The general decline in standards today

[sheeplady]

Well, you're right about one thing, Sheeplady, we're going to have to disagree. I don't think anyone here has referenced an individual "overcome" with grief, but rather people overcome with a lack of empathy and/or common sense. I just returned from my father-in-law's funeral, and saw some of the very same buffoons mentioned here. It had nothing to do with grief, but everything to do with a complete lack of respect for anyone else. All the excuse making and wearing of blinders in the world won't change that. All that accomplishes is enabling these thoughtless cretins! If someone was in fact overcome with grief, then I would have no problem whatsoever helping them in any way possible, but that is NOT what we are talking about here.

I think that's fine that we disagree. I just hesitate to judge anyone who is close to the deceased at a funeral, and I know that sometimes outwards appearances are deceiving. I am a bit disturbed by the idea that a loved one of mine could show up obviously out of it at my funeral and be "judged" for looking rumpled, rather than others seeing it as a call for help. My first thought at seeing someone at a funeral (who I know) who is acting strangely or dressed strangely would be "maybe they need some help."

In my first statement, I clarified that it is different for the general mass of attendees who are there to support the close loved ones of the deceased, because obviously they aren't overcome with grief. In fact, I said, "I think that while it is totally acceptable to be critical of the clothing of the general mass of people at the funeral who are there to support the mourners (and not that close to the deceased), people close to the deceased should be off limits for criticism on that day." My second statement was responding to the fact that I think that it is the responsibility of others to care for those who are not able to do so on their own, rather than having them miss an event that they want to attend for support.

Are there people who have always been inappropriate, like in Rue's example? Sure. But their behavior is not specific to funerals and is not just specific to dressing inappropriately. I go to a lot of funerals where I don't know everyone in the decreased's family or close circle of friends. It's not my business to decide if they are rude or just having a hard time. People deal with grief in different ways.

 

[C-dot]

We're going to have to disagree here. I would never encourage a friend who was a widow not to go to her husband's funeral, just because she is so upset that she can't think straight about getting dressed (which at that point, is the least of her problems).

Neither would I! I'm not purporting to say that people who's first priority isn't looking like a million bucks should not go to a loved ones funeral, neither am I saying that I would look upon a distraught person in this situation with disgust. I am simply saying that to show up at anyone's funeral, no matter what your relationship to them is, in extremely casual clothing is disrespectful to the deceased, and to the people who have come to remember them. It's not just my opinion either, its a well established social more.

I'm not going to push the point, I just want to be understood. I believe the subject has been exhausted anyway.

 

[PrettySquareGal]

It's not just my opinion either, its a well established social more..

It's not one social more fits all.

 

[C-dot]

It's not one social more fits all.

I didn't say that.

There doesn't seem to be any way to assert an argument without offending someone, so I give up.

 

[PrettySquareGal]

I didn't say that.

There doesn't seem to be any way to assert an argument without offending someone, so I give up.

I'm not offended.

 

[sheeplady]

I'm not offended either. I'm just having fun.

Someone else said "made an effort" and I think that describes what I would expect of funeral go-ers. (Goers?) However, I expect much less of an effort of those who are closer to the deceased than the general attendees, and I would give those people who may be struggling a total pass on almost anything. What is an "effort" is totally different for these two groups.

Scooter, I'm sorry to hear about your father-in-law passing. I meant to say that before.

 

[Undertow]

Not to play devil's advocate, but of all the families I've known, they do make an attempt to dress well at the funeral of a dear one. Even when they were wearing cardboard in their shoes to block the holes and shirts that didn't fit - they still had the presence of mind to dress accordingly.

For instance, I am close with a family whose young daughter was murdered. We all walked in a daze for months after that, but there wasn't a complete organic degeneration which somehow stopped us all from dressing in funeral attire.

That's not to say there aren't folks so distraught, or so impoverished, that they can't be afforded this one instance to dress casual at a funeral. I don't think anyone would argue that one MUST wear something attractive, or formal, or appropriate no matter the circumstances. I think all on the Lounge has the same opinion, but we're all communicating it from different angles.

