Ebay Hats: Victories, Defeats, Gripes & Items of Interest

[DrSpeed]

The last one mentioned (2 posts back) is very badly mis-sold as 1950s. No way. Classic styling, though, which is a plus.

The Stetson that fetched >$300 is well worth it, i would say. That is an uncommon hat. In uncommon size. Very beautiful, and Very very rare.

bk

I guess you're talking about mine. I just bought it because I liked its looks, and I'm surely not disappointed, it's a very nice hat. What would your guess be about it's date of birth?

http://cgi.ebay.nl/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=250247343932&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=015

 

[Alon]

Id love to know who got this one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270240522541&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=017

I would have paid much more but forgot about the auction and got home when it was too late. Curses!

 

[BellyTank]

What do you guys reckon? I went for a cheap-o, $15 BIN, version (though it looks WWII original) to see if this style of hat suits me. If it does i'll get a better one. The "crusher" cap. This was the only photo in the listing.

bk

Baron-

This is a US Army NCO version. Wartime, or postwar- you'll find out when you receive it- quartermaster label.
A "crusher" is purpose built to be crushed(there were several famous makes/brands, wartime), the body of the cap is probably cut differently and made without any in-built, or removable stiffening devices, the headband and sweat are soft and the bill is usually made from very pliable leather and perhaps, made from one thickness. A crusher should be able to "roll up and go in a pocket". The cap body on yours should be(maybe) removable(attached to the stiff headband)- if you wanted to change the look, away from what it IS, you could dye it. I have a spare, NOS(1946) body from a similar, wool serge, OD US Army cap, which I'm very tempted to dye black.

In the thread with images from the Griffith Park get-together, there's a guy sporting a similar military cap (stripie T-shirt and vintage jeans)with much crush and Brando-ism.

B
T

 

[feltfan]

The last one mentioned (2 posts back) is very badly mis-sold as 1950s. No way. Classic styling, though, which is a plus.

Yeah, no earlier than 80s with that liner.

The Stetson that fetched >$300 is well worth it, i would say. That is an uncommon hat. In uncommon size. Very beautiful, and Very very rare.

Do you refer to this hat?
http://cgi.ebay.com/MENS-ROYAL-STETSON-WHIPPET-HAT-W-BOX-FEDORA-HAT-VTG_W0QQitemZ370055107267QQihZ024QQcategoryZ14065QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
I'm not sure what's so rare about a 7 1/4 brown Whippet that isn't
even Royal De Luxe? The sweat and reed look worn, there's ink
writing on the liner. The liner looks to have plastic, so it's relatively
late manufacture. I'm often the guy posting to say a hat was
worth it, but this one is certainly not a bargain.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

No, this one:

[URL="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180246174452"]http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=180246174452[/URL]

7 3/8, Royal Deluxe, nice colour, great condition, very nice, and not common edge binding.

bk

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Baron-

This is a US Army NCO version. Wartime, or postwar- you'll find out when you receive it- quartermaster label.
A "crusher" is purpose built to be crushed(there were several famous makes/brands, wartime), the body of the cap is probably cut differently and made without any in-built, or removable stiffening devices, the headband and sweat are soft and the bill is usually made from very pliable leather and perhaps, made from one thickness. A crusher should be able to "roll up and go in a pocket". The cap body on yours should be(maybe) removable(attached to the stiff headband)- if you wanted to change the look, away from what it IS, you could dye it. I have a spare, NOS(1946) body from a similar, wool serge, OD US Army cap, which I'm very tempted to dye black.

In the thread with images from the Griffith Park get-together, there's a guy sporting a similar military cap (stripie T-shirt and vintage jeans)with much crush and Brando-ism.

B
T

Ah, thanks for the info. I thought you'd know about it. That Griffith Park guy looks so cool.

bk

 

[Dinerman]

Id love to know who got this one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=270240522541&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=017

I would have paid much more but forgot about the auction and got home when it was too late. Curses!

Don't worry about it, that one's nothing special, just a basic brown stingy with a diamond bash. That era hat isn't all that uncommon.

 

[Tango Yankee]

Do you refer to this hat?
http://cgi.ebay.com/MENS-ROYAL-STETSON-WHIPPET-HAT-W-BOX-FEDORA-HAT-VTG_W0QQitemZ370055107267QQihZ024QQcategoryZ14065QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

You know, I've been using eBay for a while, but I've never been able to figure out what the acronym "VTG" (as used in the auction title for this action) means. Vintage To Go? Very Tough Guy? Vintage To Good? The eBay acronym list doesn't list it, couldn't find it using acronym finder. Anyone know?

I thought about sending a message to a seller using it to ask, but figured that I may not be the only one in the Lounge wondering so I decided to toss the question out here.

Thanks,
Tom

 

[Lefty]

I don't think it's an acronym, I think it's just a shortening of vintage.

 

[Tango Yankee]

I don't think it's an acronym, I think it's just a shortening of vintage.

Well, that's too obvious! :eusa_doh: I was thinking it was something along the lines of Very Good Condition, that sort of thing.

Thanks!
Tom

 

[Woodfluter]

Exhibit A: Stetson Royal Deluxe

Won this on eBay for $46 US:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=370051020544

A tale of recovery to illustrate how tough those old, good felts really are.

It arrived in a printer paper box that was about 2-1/2 inches thick. No, I'm not kidding. To appreciate the condition of the hat, consider that much of the space inside that poorly-taped box was occupied by many layers of bubble wrap, perhaps placed there to prevent further abuse? Hard to see the logic. I don't think I've ever seen a hat mashed that flat. Don't have any pictures of it in that state...I was too agitated.

