The "Organic" Trend - do you believe the hype?

[Lady Day]

My two cents, as someone working towards veganism (for solely political/philosophical reasons -- I could care less about my health):

The "green" hype is an absurd farce that I truly, truly despise. A good way to get me hot under the collar is to be on that bandwagon.

Like with most grassroots movements that have now become trends, its all in how its sustained. If this 'trend' gets legislation passed that can help in the long run, and gets people to change habits, then annoying as it may be, I say good for the trend.

Why? Because it's a marketing scheme. To be certified organic isn't hard to achieve, and it doesn't mean that the farmers are treated fairly or are using sustainable, environmentally friendly farming practices. It's a ploy to get you to spend more.

The best set of rules for 'certified organic' came in the early 1990s by OFPA. Major food chains freaked out, and wanted more watered down standards. So the new criteria (most of what has passed with this 'trend' we so speak of) are the standards we see today. You can still find items that use the 1990 standards, but you gotta look. No matter what anyone tells you, a TV dinner cannot be 'organic'.

Its a shame that the term organic has been taken away from its original movement, because it did have a lot of power and identity behind it.

And if you're going to ship your organic food 200 miles to your local health market, you might as well just eat at McDonald's. I live in a farming town, so I have it easy when it comes to buying fresh food, but even if you don't, most cities have a farmers' market. Shop there.
"Organic" is pretty much the new bottled water.

Hence the new, and more conceivable moment that I am more fond of, 'sustainability'. It boils down to how much energy does your food use to get to you. How much waste does it make?

If you can follow the trail of your food to within 200 miles, thats fantastic. Local farmer, local feed for cattle, local cattle, local restaurant gets cattle, local patrons of restaurant and so on and so forth. Its about not shipping the cattle processing off to another state, not shipping the cattle waste to another state, and the balance of size vs need.

A few acres can absorb the waste of a few hundred heads of cattle, not a few thousand. Same with corn, soybean, and most any other mega crop. Diversity in foods, eating things in season, all of this can fold itself into the 'organic' trend, and if you follow farms that do this, most of them are organic.

As someone who is vegan, I tend to believe the more processed the food is, the less it matters if its 'organic' or not.

Stuff thats brown (sugar, flour, rice) is going to be less processed than stuff that is white. Stuff that is darker (blueberries, strawberries, red potatoes, beets, spinach) is going to have more nutritional value than stuff thats lighter (pears, yellow potatoes, iceberg lettuce). Weather that can or can not fit into 'organic', hmm....

But a good rule of thumb to get the 'most' from organic is, if it has a skin/shell you dont eat (avocado, banana, coconut) dont but it organic. Leafy greens, potatoes, carrots, stuff like that, where pesticides get absorbed into the food, if organic is your fancy, go for it.

I will stop talking now, everyone have a nice day

LD

 

[B. F. Socaspi]

Dude. Trader Joe's carries Hansen's Root Beer. I can't keep a six pack of that stuff in the house for more than a couple days. SO GOOD.

I had a "microbrewed" bottle from Trader Joe's. It wasn't the best, wasn't bad, though. I only really end up there for Tofurkey. And their candy bars. Mint chocolate chip candy bars are divine.

If you're ever in PA, the root beer options are awesome. My Dad and I treat it like wine connoisseurs do their wines. The Amish and Pennsylvania Dutch make their own root/birch/ginger beer and it's absolutely awesome. Kutztown has an annual fair where it's heaven. There's also the Kutztown brand of drinks, their birch beer is good.

I'll always settle for a Hank's or Stewart's, though!

 

[SamMarlowPI]

i haven't read the entire thread and i'm not trying to be a jerk but...is this vintage related?

sorry if this is a stupid question...

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

i haven't read the entire thread and i'm not trying to be a jerk but...is this vintage related?

sorry if this is a stupid question...

It was all organic in the golden era, dear. Except the DDT lol

 

[SamMarlowPI]

hmm...

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

hmm...

Sorry, but any thread that Chevalier has posted in has automatic cred. lol

 

[SamMarlowPI]

ok...

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

If you can follow the trail of your food to within 200 miles, thats fantastic. Local farmer, local feed for cattle, local cattle, local restaurant gets cattle, local patrons of restaurant and so on and so forth. Its about not shipping the cattle processing off to another state, not shipping the cattle waste to another state, and the balance of size vs need.

You know LD, I have lived here on long island now for about 3 years, and I can't find a farmer's market that doesn't involve a 50-mile round trip in a car. It's very frustrating. And the only time I've seen my local supermarket label where its food came from was when there was that salmonella scare with tomatoes a few months ago.

