The general decline in standards today

[Flipped Lid]

Under-dressing at a funeral isn't just aesthetically inappropriate, it's utterly disrespectful. As in so many situations, common sense should dictate, but as far as I can tell it is still in a coma.

That was the actual point of the rant. Good on ya for scolding your cousin. That took some courage on your part, but since it was a family member, I believe it was entirely appropriate.

 

[LizzieMaine]

You don't know if you've never been taught. That's where the problem lies -- with the culture, not with the individuals. Somebody needs to give the culture a good throttling, not some random schmoe at a funeral.

 

[Flipped Lid]

You don't know if you've never been taught. That's where the problem lies.

That is a good point and one that actually crossed my mind. I have no doubt that it accounts for the lack of manners and good taste that pervades our society. On the other hand, I expect someone in their mid-twenties to know better whether they were properly instructed or not.

 

[sheeplady]

I have to tell you, if I made it out of bed on the day my husband, child, a parent, sibling, or close friend had a funeral I'd consider that a success. I have no idea what I would wear and the idea that people would gossip about what I wore is just... disturbing to me. I think that while it is totally acceptable to be critical of the clothing of the general mass of people at the funeral who are there to support the mourners (and not that close to the deceased), people close to the deceased should be off limits for criticism on that day. I don't care if they are crawling around on the ground in the mud in their pajamas with no shoes, I think one should keep their mouth shut and try to help them by being supportive.

I just think it's really inappropriate to gossip about somebody who is truly grieving and going to go home to an empty house.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

On the other hand, I expect someone in their mid-twenties to know better whether they were properly instructed or not.

I wouldn't. Truly, 'common sense' isn't all that common.

 

[Edward]

I have to tell you, if I made it out of bed on the day my husband, child, a parent, sibling, or close friend had a funeral I'd consider that a success. I have no idea what I would wear and the idea that people would gossip about what I wore is just... disturbing to me. I think that while it is totally acceptable to be critical of the clothing of the general mass of people at the funeral who are there to support the mourners (and not that close to the deceased), people close to the deceased should be off limits for criticism on that day. I don't care if they are crawling around on the ground in the mud in their pajamas with no shoes, I think one should keep their mouth shut and try to help them by being supportive.

I just think it's really inappropriate to gossip about somebody who is truly grieving and going to go home to an empty house.

Agreed entirely.

 

[AtomicEraTom]

Usually, those dressed a bit casually are dressed that way because they're just stopping off to pay an obligated respect and head on to 'better things to do' that day. I lost one of my best friends on September 12, 2010. I was really a mess. All of us who were close to him were still dressed nice. I wasn't even the only one in a jacket. Most who were there in a casual sense did not stay long.

I have to tell you, if I made it out of bed on the day my husband, child, a parent, sibling, or close friend had a funeral I'd consider that a success. I have no idea what I would wear and the idea that people would gossip about what I wore is just... disturbing to me. I think that while it is totally acceptable to be critical of the clothing of the general mass of people at the funeral who are there to support the mourners (and not that close to the deceased), people close to the deceased should be off limits for criticism on that day. I don't care if they are crawling around on the ground in the mud in their pajamas with no shoes, I think one should keep their mouth shut and try to help them by being supportive.

I just think it's really inappropriate to gossip about somebody who is truly grieving and going to go home to an empty house.

 

[Flipped Lid]

I have to tell you, if I made it out of bed on the day my husband, child, a parent, sibling, or close friend had a funeral I'd consider that a success. I have no idea what I would wear and the idea that people would gossip about what I wore is just... disturbing to me. I think that while it is totally acceptable to be critical of the clothing of the general mass of people at the funeral who are there to support the mourners (and not that close to the deceased), people close to the deceased should be off limits for criticism on that day. I don't care if they are crawling around on the ground in the mud in their pajamas with no shoes, I think one should keep their mouth shut and try to help them by being supportive.

I just think it's really inappropriate to gossip about somebody who is truly grieving and going to go home to an empty house.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, at least to an extent. I have lost close family members, four grandparents and a stepfather among others, and several close friends. Even in a state of extreme grief, it never once occurred to me to attend either a wake or a funeral dressed like a bum. In fact, I can recall going out of my way to make sure I was appropriately attired and groomed simply because I knew I'd meeting and greeting many friends and family members over the course of the day. Your mileage may vary.

