Vintage and Childfree

[LizzieMaine]

No need for the fire department. If anyone gets out of line, I'll tell them so.

(Personally, I think our current civilization has passed the point of no return, and we're at most two generations away from a return to out-and-out savagery. But that's just me.)

 

[Lady Day]

Childless in the Golden Era

Is also a thread on this topic. Lets not turn this into a debate of why kids are better or why no kids are better, okay.

Thanks,
LD

 

[David Conwill]

Call the fire department, I smell a flamewar.....

Not at all, Drappa gave a thoughtful and respectful response to my comments. For which I thank her.

I don't necessarily agree with her statement as to whether "childless" ought to imply something is wrong with the non-parent, but I can understand how it could unfortunately be used that way. I can't think of a good middle ground, however between that sense, and the sense of "childfree" which I took to mean "free from the burden of little monsters" - although it seems now that is not what was intended.

-Dave

 

[Drappa]

^Thank you, I also don't see a war of any sort coming up, nor did I mean to offend you. I guess newly coined terms can always be hit or miss, so childfree to some probably has negative connotations, while childless does to others. At least we can all agree that "to each their own" is a good approach in terms of family planning.

 

[David Conwill]

At least we can all agree that "to each their own" is a good approach in terms of family planning.

Amen to that. Kids aren’t for everybody - even some of those who have them.

-Dave

 

[Edward]

I think the only reason I am married is that I found a man who didn't want children! For me it would have been a deal-breaker.

I'm the same. I've declined several offers of relationships in the past few years on the basis that the ladies concerned had not ruled out children.

“Childfree” is an interesting spin on the more-common term “childless”. I tend to think there’s more truth in the latter term, though. For what my daughters have added to my life, no amount of travel or possessions could make up.

I tend to prefer the term "childfree" as I feel it reflects a conscious choice. I have know since I was eighteen - the guts of twenty years ago - that I don't want kids. "Childless" to me implies that I am somehow "missing out" or "deprived" when, in fact, I am not a parent by my own specific choice. It's similar, to my way of thinking, to the way one can be looked down on and/or pitied for being single in one's late thirties. That also I regard as being by choice - I've turned down several options in recent years as I'd rather be in no relationship than the wrong one.

I have a few friends who none-too-subtly indicate that they are “childfree” because they believe it is inappropriate and irresponsible to bring children into an already crowded and increasingly stupid world. I don’t care for that attitude (or the elitism that seems to go with it) one bit - it seems to totally write off humanity’s future. Were I that much of a pessimist, I don’t think I could go on.

That's an attitude for which I have no time either. If folks can afford to have kids and have the patience and desire to raise them well, then they should go for it. The only kind of parent for whom I truly have no time is the one which thinks they are somehow superior, more grown up or more "complete" than those of us who have made an active choice not to have children. It is particularly grating when such people clearly never considered whether they should have kids, but just did it because, well, 'that's what you do at our age' or ' that's what happens when you get married' or whatever. While I'm not generally one to consider the world to have gone to hell in a handcart, one of the unfortunate trends in recent years has been the rise of the notion that having children is a "right", as opposed to something that should be considered very seriously as to whether the people involved have the resources (not solely economic) and desire to do so. Nobody should be made to feel ashamed or in any way odd if they choose not to breed because they simply do not want to.

 

[SheBear74]

Drappa and Dave that was a great read!!! I love when people can actually have a conversation and keep it civil and kind, specially on the interet. lol

 

[sheeplady]

I always thought that "childless" was a term that best applied to those who wanted children that didn't currently have them yet. As in "I am currently childless, but hope to have one someday."

Childfree refers to someone who never wants to have children. That is an active choice, just like wanting to have children.

I'd prefer that people keep their questions about others having children to themselves, unless they are a close friend or family member. You never know when a well meaning question like "When are you going to have children?" is asked to someone who has been trying for a long period or has suffered a series of miscarriages or really wants a child but cannot have one. For people who do not want to have children, it puts them on the defensive, because it assumes they want children. Besides the fact that it is rude to ask personal questions. I'd only start the topic by sharing my own views, and wait for them to share theirs or change the subject, not by asking them a question.

Can anybody tell I've reached the age and the number of years of marriage where I get this question all the time?

 

[zombi]

I always thought that "childless" was a term that best applied to those who wanted children that didn't currently have them yet. As in "I am currently childless, but hope to have one someday."

Childfree refers to someone who never wants to have children. That is an active choice, just like wanting to have children.

This is how I feel as well. I also agree with Dave -- I think 'childless' implies that I am missing out or deprived, which I feel I am not.

I'd prefer that people keep their questions about others having children to themselves, unless they are a close friend or family member. You never know when a well meaning question like "When are you going to have children?" is asked to someone who has been trying for a long period or has suffered a series of miscarriages or really wants a child but cannot have one. For people who do not want to have children, it puts them on the defensive, because it assumes they want children. Besides the fact that it is rude to ask personal questions. I'd only start the topic by sharing my own views, and wait for them to share theirs or change the subject, not by asking them a question.

Can anybody tell I've reached the age and the number of years of marriage where I get this question all the time?

It's so true -- once you get married and/or age, people start asking more and more often!

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

I want five. And my first boy is going to be called Monty.

Personally, I always liked the name Stig. If ever I have a son, that's what I'll name him.

 

[Gracie Lee]

Last night my SO suggested that I should give up my career to be a housewife and raise "him jr." Thank God he was joking That is not to say we do or do not want children... we haven't decided yet. I have friends who have wonderful children that I greatly enjoy spending time with, and others who choose to remain childfree for various reasons, and I love them too. I want to make sure that we make a deliberate decision, whichever direction it takes us.