If stores would label their produce accurately I would be such a happy camper!

 

[Lady Day]

If stores would label their produce accurately I would be such a happy camper!

Tell me about it!!

Stores, or rather companies dont want to do that, because that creates diversity in the market. If you so love Farmer X's tomatoes, then on reputation alone this person has created a market around their tomatoes, not the place where you buy them. You would follow that Farmer's produce. That freaks grocery stores out because your loyalty isnt to the store, or even the lowest price, but the actual product. lol Only when accountability is evident, do you get that type of micro managing of food locales.

Sorry, this stuff fascinates me, I love learning about how marketing works (or does not work).

LD

 

[Red Diabla]

You know LD, I have lived here on long island now for about 3 years, and I can't find a farmer's market that doesn't involve a 50-mile round trip in a car. It's very frustrating. And the only time I've seen my local supermarket label where its food came from was when there was that salmonella scare with tomatoes a few months ago.

If stores would label their produce accurately I would be such a happy camper!

NO KIDDING.

I found out by reading some of the store-brand labels at one of the local supermarket chains that they get their food from China. CHINA?!?!?!?! For our FOOD??!!??! Doesn't America grow enough of it here?!?!?! Where does the stuff the US farms grow go to?

I mean, I know it's a global economy and all, but why would I buy garlic from China when I live in California and we have Gilroy, for heaven's sake?!?!?

I wonder if people knew more of where their food was from in the supermarkets, they'd change their spending habits more?

RD

 

[Foofoogal]

http://agguide.agronomy.psu.edu/cm/sec8/sec810l.cfm

ok, if anyone can decipher this it tells home much land per animal. I always thought it was no more than 2 large animals per acre.

http://www.localharvest.org/

this looks like a nice site.

 

[Mr. Paladin]

I would love to comment extensively on this thread but won't because it would inevitably violate the "NO POLITICS" rule and be horribly politically incorrect. Therefore I will say but this: I grew up on a ranch where we had our own beef, garden vegetables, and well water; all as organic as it gets. My brothers and I were healthy as horses. For the last 35 years I have lived in the city and bought everything (but my game meat) from a supermarket, non-organic. We eat proper foods, avoid fatty or processed junk and I (we) am still as healthy as a horse.

Organic is hype, marketing, and fear-mongering.

Filtered water is a good idea when the lake turns over though!

 

[LordBest]

Organic is not fear mongering, it is just a term used to describe vegetables and animals grown without chemicals. Unfortunately it is abused by certain parties for their own reasons. I object to that, as it distracts from what organic food is really about, as is illustrated by some people statements here (which I do not mean as a criticism).

 

[Mrs. Merl]

I think that this thread is very relevant to any era. Vegetarianism is very old and has been around since Victorian times. And nutrition, food trends etc. have been a part of every era since. I say it is appropriately "vintage flavored!"

Is anyone familiar with the work of Dr. Weston A. Price? I think many would be interested in the information at the foundation website.http://www.westonaprice.org/ I am not a champion of soy and most of my reasons for this can be found here as well as many other fascinating facts that I have taken into account with the way I eat and live.

I agree with many of the points made here - particularly that the "organic" requirements are poor and that it makes the whole idea less impacting. But I think that if we all continue to ignore where our food comes from and how it is grown, raised, processed - our food may very well kill us one day.

I am a champion of local, sustainable, etc. I am working towards growing as much as I can, keeping my own bees, eventually chickens, etc. I also am a huge fan of heirloom seeds. I really think we are at the brink of either deplorable food options or really getting back to the way it was done "in the old days" - which looking at family farms - I think was a heck of a lot better for everyone (and the environment.)

Okay, my soap box broke.

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

For the last 35 years I have lived in the city and bought everything (but my game meat) from a supermarket, non-organic. We eat proper foods, avoid fatty or processed junk and I (we) am still as healthy as a horse.

Filtered water is a good idea when the lake tuns over though!

The reason I stopped eating meat isn't because I was worried about health of me, it was because I was worried about the health of the animal. I said somewhere above that conventional chickens are often caged for life and stacked on top of each other, pooping on the chickens below with their beaks burned off. Beef is sterilized with chlorine and has a minimum amount feces allowed on the meat when it's sold.

To me, this is gross, but also, what about the animals? Who are the people who decided this was a good idea? Well, I have decided it isn't.

But I would hate to come off as preachy. People eat meat and have forever, that's their choice! And some people don't have a choice, as a McDonald's burger is one of the cheapest ways to eat.

