Wearing double detachable collars with ties

[AlmostDecapitatedByMyCollar]

Thanks. Glad it's not just me! I don't have any vintage ties, partly because I have never found what I'm looking for (I'm really after a more Edwardian look). So do you actually knot the tie before fully attaching the collar? Or just try to work out where the knot will finish? Finally, have you every tried the washable version of this collar? I'm wondering whether that might be a better option for this one...

The modern necktie is invented in the early 20's maybe late 10's so you can't really get an "Edwardian tie". The modern necktie was invented by schoolboys who got their boater hatband of their hats and tied it. They wore out very quickly because the tie wasn't sown at a 45 degree angel.

I'm sorry

 

[BlueTrain]

If you're worried about not having the knot of the tie high enough with a stiff collar, many old photos of men wearing such a collar, as in the most recent photo, clearly show that the knot of the tie was always in a low position, relative to the top of the collar, or at least most of the time. I have no idea what the standard of appearance might have been at the time regarding collars and ties. The only rule I've ever seen was that the collar button, or stud in this case, must be covered by the tie.

Other than the difficulty in tying the necktie, and then only with a stiff collar, the only disadvantage might have been that one couldn't casually loosen your collar. I mentioned earlier in the thread that I used to wear detachable collars now and then but I have absolutely no memory of where I got the collar studs, which I assume are somewhere at home in the bottom of a box.

It is indeed a curious thing that men have for the last four or five hundred years, been wearing some form of "neckwear." And alternately, if not, at least fastening the top of the shirt most of the time.

 

[Edward]

Or just adopt the Peaky Blinders look.

I have a Darcy with the (washable) Arundell. Not to omuch of a problem (though stiffer than a regular shirt, certainly). I find bow ties work best with it, tbh. Would also look good for the period look you're after - nice, thin, pointy-ended ones like Darcy also sell.

 

[BlueTrain]

I was watching an old movie recently. It starred Carole Lombard and William Boyd before he became known as Hopalong Cassidy. The plot involves people taking refuge in a rural church when their bus is stuck in a snowstorm. At one point in the movie, one man, who is supposed to be a banker, is seen washing his collar. Very dated; when was the last time any banker rode a bus?

 

[Sdl187]

It seems to be quite impossible to position the knot higher on the collar band - and have it stay there. And looking at period photographs, it seems to have never been possible, either.

Hi, I am new and found this thread by searching on the internet to see if there were others like me in this modern age trying to get stiff collars and modern ties to work as everyday business attire. I am glad to see that the difficulties are being faced by most people and not just me being stupid. It is a relief to read the many tips and tricks which people have offered. So, to add my bit also;


I have a collection of stiff collars and a handful of tunic shirts. Only recently have I been brave enough to try and wear a stiff collar to work on a semi daily basis. This has been a challenge but, I love the look and feel I am the best dressed chap around, so am persevering. I really do understand the questions and troubles on this thread.


The collars I wear are non high collars such as Albany, Arundel, Eton Round, Burlington, Club or Winged if a black tie event such as a Christmas party. The names are dependent on your supplier Budd Piccadilly, Darcy Clothing and Barker being the main ones or funnily enough recently also Amazon..? I know strange. I have T.M Lewin work wear including the tunic shirts and soft silk ties. Double breasted waist coats, forget it that’s another story.


The number one work around on a tight fit stiff collar with modern tie combination is to use a soft silk tie, try and keep away from dog tooth weaves and also unfortunately knitted ones. Then, iron the neck section to within an inch of its life, you need not get this paper thin but make thin enough to get into the collar and be able to push up into the tight gulley. I have been unable to get remotely close for some of my knitted ones but never mind.


In terms of “suit up” I have found the following works for me:


1. Tie tie round neck to get length and knot correct. I find small knot a la Prince of Wales Ascot look works best for tight tie to collar no stud showing (tie above pin)

2. Fit tie into collar with knot pushed closely to the position it will be in, right by the collar on the left “close” (when facing mirror)

3. Ensure there is plenty of loose tie material on the other side, there should be enough to get your head through and some

4. Use large paper clips to hold tie in place fitting tie securely into the tight gulley (same as Cobden mentions, and yep it is the best way to keep it all together before finishing the task)

5. With tie and collar held together and all material hidden button the collar to rear stud of the shirt

6. Next…..don’t laugh! But with a little careful gymnastics put head through open tie collar loop and arms into sleeves (holding shirt above head and slowly dropping down kind of works for me)

7. Button shirt up with stud and then cross collar and button to stud opposite way to shirt (right collar end over left compared to mens shirt fastening with buttons right material over from left (again, when facing mirror))

8. Adjust tie for any slight drop out around the collar then remove paper clips

9. Very gently but firmly tighten tie pulling loose material slowly holding knot in place, watch for twisting as this can be a pain at the end of the process. You should have a sound tight triangle knot with close collar sides and cleanly on/above the stud


Make sure that your knot looks tight and triangular, I use a 1/2 Windsor which is only possible due to ironing and stretching the tie a bit. I reckon this takes less than 10 minutes to perform with prep done night before for paperclips etc. Again even night before is about 5 mins to tie tie and fit to collar and stud back. I know friends who spend longer on their hair ha-ha. I hope this helps anyone who is having difficulty. I must say that I am finding this easier every time I do it and I have performed this now about 6 times over the last 2 weeks. Keep the faith and don’t forget, iron that tie and it should feed nicely back and forth for the tightening phase. Good luck!