It's the thought that counts.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I guess that I might just be kinda grateful that some thought..and decided to show up...even at the last minute..in the middle mowing the yard...or even in the midst of life on the party boat.
Last year I went to my (ex) Father in Laws funeral who always remained a close friend of mine. The new trend seems to be..a video screen set up showing scenes of the deceased's life in pics and film. Some of his family were in formal attire..others quite casual. He always played the guitar and sang with his family as was displayed on video. As his son spoke of the life of his father...the fun and foibles of another imperfect life...someone started softly singing behind me...then across the isle. Family songs. It started with his children...followed by his grandchildren...as the great grand children then joined in harmony. It became not only a celebration of his life...but a celebration of our life with him. All the starched conventional formality was spontaneously left behind along with the faults and struggles we all seem to sometimes endure and remember. At the end..each of his six grown children stood arm and arm singing their Father's song..I think it was titled 'May the Chain Remain Unbroken'. It was such a send off that I'm sure everyone was emotionally drained. I know..I was. However..it was more expressions of joy and tears of gratitude that fortunately didn't seem to allow any concern with how each other looked. Now THAT's a funeral. I think back about that day with happiness. Sure that my father in law and friend would be pleased.
I do see both sides of the funeral respect debate. However..in my case..I would rather you come as you are...and hopefully find something to gladly sing about.

 

[Gregg Axley]

With the change in culture, we get a change in clothing of course or "style."
Style actually went years ago.
I don't want any sagging, I don't want any with designs on them, or hoops (carpenter), I just want normal jeans.
In my line of work, I can't wear dress pants to work, jeans are required.
I could wear dress pants but it would get expensive replacing them every few weeks! LOL

 

[scooter]

Well, you know HD, I agree, THAT was funeral. I told me wife and daughters that I want Norman Greenbaum's "Spirit in the Sky" played at my service. At my father-in-law's funeral, my youngest daughter and I played "Mack the Knife" for mother-in-law as she exited the church. It was "their" song and it made her smile on this wretched day! I have told my family to take the insurance money and have a party, I lived the life I wanted and wanted them to enjoy an "Irish Wake" on me.

Thank you, Sheeplady, for your kindness and consideration. My FIL was vigorous till the last 10 days of his life, and died at 86. Not a bad deal!! If I make 86 I'll be shocked.

As for being offended, I am, DEEPLY!! Just kidding, I very much enjoy this discourse and usually look for new entries in this thread before going elsewhere. It is a source of endless fascination that we can all see the same scenario, and derive such different interpretations. Of course, only one of us can be right, and I apologize, it must be irritating for it to be me with such regularity!! LOL

I was once a soccer referee, and when we got together as a group we would joke that they invented the game so the refs could get together and argue decisions on the field. It was amazing how we could see a play unfold, and have 3 or 4 opinions on how to interpret it among a group. Don't see why it wouldn't work the same in real life!

 

[Patrick Hall]

I do a number of funerals - comes with being a priest in an aging denomination. People's choice of clothing at these liturgies depends much on the family dynamic. Often there are family members who have been estranged, or scapegoated, or whose identity is bound up with scandalizing their loved ones, who show up in an outfit intended to shock or rankle. The same is true for weddings. Funerals and weddings simultaneously bring out the best and worst in our families. All the heroism and dysfunction is on display at once. Oftentimes both the heroism and dysfunction is projected into what people wear: the widow in perfect black dress and veil with flawless hair and makeup, as an expression of strength, to the youngest addiction-prone daughter in see-through blouse and (to steal a term from the late Ms. Winehouse) "f**k-me" pumps.

 

[scooter]

My kinda priest, listening to Amy Winehouse. Talking about family dynamic, while we were in Illinois for FIL's funeral, we were treated to tales of another family's bitter dispute. The husband had passed, but matters were so rancorous between step-mother and children, she sold all his guns knowing his son wanted them, and then had his body exhumed and re-interred elsewhere, without telling his children where! Jeez, talk about anger!! As the Marines say, "Be careful whose toes you step on today, they may be connected to the a$$ you kiss tomorrow!"

