The general decline in standards today

[jamespowers]

I don't expect schools to teach kids much in the way of anything, especially not morals.

And you would be absolutely right. Better find a decent private school in the place you are moving to.

 

[vintageTink]

And you would be absolutely right. Better find a decent private school in the place you are moving to.

It's that or homeschooling.

 

[jamespowers]

It's that or homeschooling.

Either one is better.

 

[LizzieMaine]

If you don't learn the difference between right and wrong *before you start school*, it doesn't much matter where you get your formal education. I believe the moral values any of us carry with us thru our lives are the ones we were taught before we were old enough to know we were learning.

 

[jamespowers]

If you don't learn the difference between right and wrong *before you start school*, it doesn't much matter where you get your formal education. I believe the moral values any of us carry with us thru our lives are the ones we were taught before we were old enough to know we were learning.

True but if the schools are actively undermining what you taught them at home then you have a problem. "There is no such thing as right and wrong. There are just gray areas. You can't hurt their feeeeeelings by punishing them. It doesn't matter if they get the right or wrong answer. It is the process that matters and if they feeeeeel good about it..........". Yeah right. No wonder we are falling behind the world in all areas of science and the like----not only declining but NO standards.

 

[Stanley Doble]

Pawnbrokers are supposed to ask for identification and keep records of every customer and transaction. They can be held responsible for receiving stolen goods if they do not comply with the law. They are inspected and their stock checked by the police regularly.

If your city does not have such laws, or they are not enforced, well...

 

[sheeplady]

If you don't learn the difference between right and wrong *before you start school*, it doesn't much matter where you get your formal education. I believe the moral values any of us carry with us thru our lives are the ones we were taught before we were old enough to know we were learning.

Exactly. Since kids are going to get a lot of push back on their beliefs from all directions all throughout their childhood and adulthood, it is what you learn early on that is the most important.

 

[jamespowers]

Pawnbrokers are supposed to ask for identification and keep records of every customer and transaction. They can be held responsible for receiving stolen goods if they do not comply with the law. They are inspected and their stock checked by the police regularly.

If your city does not have such laws, or they are not enforced, well...

Pawnbrokers are also really careful about what they buy because it can be taken from them with no financial compensation if it is proved to be stolen. They don't want to lose money like that.

 

[vintageTink]

Pushback is one thing. Being told you and your parents are stupid and evil for believing certain ways is quite another.
The schools (try to) undermine everything you teach your children. "Oh, your parents taught you such&such because an antiquated book told them so? Your parents are intolerant! They believe in a sky being? Your parents aren't very smart, are they? But you know better, right Jimmy?"
Once they convince them the parents know nothing and are wrong on all counts, they can stuff their heads with all the social engineering they want to.
Because it sure isn't science, math, literature, and English they're putting in their heads.


I have never seen Honey Booboo. I made the mistake one time of leaving it on TLC and this show about cld beauty pageants came on. It was horrid!
I couldn't believe the outfits and heavy makeup and hairstyles these little kids have to wear.

 

[jamespowers]

Pushback is one thing. Being told you and your parents are stupid and evil for believing certain ways is quite another.
The schools (try to) undermine everything you teach your children. "Oh, your parents taught you such&such because an antiquated book told them so? Your parents are intolerant! They believe in a sky being? Your parents aren't very smart, are they? But you know better, right Jimmy?"
Once they convince them the parents know nothing and are wrong on all counts, they can stuff their heads with all the social engineering they want to.
Because it sure isn't science, math, literature, and English they're putting in their heads.


I have never seen Honey Booboo. I made the mistake one time of leaving it on TLC and this show about cld beauty pageants came on. It was horrid!
I couldn't believe the outfits and heavy makeup and hairstyles these little kids have to wear.

Right on all accounts. You really don't know how insidious they are until you send your children there and find out just how bad it is. REALLY bad.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Right on all accounts. You really don't know how insidious they are until you send your children there and find out just how bad it is. REALLY bad.

I reject Dawkinsism and fundamentalism equally, so I'd be up the creek either way. But in all seriousness, I think the point is that no matter where you go in life, someone is going to be trying to indoctrinate you with their views -- snap on the television, listen to the radio, pick up a book or a magazine, go on the internet, listen to music, no matter what it is in the world, there's an agenda behind it. Either somebody's trying to sell you a product, sell you a service, or sell you a philosophy. I think the best thing for a kid is that they learn to apply and stand up for their beliefs in the face of opposition or disagreement as soon as they can -- or they'll end up not really *having* beliefs at all, they just have phrases and slogans they've been taught by rote.

 

[vintageTink]

Exactly. "Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old, he will not depart from it."

 

[dh66]

I have a good friend who teaches history part-time at a local university. He has been unsuccessful in finding a full time position so he decided to go back and take a masters in education so he could teach high school (apparently a masters degree in history qualifies you to teach college but not h.s.) Anyways, when he applied to this program to teach HIGH SCHOOL, he had to pass an exam to prove he could read and comprehend on an 8th grade level????!!!!
This is why my kids are not in public school around here.

Sent from my SGH-T959V using Tapatalk 2

 

[jamespowers]

or they'll end up not really *having* beliefs at all, they just have phrases and slogans they've been taught by rote.

That is exactly what public school is trying to do. You got it.

 

[LizzieMaine]

That is exactly what public school is trying to do. You got it.

I know a lot of kids who learn the same way from their parents, unfortunately -- they teach them the "what" but not the "why." "We're against that. We're for this." "Why?" "Because."