I certainly would never say or do anything to draw attention to myself or anyone else while attending a funeral for someone outside my immediate family.

 

[rue]

My step-grandmother wore a brightly colored flowered dress to my grandfather's funeral (It wasn't for lack of money for a new dress, they had plenty), which still bothers me to this day. I loved him more than any person on this earth and was devastated beyond belief, but I still managed to wear an appropriate black dress for the occasion and I was only sixteen at the time.

 

[angeljenny]

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, at least to an extent. I have lost close family members, four grandparents and a stepfather among others, and several close friends. Even in a state of extreme grief, it never once occurred to me to attend either a wake or a funeral dressed like a bum. In fact, I can recall going out of my way to make sure I was appropriately attired and groomed simply because I knew I'd meeting and greeting many friends and family members over the course of the day. Your mileage may vary.

I certainly would never say or do anything to draw attention to myself or anyone else while attending a funeral for someone outside my immediate family.

I have attended a few funerals and I wouldn't go in casual clothes ever. It would just feel disrespectful to me. Plus I would probably feel uncomfortable and wound't be paying as much attention as I should be to the funeral and relatives. I guess I would look back and feel like I had let my relative down but I am generally the one that stays strong while people need me. I don't break down until afterwards.

 

[C-dot]

I don't care if they are crawling around on the ground in the mud in their pajamas with no shoes, I think one should keep their mouth shut and try to help them by being supportive.

I agree about gossiping, though I don't believe anybody here had or would whisper about people... They have expressed internal thoughts as far as I can see.

I don't agree about showing up to a funeral in whatever you want just because you are grieving. If your grief is debilitating enough that you cannot get dressed, you ought not to go to a largely public memorial, which is what a funeral is. I would understand someone close to the deceased not showing up for grief (it has happened) before I would understand them showing up a mess. If you're going to go, then compose yourself and show some respect.

You don't know if you've never been taught. That's where the problem lies -- with the culture, not with the individuals. Somebody needs to give the culture a good throttling, not some random schmoe at a funeral.

But where ever do you start? It's awfully tempting to throttle a representative of that culture, but I suppose it would be the same as shooting the messenger.

 

[LizzieMaine]

But where ever do you start? It's awfully tempting to throttle a representative of that culture, but I suppose it would be the same as shooting the messenger.

If enough people say they've had enough, if enough people turn their backs on that culture, maybe it'll change. But don't count on it -- most people think things are just dandy the way they are now, and there's a lot more of them than there are of us. All anyone as an individual can hope to do is to have their own way of life stand as a quiet rebuke to contemporary culture.

 

[Edward]

My step-grandmother wore a brightly colored flowered dress to my grandfather's funeral (It wasn't for lack of money for a new dress, they had plenty), which still bothers me to this day. I loved him more than any person on this earth and was devastated beyond belief, but I still managed to wear an appropriate black dress for the occasion and I was only sixteen at the time.

I have given explicit instructions to friends and family that when I go the wearing of flamboyant colours is to be encouraged. Black only permissible as a style statement, not an indication of mourning. While I'll behave appropriately towards others, of course, personally, I'll be horrified if I look down on my funeral and it's all a parade of showy respect. Give me the contempt I deserve, then flush my ashes down the gents' toilet in the 100 Club on Oxford Street. I'm deadly serious about this.

 

[rue]

I have given explicit instructions to friends and family that when I go the wearing of flamboyant colours is to be encouraged. Black only permissible as a style statement, not an indication of mourning. While I'll behave appropriately towards others, of course, personally, I'll be horrified if I look down on my funeral and it's all a parade of showy respect. Give me the contempt I deserve, then flush my ashes down the gents' toilet in the 100 Club on Oxford Street. I'm deadly serious about this.

Yes, but that is what you want Edward and that's fine, but my grandfather would not have been happy about what she did. Everyone was in black except his wife. It was an example of not showing respect for what he would have wanted. This wasn't exactly a young woman, that might not have known better either. She was in her 70s.