 

[SGT Rocket]

I didn't have a clue as to what song I would like at my funeral (we don't really have that in my religion). But, if my friends get together for a drink a while later, I would like them to play "I'll be seeing you." Kind of creepy, but that's the point (sort of a joke with my friends).

 

[Puzzicato]

My great uncle wanted a brass band playing "When the saints go marching in" for his funeral - his wife and son didn't entirely share his sense of humour so they went with his second favourite, some Django Reinhardt.

 

[rue]

My mother wants Sinatra's My Way played at her funeral. It's a fitting song for her too.
I have no idea what I would want played at mine [huh]

 

[LizzieMaine]

I've never really thought about it, but I suppose the most appropriate choice for my funeral tune would be "Let's All Go To The Lobby And Get Ourselves A Treat."

Meanwhile, on the subject of mourning garb, here are some ordinary citizens turned out in 1945 to pay their respects at President Roosevelt's funeral procession. They aren't necessarily dressed in their finest finery, but clearly an effort is being made at projecting an appropriate air of dignity and respect, even without ties, black suits, or mourning dresses.

 

[bil_maxx]

I've never really thought about it, but I suppose the most appropriate choice for my funeral tune would be "Let's All Go To The Lobby And Get Ourselves A Treat."

Meanwhile, on the subject of mourning garb, here are some ordinary citizens turned out in 1945 to pay their respects at President Roosevelt's funeral procession. They aren't necessarily dressed in their finest finery, but clearly an effort is being made at projecting an appropriate air of dignity and respect, even without ties, black suits, or mourning dresses.

And it's not just what they are wearing. You can see by their faces that they are mourning and showing reverence. I can't tell you the number of church weddings and funerals where the clothing was totally inappropriate but the actions of the congregation were totally disrespectful. Talking, taking pictures, texting, drinking from water bottles, etc.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Many...most funerals that I have attended are geared toward 'mourning'...and the fashion...style...or tradition that seems required to go with it. Background music accompaning a somber serman meant to be meaningful..but mannerly subdued for 'grieving'. In contrast is a celebration,possibly,a more personal ceremony of rejoicing the simple friendship and family presence that the deceased offered during his life. An actual informal 'singing' from some of those involved can be quite powerful to capture what this life did mean to them..and even bring a 'togetherness' of some understanding. Where words can stumble and fail...singing can flow and capture what is/was meant during the journey...without complication or the supposed wrongs and rights of those that made the trip. I had never been to a funeral where singing broke out in the audience and others began to follow with the song. It was very tempting to turn around and look at those with bowed heads joining each other and boldly breaking the bounds of the customary. However..as it continued..it began to mean more to me(and I'm sure most others)than any scripted black tie eulogy that is usually waiting in the wings. Appropriate..? Well...it made me realize..that if they have my favorite song taped and playing in the background..how great it would be if some would not be afraid to consider the untraditional possibility of just singing along. I'm almost sure that some of my friends might enjoy joining in the verse " Meaner than a junkyard dog" anyway....!

 

[AtomicEraTom]

I've considered that song, myself.

My dad wants 'Daddy Never Was the Cadillac Kind' by Confederate Railroad played at his. The last verse is about the son at the dad's funeral.
"As they drove him away in that big Cadillac
With a tear in my eye, I had to laugh
'Cause Daddy never was the Cadillac kind
He said some things just glitter and shine
Just this once, I hope Daddy enjoyed the ride
'Cause Daddy never was the Cadillac kind"

My mother wants Sinatra's My Way played at her funeral. It's a fitting song for her too.
I have no idea what I would want played at mine [huh]

 

[SGT Rocket]

I didn't have a clue as to what song I would like at my funeral (we don't really have that in my religion). But, if my friends get together for a drink a while later, I would like them to play "I'll be seeing you." Kind of creepy, but that's the point (sort of a joke with my friends).