It's like the kids in my day who recited the Pledge of Allegience every morning like it was some kind of incantation, but it never occured to them what it actually meant, Or people who recite The Lord's Prayer and never bother to think about the meaning behind the words, or even how they should be applied in daily life. Or the people who quote their favorite talk-show host or cable TV pundit or whatever without ever thinking beyond the cheap talking points.

It isn't just schools -- it's everywhere.

 

[jamespowers]

I have a good friend who teaches history part-time at a local university. He has been unsuccessful in finding a full time position so he decided to go back and take a masters in education so he could teach high school (apparently a masters degree in history qualifies you to teach college but not h.s.) Anyways, when he applied to this program to teach HIGH SCHOOL, he had to pass an exam to prove he could read and comprehend on an 8th grade level????!!!!
This is why my kids are not in public school around here.

That high eh? I read in a study where they found that the teachers in question could not even pass the tests their students were getting. lol lol
I have several reasons why public schools just don't cut it nowadays but this site has them all down and more:http://citinannies.wordpress.com/nanny-search/why-public-school-sucks/

 

[jamespowers]

I know a lot of kids who learn the same way from their parents, unfortunately -- they teach them the "what" but not the "why." "We're against that. We're for this." "Why?" "Because."

It's like the kids in my day who recited the Pledge of Allegience every morning like it was some kind of incantation, but it never occured to them what it actually meant, Or people who recite The Lord's Prayer and never bother to think about the meaning behind the words, or even how they should be applied in daily life. Or the people who quote their favorite talk-show host or cable TV pundit or whatever without ever thinking beyond the cheap talking points.

It isn't just schools -- it's everywhere.

My boys get the why to all of those things and then the school they go to supports it.

It may not just be the schools but it wasn't always that way. Schools main function years ago was reading writing and arithmetic. They have gone off the rails and have run into: "personal safety, consumer affairs, AIDS education, save-the-environment, family life, study halls, multiculturalism, homeroom, electives, counseling, or sports activities." Less and less time for academics and more time for useless trash. Then we wonder why Johnny can't read or think for himself. lol lol

 

[LizzieMaine]

I think there's a place for things like consumer education -- teaching kids how they're being gulled by advertising and marketing can only become more valuable as "media" becomes more and more pervasive. I'd volunteer to teach that class myself. And AIDS education isn't really much different than the filmstrips about the dangers of VD we saw in hygeine class years ago. And we had environmental education forty years ago, but called it "Earth Science."

What do we need more of is home economics/practical living education or whatever they want to call it now. There is no excuse -- none -- for a grown adult not knowing how to sew on a button, and I'd like to have a dollar for every kid I've had to show how to do that over the years. And *Civics* ought to make a comeback -- not "Problems of Democracy" or whatever they call it, but actual civics: how society functions, how government works at all levels, and the responsibility of the individual to the greater society. Civics was an essential part of the curriciulum up until the '80s, and it needs to be again.

I agree there's way too much emphasis on extracurricular activities as being "important to your college resume" -- for one thing they interfere with kids getting an after-school job, which should be as much a part of growing up as getting a drivers' license.

 

[GHT]

The time zone difference makes it difficult to keep up with the threads sometimes. But having just read the last half dozen pages it has dawned on me that my thinking that the old world and the new world are, well, world's apart, is a nonsense.

The posts on the last six pages about the ins and outs of recycling, of the lack of academic teaching in schools, the promotion of multiculturism and other noneducational agendas, the adulation of new babies, with a you-kneek name, posting a picture of babies first crap, on FaceBook and so much more, I could be on a Brit-site for Brits. There was once a time, when from the teaching of a good work ethic, a good education, the love of family without excluding others, made the English speaking countries, the driving force of the world's economies.

What happened?

 

[jamespowers]

I think there's a place for things like consumer education -- teaching kids how they're being gulled by advertising and marketing can only become more valuable as "media" becomes more and more pervasive. I'd volunteer to teach that class myself. And AIDS education isn't really much different than the filmstrips about the dangers of VD we saw in hygeine class years ago. And we had environmental education forty years ago, but called it "Earth Science."

What do we need more of is home economics/practical living education or whatever they want to call it now. There is no excuse -- none -- for a grown adult not knowing how to sew on a button, and I'd like to have a dollar for every kid I've had to show how to do that over the years. And *Civics* ought to make a comeback -- not "Problems of Democracy" or whatever they call it, but actual civics: how society functions, how government works at all levels, and the responsibility of the individual to the greater society. Civics was an essential part of the curriciulum up until the '80s, and it needs to be again.

I agree there's way too much emphasis on extracurricular activities as being "important to your college resume" -- for one thing they interfere with kids getting an after-school job, which should be as much a part of growing up as getting a drivers' license.

I actually got credit for an after school job I had. It was through a Regional Occupation Program.

Yeah and I really needed to see the VD thing right after lunch.

Earth Science 40 years ago involved Geology and such---real science. Today it is nothing more than recycle indoctrination.

What we REALLY need is a Personal Finance course that would teach children about managing money. You could put the consumer stuff in there.

Civics would be fine as long as they were required to join a civic organization and participate. Civic organizations nowadays are completely in decline and need to be useful again. Americans used to be joiners and community builders but they are not anymore. There are several reasons for it but civics would be a good change.

Then again, I know none of this will ever happen because public schools are a monopoly and have no direct competition so failure can continue and, in fact, breed. :doh: