The Bowler or Derby Hat

[alanfgag]

Hello All,
I originally posted the below post in the "1890's-1900's early hat manufacture HAWES (Hawes Von Gal) HAT CO" thread and was asked to repost it hear. I have always loved hats and I love to save older items in general when I find them, I do have a few other hats and never thought much about the history behind them. This is my first derby and researching the history has struck a cord to find out more.


"I found you all after researching information about a Hawes Von Gal Derby I found at a thrift shop. Someone on this thread did a ton of research and I thank you. After reviewing the data on this thread and on the web I realized the derby could be around 100yrs old, which I found hard to believe. I was wondering if anyone here could help me confirm an approximate age on the hat. Here are the details I have and I will also provide some pics. Thank you in advance for any additional info that can be provided.

The hat is a Black or Grey, 6 7/8, Vented Derby, manufactured by Hawes, von Gal incorporated Danbury, Conn.
The Hat Band has two imprints - "Fine Quality von Gal made Hat" and "Hawes, von Gal inc. New York, Boston, Chicago".
It has a Hawes, von Gal style number tag but I cant make out the number, it could be 1828, 7828 or something else.
It also has a combination Hawes von Gal trade mark tag and a (misspelled) store tag from Wm. Argersinge(r), Johnston, N.Y.".
There is another "To duplicate mention" tag with the number 6870 and a tag with the numbers "(5 ' 4x2 ' 4)"
There is what I think is a union hatters tag as well.

Does anyone have additional info or an idea of the age? Condition seems great if the hat is almost a century or older."

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Great find. There is good history in the Hawes Von Gal thread (much of which I've forgotten)... little if anything of the company was seen after WWI. c.1910 as a date for your derby should be a good guess, with a margin to either side of a few years. Definitely a century old.

 

[Rmccamey]

Yes he does,! Thanks, guys,

Fantastic Randy! Way to go Mike!

Beautiful hat, Randy. Mike sure does know how to get them right.

 

[Aahzz]

Hi folks . I've been wearing a bowler as my daily hat for about 5 years now. I was always a fedora guy, but I was always still looking for something different - tried on a bowler at a booth at a renaissance fair and was instantly sold - it's the style for me. So far, I've been wearing a wool felt Scala, since that's what they had at the booth, though I made a trip to Batsake's today and will be picking up a Selentino tomorrow. Pics will be provided.

I do tend to get quite a few favorable comments about the hat. That is, if I'm not getting bad pirate jokes about my goatee. This is me in the Scala:

 

[Rmccamey]

Most excellent, sir. You will find several here who wear bowlers regularly, myself included, and most have a least one in their collections. If you wear a smaller size, you will also find vintage bowlers (20s, 30s, 40s) on a regular basis on Ebay, etsy, etc. Steve @mayserwegener has a wealth of knowledge about European hats in general and has many fine examples of bowlers in his collection. Welcome to TFL. We are glad to have another bowler aficionado in our ranks.

Hi folks . I've been wearing a bowler as my daily hat for about 5 years now. I was always a fedora guy, but I was always still looking for something different - tried on a bowler at a booth at a renaissance fair and was instantly sold - it's the style for me. So far, I've been wearing a wool felt Scala, since that's what they had at the booth, though I made a trip to Batsake's today and will be picking up a Selentino tomorrow. Pics will be provided.

I do tend to get quite a few favorable comments about the hat. That is, if I'm not getting bad pirate jokes about my goatee. This is me in the Scala:

 

[Aahzz]

Most excellent, sir. You will find several here who wear bowlers regularly, myself included, and most have a least one in their collections. If you wear a smaller size, you will also find vintage bowlers (20s, 30s, 40s) on a regular basis on Ebay, etsy, etc. Steve @mayserwegener has a wealth of knowledge about European hats in general and has many fine examples of bowlers in his collection. Welcome to TFL. We are glad to have another bowler aficionado in our ranks.

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Thanks for the welcome! Nice pics. I'm really looking forward to picking my new bowler up tomorrow - they're reshaping the brim for me, it was too flat for my taste.

Sadly, I'm a solid 7 5/8, so the smaller hats are right out for me!

 

[Rmccamey]

Large size. Sorry, but that does have its limitations. Brent @deadlyhandsome wears 5/8s, and he does a lot of buying, selling and trading and can probably give you some advice and recommendations. He has a vintage 5/8 bowler but they are very rare. Mike at Northwest Hats is a master at making custom modern bowlers, so consider a custom as you grow your collection. Mike made e a Cambridge bowler last year that I absolutely love!

Thanks for the welcome! Nice pics. I'm really looking forward to picking my new bowler up tomorrow - they're reshaping the brim for me, it was too flat for my taste.

Sadly, I'm a solid 7 5/8, so the smaller hats are right out for me!

 

[Aahzz]

Large size. Sorry, but that does have its limitations. Brent @deadlyhandsome wears 5/8s, and he does a lot of buying, selling and trading and can probably give you some advice and recommendations. He has a vintage 5/8 bowler but they are very rare. Mike at Northwest Hats is a master at making custom modern bowlers, so consider a custom as you grow your collection. Mike made e a Cambridge bowler last year that I absolutely love!

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I like that hat!!