 

[Hemingway Jones]

Most claims of orgainc foods in America are scams, especially those sold in chains. Since the term is relative, the degree to which something is all natural is also relative.

The funny part is, this is mostly an American-centric issue. Stroll through the Pescaria in Venice where fish has been sold for 1,000 years and you will be confronted with the essence of organic! Same with an Italian butcher. A friend of mine in Italy won't buy cheese from the grocer because she makes her own, and the cheese is made in the man's shop!

Over there, you eat food that is much closer to its source. This is why the vegetables are so vividly fllavourful and the meats have a bit of rich earthy gaminess to them. It's an absolutely delight.

Personally, I believe that the long term trend in America will return to locally grown and locally raised out of necessity. If energy prices increase, and despite this reprive in current gas prices, there is no reason to assume the overall trend has been reversed, then it will be no longer economically feasible to import, say tons of grapes from Chile; it will simply be too expensive.

It will then become economically feasible to use more expensive American land for farming and to create more farmed spaces, like Whole Food's proposed plan to turn the roofs of their stores into greenhouses. The same could be done in industrial parks, big box stores, and governmental buildings.

Americans will get used to seasons once again, and not expect that any food is available anytime of the year.

Beef and poultry are genetically engineered food. Through generations of careful breeding or steroid injection or chemical controls they are so far from the source animals as to be unrecognizable. They certainly wouldn't fare in the wild, neither could some of them reproduce. It would be nice if they were treated kinder, but I doubt they are having the existential crisis we are projecting onto them.

Be wary and suspicious of anything you put in your body. If you truly want to be pure, then don't put anything into your mouth that you have not witnessed its handling through the entire delivery process, no matter what it says on the label.

 

[BellyTank]

We have organic produce delivered to our door, weekly.
Local, seasonal produce and other organic veges and fruit from all over Europe.

We appreciate it.

It's a shame that "organic" food regulations aren't universal.

Is Ketchup still classified as a vegetable in the US..?


B
T

 

[Foofoogal]

http://www.localharvest.org/

did anyone take a look at this link. i just found it and now have found 5 places near me to buy fresh.
I don't believe the organic hoopla in the stores are all they are cracked up to be but I do believe fresh food is better. Noone will ever make me believe a fresh free range egg is not better than an older egg from store or fresh tomato, potato, okra, squash or spinach is not better. . I would love to see some of the family farms become lively and viable again.
We used to run behind mosquito trucks as a kid because it had pretty smoke too and my father died from Mesothelioma caused by the asbestos he used to pick up by the armloads.
Chemicals kill.
http://fooddemocracy.wordpress.com/...ozen-12-foodsfood-additives-to-avoid-and-why/
Tons of additives have been added to our food since the 1960s. Puberty setting in earlier and earlier. Higher rates of infertility etc. List goes on and on.
As a person in remission from Graves I avoid the foods that now have tons and tons of salt for no reason at all. I see this a horrendous additive.

 

[Miss_Bella_Hell]

http://www.localharvest.org/

did anyone take a look at this link. i just found it and now have found 5 places near me to buy fresh.

This is a great link and I encourage anyone who wants to buy local to check it out!

Unfortunately there's only one grocery near me and it's a co-op (requires membership). Looks like there are some farmer's markets tho!

 

[Lady Day]

Beef and poultry are genetically engineered food. Through generations of careful breeding or steroid injection or chemical controls they are so far from the source animals as to be unrecognizable. They certainly wouldn't fare in the wild, neither could some of them reproduce. It would be nice if they were treated kinder, but I doubt they are having the existential crisis we are projecting onto them.

It is one thing to say 'My animal needs a shot of medicine once a season because it is sick', but now, the norm is 'My animal needs a shot and medicine in its food to keep it from getting sick'.

You cant compare carful breeding and selection over thousands of years by man to create these domesticated animals to the abrupt disregard of all those lessons learned to play to the glut of 'yield' in mass production.

'Industrializing' the food industry at the start of the late 40s has changed for the worse the way food is 'produced' (not grown or raised) in this country.

Sure there was trial and error there with chemicals and the like. We had a glut of food the world had never seen. The out come of that has yet to be fully measured. Yet in only 50+ years, as opposed to the centuries of farming techniques that have fed the nation, and the world we are seeing the down turn of that industrialization.

So to me, I look at organic as trying to get back to those old ways of how we looked at food. Its the big companies that have taken the word and twisted its meaning to fit their need, or to make it into a 'scam' so people wont invest the time and money into it.

So yeah, in that since, I guess you are right.

LD