OT: Zombi - I love how you refer to yourself and the mister as Team Zombi! A truly united front

 

[Bluebird Marsha]

I do occasionally get the "why don't you have any kids?" question. The only thing that makes it not-too-annoying is they usually imply I'd be a good mom, so my vanity is mollified. I like kids a lot, especially when they become teens. Then they can converse and usually don't need diapering, which is a good thing.

I don't mope about not having kids, but it was always a package deal for me. First find the guy who's children I wanted to have, then have the children. I'm vintage that way I'm about out of the age to have kids, so if I find someone who already has them, great. If not, that's great too. Frankly I'm generally a happy person. But I don't inquire into other folks motivations; I'm just pleased my friends have pleasant and seemingly nice kids.

 

[Levallois]

I married a woman that didn't want kids. We currently have two and I wouldn't trade them for anything. Times change and, sometimes, so do people. Also, having my two never really interferes with my hobbies and in some cases makes them more enjoyable.

 

[Penny Dreadful]

I do tend to get on the defensive just because usually it's "when are you" instead of "will you", and I find it annoying that this is so often not considered a choice. I think the "that's just what you do" attitude is a major cause of so many parents who shouldn't be. Though I have no issues at all with answering the question, especially as I've found so many people to be accepting, which makes me so happy and leads to some great conversations. My mom last night said "I thought you would have 5 by now!" and when I told her we wouldn't she not only accepted us without the slightest hesitation, but listed off many of the reasons we already had ourselves. She was so supportive it made me feel closer to her. Though I know that depending on the environment you live in this won't always be the case.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

Hope you don't mind a fella poking his nose in here. I was seeing a girl who was a real sweetheart. We were really hitting it off, until she told me that she didn't want kids or to get married. So we split. Now for me, they're both very important things. It's my next goal in life is to get married and start a family. I'm from the old school that way, my parents always told me to Graduate, get a job, marry, have babies, and that honestly sounds great to me.

I completely don't blame anybody who doesn't want to have kids. It seems more men and women are going that route these days. With population issues and all, it could benefit the country in the future even. I've always thought the 'not wanting kids' state of mind was more prevalent in men than in women, any thoughts on that theory? I can see it, personally, as a lot of guys, at least that I know, seem to wanna stay 17 and wild and free. Personally, that was great when I was 17, but at 20 years old, it feels like it's time for something more. I am thankful to not be like some folks I know who fool around with lotsa girls and have illegitimate children on the way from a few different women.

 

[shazzabanazza]

I have two boys and could not imagine life without them

 

[Isis]

I have a child, but I have never made any correlation to my lifestyle that I wanted children and I don't think there are any. I think the question of having children is up to each and every person to decide on their own and I would think there is a number of reasons, both for and against, that makes you come to a decision.

What I find strange is how different men and women are treated when they say they don't want children. My darling never wanted children and doesn't have any and no one has ever questioned it. But female friends who doesn't want children either, have been told that they "will change their mind when they get older", "are un-natural" or being assumed to suffer from a spouse that "refuse them children" .

 

[swinggal]

I have none either. I never really felt the maternal thing but if I had of stayed with my last long term partner at the time (2005) I'm sure we would have had mybe one. But I never felt compelled and now, well, I'm over 40 and I think it's too old to be having children. It's not a physical thing, it's more of a 'I dont want to be old when my kids are young' thing. I know people that have had kids in thier 50s and I personally think it is selfish. The fater has already had a heart-attack and probabaly wont live to see 60. Those people are doing it for themselves, to fulfil their own wants and needs - not the child's needs, and I really don't like that attitude. She will grow up without a father probably.

Sadly, so many good people who would be great, caring parents (myself included) are the ones who are not breeding. I have many married friends are educated, lovely people who are chosing not to have kids. Hope we don't end up like Idiocrasy!

 

[swinggal]

What I find strange is how different men and women are treated when they say they don't want children. My darling never wanted children and doesn't have any and no one has ever questioned it. But female friends who doesn't want children either, have been told that they "will change their mind when they get older", "are un-natural" or being assumed to suffer from a spouse that "refuse them children" .

I hear you. That has been said to me, not so much these days. But one of my best friends, male and not gay (38), has had a vasectomy recently, because he has never wanted children and is tired of the women he dates constantly lying to him. They say they don't want kids to get to BE with him as he is ALWAYS upfront from day 1 about not wanting children, he gets into a relationship with them, is happy and then they say they 'do want kids'. They all just think he will cave and change his mind.

So, he had enough of having to leave people he loved (which he has done twice) because they changed their mind or hoped he'd change his. He was also very scared that he would be trapped by someone getting pregnant on purpsoe. No chance of that now and he is very happy with his choice and i am proud of him for making the choice. It's amazing though because one of my MALE friends called him selfish. I couldn't beleive it!! Selfish for living his life the way he wants and preventing unwanted preganancy? For being respsonsible? For sticking by his principles? Arrg.

 

[Drappa]

I am so tired of the selfish-exclamations, what a stupendous idea! As if it was selfless to have children somehow, especially those who can't afford them or look after them properly, but then berate me on not wanting to give up my time/freedom/identity/...
It seems to me that it is much more accepted for men to make that choice. My husband hardly ever gets questioned about it, except for pitiful looks because I (apparently little more than a walking uterus to some) won't "give him" children. Since I am looking for work, many people have suggested I should just quit that and have children instead to give me "something to do". I have lost my patience when encoutered with that attitude.
I am in my thirties now, but still get told I will change my mind or that "I haven't experienced life" until I have given birth. I can't imagine what it would be like if I simply couldn't have kids but wanted them. I'd probably burst into tears when confronted with some people's rudeness. As it is I can just shake my head and move on.