The Ernest Hemingway Thread

[clementishutin]

I'm not sure why Hemingway like bullfighting, and I'm not sure why I enjoy it either, but it appears to be more fair than deer hunting in that the guy in the arena may be killed by the animal.

 

[Woodtroll]

I grew up on a farm and still raise some stock, and have been a hunter since I was pretty young. But I do not understand the appeal of bull fighting at all, and I don't have any particular fondness for bulls, either.

From the perspective of the animal, would you rather die quickly and relatively peacefully in the woods, or in an oversized pen surrounded by a yelling mob, stabbed and bleeding in multiple places, and mad as all hell at being tormented? Were I to witness a staged bullfight, I'd be rooting for the bull.

 

[Tiki Tom]

It’s 100 years since the publication of Hem’s first work in Paris in 1923. This is a pretty good article that, I think, captures the CURRENT thinking about Hemingway. I guess the thing that makes a person historically enduring is if he left enough material behind to allow for never ending reevaluation. Goes without saying that, since his death, we’ve seen Hemingway go through several reevaluations; from hero figure to much despised macho caricature, to the latest round of sexual ambiguity which —perhaps not surprisingly— also happens to mirror society’s own handwringing. Funny how, looking back, each reevaluation seems to say as much about the then-current thinking of society as it does about Hemingway.

https://lithub.com/what-hemingway-means-in-the-21st-century/

 

[FOXTROT LAMONT]

Tick, I just had the Scott Scrooge subtitle again/ Hemingway-Faulkner that North started.

 

[Tiki Tom]

Happy birthday, Ernest Hemingway!
Born July 21, 1899.

 

[belfastboy]

I grew up on a farm and still raise some stock, and have been a hunter since I was pretty young. But I do not understand the appeal of bull fighting at all, and I don't have any particular fondness for bulls, either.

From the perspective of the animal, would you rather die quickly and relatively peacefully in the woods, or in an oversized pen surrounded by a yelling mob, stabbed and bleeding in multiple places, and mad as all hell at being tormented? Were I to witness a staged bullfight, I'd be rooting for the bull.

There is absolutely no justification for bullfighting. However, I do love it. One of the grandest spectacles. I also love the ballet and to me bullfighting is akin to ballet except there is blood and one of the parties dies in the end......I guess more like opera only for real not just theatrics.

The most thrilling bullfight I ever attended was in Pamplona only one of the 3 bullfighters was able to finish. One was flipped by the bull and either sprained or broke a wrist so he was unable to kill the bull. The second matador was gored ...ripped open from the ankle to the knee.

But this was on the last day of the festival of San Fermin and (their names escape me) all 3 matadors were headliners possessing great skill and bravado.

I have been to the bullfights in Madrid at the end of the season when the novilleros try to earn their stripes. Unskilled matadors make for a dull/tedious afternoon.

 

[Tiki Tom]

We have just passed the anniversary of Hemingway‘s death (July 2) and are heading for his birthday (July 21). Another important anniversary, for me, is August 25; the day in WWII when Hemingway liberated the Ritz Bar in Paris. I always celebrate that one!

https://www.france24.com/en/20190812-day-hemingway-liberated-ritz-bar-paris

As for bullfighting, although I’ve been to Spain several times, I regret to say that I’ve never attended a bull fight. Nonetheless, I did read Death in the Afternoon some years back and remember thinking that it is underrated and captures the Hemingway voice and ethos nicely. If you like running around Spain, eating and drinking well, and contemplating life and death and bullfighting lore, it’s the Only game in town! Although I also love the fact that one high profile critic dubbed it “Bull in the Afternoon.” (It says something about our modern world that, if you google “death in the afternoon” most of the results are for a cocktail recipe.)

I suppose I have nothing against bullfighting. Hell, we eat beef all the time and the death experienced by those cattle is far more ignominious than death in the bull ring. Given the choice, I’d much rather die in a bullfight than in a slaughter house. At this point I can’t help but think about the moral evolution of humanity. In a perfect world, we’d all be vegetarians. Don’t get me wrong: I’m a hypocrite myself, and not quite ready to go meatless. Therefore, I have no business criticizing the corrida. And I do grasp that, at some level, the bullfight can‘t help but be a contemplation of life, death, bravery, grace under pressure, and all those core Hemingway themes.

Anyway, in this season of Hemingway anniversaries, I’ll gladly daydream about eating and drinking in dusty squares with friends, fly fishing in icy Pyrenees streams, and following the great toreodors For a season. It’s pretty to think about.

 

[rogueclimber]

I’ve been to Spain several times

I spent 16 days in Spain way back in 1984. Inspired by Death in The Afternoon the first thing on my list was a visit to the Plaza de Toros

An amazing experience

Much more recently, on a visit to Cuba, I also had to go to one of Hemingway's haunts and have a mojito

 

[Tiki Tom]

Speak of the devil. Pamplona’s famous running-of-the-bulls festival is this week! It runs from July 6-14.

https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/07/07/pamlona-spain-running-bulls-san-fermin-festival/

Is the San Fermin Festival history’s very first example of a place/event being ruined by publicity? As I understand it, after “the sun also rises” was published in 1926 and became a best seller, Pamplona‘s festival got mobbed by tourists and has never recovered. Many a Hemingway spot has become a zoo. Not sure if it is fair to blame Hemingway personally for this (how could he know?) But there you have it.

 

[Tiki Tom]

Another Hemingway anniversary!
on this day (August 25th) Hemingway led a ragtag group of resistance fighters into Paris, where he “liberated” the bar at the Ritz Hotel.

https://www.sfgate.com/travel/article/Liberating-France-Hemingway-s-way-Following-2731590.php

I think most teenaged boys come to Hemingway for the bigger-than-life tales of adventure. Some then become curious about his writing. In that sense, Papa is a gateway drug to literature for many a young man. Myself included.

As I do every year, I’ll raise a toast to the liberation of Paris tonight and remember Hemingway‘s part of the tale. Another thing: I think every Hemingway fan thinks that they somehow have a more special connection to the City of Light than most. Sacre Bleu!

 

[Tiki Tom]

Okay. I would definitely go to see this movie.

https://www.vulture.com/article/review-hemingways-across-the-river-and-into-the-trees.html

I agree that Across the River and into the Trees was the worst thing that Hemingway published in his lifetime. I’ve actually tried to read it twice. The first time I got through it and thought that it started extremely well, but then sank into maudlin self indulgence. The second time, I couldn’t finish it after its grouchy beginning, because it simply became embarrassing. Middle-aged Hemingway’s real life infatuation with a Venetian teenager was embarrassing enough. (BTW, the book was a best seller in its day, bad reviews not withstanding.)

Nonetheless, I will watch this movie if it comes to my town, if only because it seems to be grasping for that ineffable Hemingway quality: Rough, gritty realism combined and contrasted with heartbreaking sensitivity, beauty, and sadness. Unfortunately, the book tripped over its own shoelaces. Maybe the movie can get closer to hitting the mark.

Plus, how can you skip a movie that has the City of Venice as one of its stars?

late addition: RogerEbert.com seems to like the movie:

https://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/across-the-river-and-into-the-trees-film-review