The Victory of Communism!

[airfrogusmc]

Again WWII and everyone went back to work derpression over.....What Roosevelt wanted to do without the war; put everyone back to work.

 

[jamespowers]

Again WWII and everyone went back to work derpression over.....What Roosevelt wanted to do without the war; put everyone back to work.

Ok, but Roosevelt's policies had nothing to do with that unless you consider that by simply declaring war it solved everything. So the credit goes to the war and not FDR. [huh]

Regards,

J

 

[airfrogusmc]

If he would have got what he wanted through programs like the WPA and FSA he would have put everyone back to work just like the war did but years earlier. The war proved in that economy it would have worked. Everyone back to work depression over.

 

[jamespowers]

If he would have got what he wanted through programs like the WPA and FSA he would have put everyone back to work just like the war did but years earlier. The war proved in that economy it would have worked. Everyone back to work depression over.

That proves nothing! All it proves is that you wanted it to work. :eusa_doh: The WPA and the FSA were not the war. That war simply proved that the war worked not that a massive public works program would have worked. If those programs worked then why do we still have a war on poverty? We could just roll out those programs and have full employment.
By your logic, I could credit Japan with starting the war with us and ending the depression. :eusa_doh:

Regards,

J

 

[Katt in Hat]

Good Arguments Suffer When Skoolyard Taunts are Resorted to.

Bad Arguments Fare Even Worse.

"NEW STEAL"???

<snip> "Yes but you have to separate the war from the New Steal. The war was in no way part of the New Steal. It was a separate and entirely different animal. The New Steal was not the WAR."

I'm surprised that FDR is not refereed to as "That Man". The term was much used back then by Roosevelt haters.

I would have expected more and better from fine and honourable and intelligent folks.

NYAA, NYAAA, & NYAAAA !!!

 

[Viola]

I'm surprised that FDR is not refereed to as "That Man". The term was much used back then by Roosevelt haters.

I would have expected more and better from fine and honourable and intelligent folks.

NYAA, NYAAA, & NYAAAA !!!

I was trying to keep a nice tone on the conversation but in my own political rantings I tend to call him the Wheeled Satan.

Now, doesn't James look like a great icon of moderation by comparison to me?!

 

[jamespowers]

I was trying to keep a nice tone on the conversation but in my own political rantings I tend to call him the Wheeled Satan.

Now, doesn't James look like a great icon of moderation by comparison to me?!

Heheheheheheh! The New Steal just seemed to work. It was New and its "soak the rich" qualities lead to the Steal. Top income tax rates of 90%=Stealing to me.

Regards,

J

 

[LizzieMaine]

I was trying to keep a nice tone on the conversation but in my own political rantings I tend to call him the Wheeled Satan.

You know, even though you and I are opposite end of the debate here, I think that's about the funniest thing I've read all day. (And I suspect that FDR, who had a wicked sense of humor himself, would have agreed.)

 

[Viola]

You know, even though you and I are opposite end of the debate here, I think that's about the funniest thing I've read all day. (And I suspect that FDR, who had a wicked sense of humor himself, would have agreed.)

Cheers, Lizzie! Mixed drinks for all! lol

 

[Paisley]

A few factors that some people mention in causing or worsening the Depression:

Protectionism, or tariffs and trade barriers. Fewer people to buy from and sell to.

Lack of FDIC insurance--banks could collapse and wipe out your life savings.

Many people were leveraged (i.e., using wealth on paper) to buy stocks in the late 20s. They were wiped out when the stock market collapsed.

I'm not arguing these points, as I'm not an economist. I'm just passing them along.

 

[jamespowers]

Cheers, Lizzie! Mixed drinks for all! lol

Make mine an Old Fashioned---hold the garbage.

Regards,

J

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Cheers, Lizzie! Mixed drinks for all! lol

Absinthes for the both of you!

.

 

[jamespowers]

A few factors that some people mention in causing or worsening the Depression:

Protectionism, or tariffs and trade barriers. Fewer people to buy from and sell to.

Lack of FDIC insurance--banks could collapse and wipe out your life savings.

Many people were leveraged (i.e., using wealth on paper) to buy stocks in the late 20s. They were wiped out when the stock market collapsed.

I'm not arguing these points, as I'm not an economist. I'm just passing them along.

Very astute. Those all kind of contributed to the depression but I think the worst thing invented for the period was the holding company. The pyramid scheme that it set up caused a fall that collapsed many companies when economic troubles set in. The company would sell stock in a hollow shell holding company that was really worth nothing. One company could have several dozen of thses companies under its wing. When the true value came to be called coupled with buying on 100% credit (margin), it created a sublime economic situation that hit all facets of the financial marketplace.
Fortunately that can likely never happen again.

Regards,

J

 

[Katt in Hat]

"Fortunately that can likely never happen again."