Needed the lining resewn, some of the ribbon stitching redone, and of course a thorough steaming and shaping to get it close to open crown condition and then to form new creases. Tried various things but it seemed to want to return to a teardrop, so I helped it do so. I do believe it felt grateful and relieved.

After restoration, it looks like this:











Stats: Brim 2-5/8", open crown 5-5/8", ribbon 2".

Notice the contrasting edge binding thickness on top and bottom of brim - per my recent inquiry on this forum, seems like that's typical of "The Bold Look" introduced in 1948 and perhaps current for a few years thereafter. I'm happy!

- Bill

 

[miss_elise]

well, it sure looks nice now!

 

[Woodfluter]

Exhibit B: Old Borsalino

Won this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=320255552165

An older Borsalino, or at least one with a tan sweatband and appearing to have been made for the Italian market. Felt looked quite substantial in the photos. Question remaining was the size.

Tag appeared to say "6", which was presumably the punti system. But how does that work? Only references I could find anywhere said punti size was circumference divided by pi+1, and a punti 5-1/2 equals US 7-1/4. That requires the circumference measurement to be in inches, not mm or cm. But a punti 6 would be 7-7/8! That can't be right. And I've never seen fractions on tags in pictures of Borsas. So, I presumed the tag sizes indicate eights of an inch over 5; thus punti 5-1/2 would be labeled 4, and 5 on a label would be about 7-3/8, and 6 on the label would be slightly larger than a 7-1/2, which is my size. If true, this scheme makes some sense in economy of numbers because the entire range of common sizes, from US 6-3/4 to 7-7/8, can be expressed with just one digit between 1 and 8.

I received it today and it seemed small. The sweatband was in great condition but wrinkled a bit, indicating possible shrinkage that I could recover. (Strangely, the sweatband has "6-1/2" stamped on the underside.) Steamed and stretched repeatedly and carefully, and it is now a pretty good fit. To do much more might require the attention of a hatmaker.

Very dense but pliable, velour finish and apart from a couple of shallow moth nibbles, in fine condition. Vastly different in feel and quality from newer Borsalinos.











Stats: Brim 2-1/2", open crown height 5-3/8", ribbon binding 1-5/8", tan sweatband 2".

I've read the threads on Borsalino dating. The cloth size tag with "Eulan Bayer" indicates late '50s to early '70s. There is a sticker beneath the sweatband with these numbers etc: A2163 51383 Amiata c. Nera 6.

Now the first two digits of serial numbers are apparently do not indicate the date until after 1975 per Besdor, but other digits have been suggested for older hats. Possibly 1963 from last two digits in first number? The print style for the store at 76 Via Barberini in Rome could fit that period. And was Amiata or Nera a model number? So many questions.

The lining is "type 5" from the first post in the dating thread:
http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=3314&highlight=date
but the punters never came to an agreement about the age of that sort. The top of the liner is encased not by plastic, but some finely woven material (visible with hand lens) that has been made waterproof by some treatment - possibly vinylized? Feels soft.

Not sure what XXXXX meant in Borsalino hats - yes, arbitrary I know, but wonder if it related to Beaver content for them also?

Any observations to enlighten me are welcome!

- Bill

 

[YETI]

missed that one . . .

I'd better start searching in the "other" category.

 

[Stoney]

Woodfluter,

Nice score on those two lids. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap


I just picked up this Knox Forty on ofas for $64.99 BIN.
The color is supposed to be a beige or tan with a brown ribbon.I could not resist it.

It looks to be nearly pristine. Hopefully there will be no moth holes or other damage when it arrives.

 

[AlanC]

Tag appeared to say "6", which was presumably the punti system. But how does that work? Only references I could find anywhere said punti size was circumference divided by pi+1, and a punti 5-1/2 equals US 7-1/4. That requires the circumference measurement to be in inches, not mm or cm. But a punti 6 would be 7-7/8! That can't be right. And I've never seen fractions on tags in pictures of Borsas. So, I presumed the tag sizes indicate eights of an inch over 5; thus punti 5-1/2 would be labeled 4, and 5 on a label would be about 7-3/8, and 6 on the label would be slightly larger than a 7-1/2, which is my size. If true, this scheme makes some sense in economy of numbers because the entire range of common sizes, from US 6-3/4 to 7-7/8, can be expressed with just one digit between 1 and 8.

I received it today and it seemed small.

My understanding has been that 6 punti = 7 3/8 (59), so if it feels a bit small to you then that's probably right.

As I am a 7 3/8 I would be happy to forward my address to you.

 

[Dinerman]

6 is a 7-3/8. The sweatbands are stamped one size larger than the size of the hat.

 

[YETI]

man o man . . .

a Royal Deluxe Stetson for $46 and a Knox Forty for $65? I've paid more to have hats cleaned and repaired!

 

[Rick Blaine]

Woodfluter,

Nice score on those two lids. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap


I just picked up this Knox Forty on ofas for $64.99 BIN.
The color is supposed to be a beige or tan with a brown ribbon.I could not resist it.

It looks to be nearly pristine. Hopefully there will be no moth holes or other damage when it arrives.

Oh to be a 6 7/8...

 

[Woodfluter]

Woodfluter,

Nice score on those two lids. :eusa_clap :eusa_clap

I just picked up this Knox Forty on ofas for $64.99 BIN.
The color is supposed to be a beige or tan with a brown ribbon.I could not resist it.

It looks to be nearly pristine. Hopefully there will be no moth holes or other damage when it arrives.

Stoney, that is a very sharp-looking hat, with the contrasting brown ribbon! Can't see for sure if it's a Cavanagh edge or a binding the same tint as the hat, but regardless this is super sweet! Inside condition looks excellent and you got a great deal.

- Bill