Of course right after the funeral she went on a cruise and bought herself a Rolls..... not exactly the actions of a grieving widow........

 

[rue]

If enough people say they've had enough, if enough people turn their backs on that culture, maybe it'll change. But don't count on it -- most people think things are just dandy the way they are now, and there's a lot more of them than there are of us. All anyone as an individual can hope to do is to have their own way of life stand as a quiet rebuke to contemporary culture.

Exactly.

 

[sheeplady]

I don't agree about showing up to a funeral in whatever you want just because you are grieving. If your grief is debilitating enough that you cannot get dressed, you ought not to go to a largely public memorial, which is what a funeral is. I would understand someone close to the deceased not showing up for grief (it has happened) before I would understand them showing up a mess. If you're going to go, then compose yourself and show some respect.

We're going to have to disagree here. I would never encourage a friend who was a widow not to go to her husband's funeral, just because she is so upset that she can't think straight about getting dressed (which at that point, is the least of her problems). I think that if those close to the deceased are so overcome with grief that they are having a hard time getting their stuff together, that's when I (as a friend, family member, etc. who is a bit removed from the situation) should stand up and do my own duty. If that means going to their closet and pulling out whatever I can find, bringing my own stuff, buying stuff, anything to help them. I'd help them get dressed- as in physically pulling on their clothes- if that is what they needed. I think that's my role: that's when I need to step up.

My role is not to stand around and internally judge people who are obviously not holding it together. If anything, in a situation like that, I should be judging myself because obviously I didn't try to help the person. If I looked at someone who was obviously overcome with grief with anything but sadness, I'd be really upset with myself.

I think that funerals are more about the ones left behind than the dead and they are more for those that are closer to the individual to see support from the community. I don't buy that it's about respect for the dead- it's about respect for the living. Not everyone has somebody there to help them when they lose someone. Funerals are overwhelming and you are so busy planning that often the first time you have time to think about the loss is during and right before and that is when it hits you and leaves you helpless.

 

[Undertow]

I have given explicit instructions to friends and family that when I go the wearing of flamboyant colours is to be encouraged. Black only permissible as a style statement, not an indication of mourning. While I'll behave appropriately towards others, of course, personally, I'll be horrified if I look down on my funeral and it's all a parade of showy respect. Give me the contempt I deserve, then flush my ashes down the gents' toilet in the 100 Club on Oxford Street. I'm deadly serious about this.

Edward, in this regard, you and I are of the same mind. Do with my corpse what you will (preferably burnt and spread or fed to wildlife...or maybe a Viking burial...), but don't fret over me with tears. What is this but an illusion?

Rue, I completely understand your feelings on the floral dress. However, having attended near 100 funerals in my life (yes, I know - everyone that knows me, knows I'm at a funeral once a month), I can say that some folks grieve in different ways. Some celebrate the former's life by wearing bright colors, while others prefer a subdued tone.

In any case, it's the thought that counts. If an individual attends casually and puts no thought towards their dress, you might accuse them. If someone attends purposely dressed in a manner that is respectful to the deceased (and not a center of attention in and of itself), they are probably blameless.

 

[scooter]

Well, you're right about one thing, Sheeplady, we're going to have to disagree. I don't think anyone here has referenced an individual "overcome" with grief, but rather people overcome with a lack of empathy and/or common sense. I just returned from my father-in-law's funeral, and saw some of the very same buffoons mentioned here. It had nothing to do with grief, but everything to do with a complete lack of respect for anyone else. All the excuse making and wearing of blinders in the world won't change that. All that accomplishes is enabling these thoughtless cretins! If someone was in fact overcome with grief, then I would have no problem whatsoever helping them in any way possible, but that is NOT what we are talking about here.

 

[_Nightwing]

Nah, I'm not a lie detector, but I do detect your sarcasm which is too bad if true because I otherwise enjoy this kind of exchange. It would be terribly boring if we all agreed with one another.

No sarcasm I promise.

 

[PrettySquareGal]

No sarcasm I promise.

Now I detect a lie Just kidding. You are likeable.