Very astute. Those all kind of contributed to the depression but I think the worst thing invented for the period was the holding company. The pyramid scheme that it set up caused a fall that collapsed many companies when economic troubles set in. The company would sell stock in a hollow shell holding company that was really worth nothing. One company could have several dozen of thses companies under its wing. When the true value came to be called coupled with buying on 100% credit (margin), it created a sublime economic situation that hit all facets of the financial marketplace.
Fortunately that can likely never happen again.

Regards,

J

Wanna' know why?

Because of another REFORM enacted as part of The New Deal! Can you say Securities & Exchange Commission (SEC), Kids?

FDR found the worst market manipulater; JFK's father Joseph P.Kennedy Sr., and told him, "You've done your worst, now do your best." These protections stand to this day.

 

[jamespowers]

Wanna' know why?

Because of another REFORM enacted as part of The New Deal! Can you say Securities Exchange Commission (SEC), Kids?

FDR found the worst market manipulater; JFK's father Joseph P.Kennedy Sr., and told him, "You've done your worst, now do your best." These protections stand to this day.

Yes, he did do that. I didn't say everything he did was wrong just 90%. The SEC has its good and bad but I won't go into it here as it is beyond our scope.
Why didn't Ol' Joe tell him to go easy on the money supply too while he was at it?

Regards,

J

 

[Viola]

Wanna' know why?

Because of another REFORM enacted as part of The New Deal! Can you say Securities & Exchange Commission (SEC), Kids?

FDR found the worst market manipulater; JFK's father Joseph P.Kennedy Sr., and told him, "You've done your worst, now do your best." These protections stand to this day.

I guess he should have hired more gangsters to do his economic policy.lol

 

[jamespowers]

I guess he should have hired more gangsters to do his economic policy.lol

lol lol lol lol lol "You are going to stop this depression thing, see?"

Regards,

J

 

[Viola]

lol lol lol lol lol "You are going to stop this depression thing, see?"

Regards,

J

Well he did have Luciano make the NYC docks safe for the Navy... hmm.
I also read a fascinating account on the Mafia assisting with the Italian invasion. Great stuff. I bet Lansky could have sorted out this employment problem. lol

"We're serving as...consultants."

 

[Dixon Cannon]

I guess I'm just too rational...

Oh no, I've been labeled!----by a Randian too!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! That's it for you Dixon!! You know those black helipcopters that you fear so much???? They'll be circling around your house before dawn. Soon, all of your property, your business, your home and all your assets wil be nationalized for the public good. Your children will be forced to attend Bill Clinton Memorial High School, and they will be taught by bisexual interior decorators wearing Che Guevara t shirts and flip flops. All of Ayn Rands books will be used as coloring books for kids suffering from myopia--it won't be a cure but it will help with diagnosis. All of Lincsong's autographed Reagan paraphenalia will be confiscated and added to the community compost pile. That rumour of a new dime that was to bear Reagan's likeness has been changed. It will now bear Hillary Clinton's likeness-------in jogging shorts.
The good news is your new nationalized utility bill is only $10--except for a $900 excise tax added to help crack addicted women stop giving frivolously to charities and katrina victims. jazzbass

I just don't get any of that rant. [huh] I suspect no one else does either!

-dixon cannon

 

[Haversack]

As long as we're dealing with US mythos, (e.g. a society without classes): We also have a tendency towards secular Manicheanism, (i.e. seeing things as either black or white). Hence "winner take all", "you're either with us or against us", Republican or Democrat, etc. This has affected how we have viewed Communism for the past several decades. We have pretty much seen it solely as a large monolithic block as embodied by the former USSR. It was the "Other" which was opposed to all we hold dear, and it set the mold for us for what a Communist government was - centralised, brutal, totalitarian, and brooking no competition.

Of course, this image tends to be correct - for countries where Communism come to power through revolution. On the other hand, there are examples of Communist governments having to compete through the ballot box and operate in pluralist political systems. These have tended to be at the city, provincial and state levels below that of a nation-state. Prime examples here are of several Italian cities and of the Indian state of Kerala. (In fact in India, there are two seperate Communist Parties which compete in elections. - This does not include the Maoists or Nixilites either.) On the whole, these local and state communist governments have tended to be fairly efficient managers given local conditions. Agrarian reform tends to be a common theme. This has actually been a bone of contention for years among some within the Communists Parties in these countries. Should the elected government run by the Communist Party try to alliveate those conditions, which if left unchecked, would naturally lead to the Revolution? (The Revolution being a part of Communism's mythos).

Now this brings up another point. What are the conditions which breed revolution and unrest, and how does a government deal with them? This is probably a question for another day. However, I have always been amused by the Marxists writing around 1900 complaining about how unfair it was that the leading Capitalist-controlled governments were undermining the coming of the Revolution by creating social programs which made people content and happy! Just imagine, you have that flaming liberal and socialist Otto von Bismarck creating the first welfare state...

Haversack.