for a while. I bet he’s out there like this

 

[Kevin O'Sullivan]

I feel like (some of the) Freewheelers jackets are too perfect, they're over-engineered. The Japanese use fancy construction techniques that make a jacket look 'cleaner' but by doing so they take the character out of the jacket.

Maybe other people won't notice these subtle differences and even if they did they might not care, but for me this is the reason why I don't wear my FW jacket all that much. I feel like it lacks character.

Their Peters and Leathertogs repros are really good though. They did a terrific job reproducing the original fits while incorporating all their elaborate details, including true to original construction techniques.

View attachment 499069
FL vs FW

On the right it shows they used the 'butterfly' technique to flatten the halfbelt seam. Too fancy for a workwear style jacket imo.

This is late but the amount of knowledge on this forum blows my mind sometimes.

This post was a prime example.

 

[Rgcards]

I have 3. I wish I had ,3 schott/ aero and 6000 dollars instead

 

[Rgcards]

Honestly, I got up in the hype. The truth is : these are leather jackets. Not museum pieces, jewelry or science projects. Put them on. Wear them out. Live a good life. Talk to a friend. Throw the jackets on the sofa and play with your dog. Tell your kids your proud of them. Don't count stitches or measure seams. Instead look in the mirror and say " I look marvelous" in my awesome jacket. Even if it's a Pakistan mall jacket. Wear it the right way and you will look marvelous

 

[dudewuttheheck]

I still love beautiful stitch work, but pattern and fit above all else. At the end of the day, the whole outfit matters most IMO.

If you are well dressed and you like your fit, then you'll be more confident and happier. At that point, it doesn't matter how beautiful up close your jacket is. Not only will nobody else care, but you won't care either. It's telling that after owning at least 10 Freewheelers jackets, the only one I still have is by far the worst made. I don't care though because it fits well.

Ironically, I just said the exact opposite sentiment in the Himel thread.

I still think that overall, Freewheelers makes the prettiest jackets of all in terms of construction and I personally do still see value in that. Plus, their patterns are also really good overall IMO. In fact, I'd say they're easily the beat in Japan and some of the better patterns overall.

They also go all out on materials too. You could blindfold me and I could easily tell a Freewheelers jacket from a Mccoys jacket or most other brands for that matter based on materials alone.

They're quite expensive though and at this point with yet another price hike, I'm not sure how worth it they are overall. I don't regret any of my Freewheelers jackets, especially because they hold their value extremely well.

That said, I'm not looking for anymore right now. Vintage is cooler and @regius is about to make me a jacket that I would never be able to dream of from Freewheelers.

I'm still a huge fanboy though. I don't think thats ever going to change

 

[red devil]

The one freewheelers jacket that fit me the best was one of the most fun ones in my eyes

This is definitely a jacket I keep because of how unique it is both from the pattern, a reprduction of an East West jacket and the purple bullhide

 

[Blackadder]

Honestly, I got up in the hype. The truth is : these are leather jackets. Not museum pieces, jewelry or science projects. Put them on. Wear them out. Live a good life. Talk to a friend. Throw the jackets on the sofa and play with your dog. Tell your kids your proud of them. Don't count stitches or measure seams. Instead look in the mirror and say " I look marvelous" in my awesome jacket. Even if it's a Pakistan mall jacket. Wear it the right way and you will look marvelous.

Often times, we come back to this minimalist approach but if that should hold the ultimate truth then every “sensible” man would be buying Grenson and Meermin shoes and those who opt for John Lobb and Edward Green are after the hype.

 

[Tom71]

The one freewheelers jacket that fit me the best was one of the most fun ones in my eyes

This is definitely a jacket I keep because of how unique it is both from the pattern, a reprduction of an East West jacket and the purple bullhide

Well, that’s one FWs that’s „worth it“ for sure!

 

[Rgcards]

Honestly, I got up in the hype. The truth is : these are leather jackets. Not museum pieces, jewelry or science projects. Put them on. Wear them out. Live a good life. Talk to a friend. Throw the jackets on the sofa and play with your dog. Tell your kids your proud of them. Don't count stitches or measure seams. Instead look in the mirror and say " I look marvelous" in my awesome jacket. Even if it's a Pakistan mall jacket. Wear it the right way and you will look marvelous

 

[Damon141]

So many people say they can feel the difference between the Freewheelers shinki versus other manufacturers. This goes for people focused on Japanese clothing in general and even guys like 58panhead which from his collection is clearly open to any leather from any maker.

I hope I get the chance to handle these different leathers one day do I can feel what they talk about