 

[mayserwegener]

Most excellent, sir. You will find several here who wear bowlers regularly, myself included, and most have a least one in their collections. If you wear a smaller size, you will also find vintage bowlers (20s, 30s, 40s) on a regular basis on Ebay, etsy, etc. Steve @mayserwegener has a wealth of knowledge about European hats in general and has many fine examples of bowlers in his collection. Welcome to TFL. We are glad to have another bowler aficionado in our ranks.

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Randy, Thank you for the mention. Same back to you. Society of the Stiff Felt Hat!

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Thanks for the welcome! Nice pics. I'm really looking forward to picking my new bowler up tomorrow - they're reshaping the brim for me, it was too flat for my taste.

Sadly, I'm a solid 7 5/8, so the smaller hats are right out for me!

At your / our size you have to spend a lot of time searching the vintage market and often be willing to pay through the nose. I bet I average around six really nice vintage hats a year and that’s with checking eBay, Etsy, auction sites, etc. several times a day most every day. If you don’t enjoy the hunt it’s not worth your time. I also commission custom hats and have bought them from several hatters. There are a lot of great hatters out there.

 

[Blare]

Hi folks . I've been wearing a bowler as my daily hat for about 5 years now. I was always a fedora guy, but I was always still looking for something different - tried on a bowler at a booth at a renaissance fair and was instantly sold - it's the style for me. So far, I've been wearing a wool felt Scala, since that's what they had at the booth, though I made a trip to Batsake's today and will be picking up a Selentino tomorrow. Pics will be provided.

I do tend to get quite a few favorable comments about the hat. That is, if I'm not getting bad pirate jokes about my goatee. This is me in the Scala:

Welcome. It suits you quite nicely

 

[deadlyhandsome]

Large size. Sorry, but that does have its limitations. Brent @deadlyhandsome wears 5/8s, and he does a lot of buying, selling and trading and can probably give you some advice and recommendations. He has a vintage 5/8 bowler but they are very rare. Mike at Northwest Hats is a master at making custom modern bowlers, so consider a custom as you grow your collection. Mike made e a Cambridge bowler last year that I absolutely love!

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I don’t know when I’d wear it, but I really want a Cambridge bowler like that. You wear it well, but my current wardrobe isn’t so conducive to it.

 

[glider]

With that goatee I think you could wear a bowler with any wardrobe choice, I mean that as a compliment.

 

[mayserwegener]

I posted these photo albums before but there are new posters might want to take look. I have many other Stiff Felts that I need to put in similar photo albums.

J. Hückel´s Söhne Stiff Felts

https://flic.kr/s/aHsmHHAJbV

Mayser Ulm Stiff Felts

https://flic.kr/s/aHsmTKjrXS

 

[Hurricane Jack]

I like to carry a Victorian era cane or early Catalin/Bakelite handled cane with a derby.

 

[Steve1857]

Hi folks . I've been wearing a bowler as my daily hat for about 5 years now. I was always a fedora guy, but I was always still looking for something different - tried on a bowler at a booth at a renaissance fair and was instantly sold - it's the style for me. So far, I've been wearing a wool felt Scala, since that's what they had at the booth, though I made a trip to Batsake's today and will be picking up a Selentino tomorrow. Pics will be provided.

I do tend to get quite a few favorable comments about the hat. That is, if I'm not getting bad pirate jokes about my goatee. This is me in the Scala:

Welcome to the FL Aahzz and especially to this thread.

That's one great combo you have there. Bowler, died beard, Iron Maiden t-shirt, and a Griffindor ribbon. Cool all round.

Looking forward to seeing photos of your new Bowler.

Congrats too on eliciting so many replies. I don't think I've seen so many new posts in one day on the Bowler or Derby Hat thread.

 

[Rmccamey]

I don’t know when I’d wear it, but I really want a Cambridge bowler like that. You wear it well, but my current wardrobe isn’t so conducive to it.

It seems to work for me with a black jacket and a white or solid colored shirt. Thanks, Brent.

I like to carry a Victorian era cane or early Catalin/Bakelite handled cane with a derby.

I've held my desires for a while, Jack, but you are just going to have to hook me up with a cane like that! Superb! A vintage cane goes perfectly with a vintage bowler.

 

[Aahzz]

Welcome to the FL Aahzz and especially to this thread.

That's one great combo you have there. Bowler, died beard, Iron Maiden t-shirt, and a Griffindor ribbon. Cool all round.

Looking forward to seeing photos of your new Bowler.

Congrats too on eliciting so many replies. I don't think I've seen so many new posts in one day on the Bowler or Derby Hat thread.

Thanks! I was also in a black utilikilt, in the interest of full disclosure The Gryffindor ribbon was because I was at Universal Orlando, and I do love The Wizarding World.

 

[Aahzz]

Made the trip back today. Gus wasn't there yesterday afternoon, but he was there today, and I had a delightful chat with him. He had my hat perfectly set to my preferences, and I didn't realize he was going to, but had imprinted my initials in the sweat band. I feel privileged to have a hat from his shop .

 

[Aahzz]

With that goatee I think you could wear a bowler with any wardrobe choice, I mean that as a compliment.

Thanks!!

 

[Hurricane Jack]

A vintage cane goes perfectly with a vintage bowler.

I think so too. Only have a couple other pics in file.

10k RGP handle on ash

Butterscotch Catalin on ash