More Semi Formal Trouble

[cufflinkmaniac]

I've almost decided that instead of a one button peak dinner jacket from Tuxedosonline,I should get a one button shawl from JAB.I think that the dinner jacket would be far better in terms of quality,and the price is not that much more when on sale.What do you think?


The peak:

http://www.tuxedosonline.com/detail.asp?product_id=M1BP


The shawl:

http://www.josbank.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Merchant_Id=1&Section_Id=6000&pcount=&Product_Id=25

Of course there is a third option (and it comes with the added bonus of not needing a waistcoat or cummerbund) :

http://www.josbank.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Merchant_Id=1&Section_Id=&pcount=&Product_Id=232

As you can imagine,I've been presented with more trouble regarding accessories.If I go with the shawl,I will get a three button black waistcoat in satin I understand that if the jacket lapels are satin,that this is acceptable),as I do not like the way cummerbunds look on me.I would also require a change in shirts as I don't like wing collars with shawl collars or DB jackets.I was thinking of a marcella shirt from Clermont Direct:

http://www.clermontdirect.com/cotton-stud-front-marcella-fold-down-collar-shirt-p-158.html

The waistcoat (black on the bottom right,not silk but teen budget friendly) :http://www.uniformalwearhouse.com/apages/tuxedo_vests_solid.html

They also have a fly front model,but I prefer stud fronts.I would appreciate opinions as to which dinner jacket I should choose,as well as opinions (and any criticisms) of the shirt and waistcoat.Sorry for the long post!

 

[dogrocketp]

If you've not yet done so, go to www.blacktieguide.com. Read about the variations on each tuxedo style and what is considered correct. The Double Breasted should be a four button, one to button, for instance. You might also want to refer to "Style and The Man" by Alan Flusser. Also consider where you will wear the tuxedo, the level of formality for various occasions you would wear it, and which style would suit your body type the best. It's all about looking great in the end! Cheers.

 

[cufflinkmaniac]

If you've not yet done so, go to www.blacktieguide.com. Read about the variations on each tuxedo style and what is considered correct. The Double Breasted should be a four button, one to button, for instance. You might also want to refer to "Style and The Man" by Alan Flusser. Also consider where you will wear the tuxedo, the level of formality for various occasions you would wear it, and which style would suit your body type the best. It's all about looking great in the end! Cheers.

The Black Tie Guide has been like a bible to me,but I still like getting opinions.

 

[Josephine]

I think a lot depends on you. For instance, I got The Husband a shawl collar as he's a geek and doesn't dress up much (at all for work), so for him a shawl is dressed up. If you wear suits more often or dress business wise a peak would take it a level higher. I deplore the altered business suits that pass off as (semi)formal wear nowadays with notch collars, high vests, and long ties.

Double breasted can look very nice on the right type of build. I will admit to a soft spot for a man in a vest (I will even embarrass myself further by saying it was Tom Hanks in the second to the last scene in The Money Pit [three piece suit sans jacket] that endeared me to the slightly rakish look when I was younger), that's why I got The Husband a vest for his tuxedo (unfortunately not a full back one though).

I agree that shawl doesn't call for a wing collar (IMO). I've never seen a marcella in person (or don't remember), but it appears too much like a regular business shirt from a distance for more formal wear, again IMO.

You asked for opinions...

 

[cufflinkmaniac]

I think a lot depends on you. For instance, I got The Husband a shawl collar as he's a geek and doesn't dress up much (at all for work), so for him a shawl is dressed up. If you wear suits more often or dress business wise a peak would take it a level higher. I deplore the altered business suits that pass off as (semi)formal wear nowadays with notch collars, high vests, and long ties.

Double breasted can look very nice on the right type of build. I will admit to a soft spot for a man in a vest (I will even embarrass myself further by saying it was Tom Hanks in the second to the last scene in The Money Pit [three piece suit sans jacket] that endeared me to the slightly rakish look when I was younger), that's why I got The Husband a vest for his tuxedo (unfortunately not a full back one though).

I agree that shawl doesn't call for a wing collar (IMO). I've never seen a marcella in person (or don't remember), but it appears too much like a regular business shirt from a distance for more formal wear, again IMO.

You asked for opinions...

And I thank you for them.I just think that JAB would be far better quality than Tuxedosonline.

 

[Edward]

Re Clermont Direct.... I have bought several items from them in the UK in the past, and always been very pleased with their price-quality ratio.

As a shawl is considered a little more informal than a peak lapel, I agree that a full collar is preferable to wingtips - but then I always prefer a full collar (and an attached one at that! ) for black tie wear. DB is, technically, the least formal of the acceptable options, though pretty much anyone outside of these circles won't notice that, and if it suits you it will usually be a little different than the norm. And, as you recognise, at your age this won't be the definitve semi-formal wear that you'll be wearing for years to come.

Here's a thought.... presuming, like many of us, you will eventually want to have 'one of each,' I might be thinking about making your new selection based on buying a stye that is very hard to find used / vintage in your size, and waiting for the right bargain on the more common vintage styles. It seems to me that the most easily found vintage options are early 40s dbs, but that may differ where you are. That said, picking up the better quality new item also seems a good place to start.

 

[Josephine]

And I thank you for them.I just think that JAB would be far better quality than Tuxedosonline.

the shawl does have flap pockets, but you could always tuck then in/have them removed.

where will you be wearing your tuxedo? i'm wondering if a peak on a young man your age (late teens?) would look affected. i suppose i also depends on if you live in an urban area or not.

 

[cufflinkmaniac]

the shawl does have flap pockets, but you could always tuck then in/have them removed.

where will you be wearing your tuxedo? i'm wondering if a peak on a young man your age (late teens?) would look affected. i suppose i also depends on if you live in an urban area or not.

I would primarily use it for opeing night at the opera,weddings (provided I can convince a relative to have the dress code as black tie,or at least black tie optional),special occasions,charity events (I've seen a few listed on Facebook that call for black tie),and a cruise I may be going on in '10.So you see,it will be mostly laid back events.Now,if I were attending a more,for lack of a better word,diplomatic event,then the peak would definitely be my choice.And yes,I would have the flaps removed and the vent sewn when I take it for necessary alterations.And I consider my area "semi-urban".

But again,it all comes down to the quality issue.

 

[Undertow]

Wow, I've been reading the lounge for some time, going on three years now (I looked before I registered mind you) and I found www.blacktieguide.com to be quite informative and interesting. In fact, I've been reading it all morning. Although my volumes of literature and expert knowledge from the lounge were sufficient, this has been excellent supplemental material.

Thanks for the link! :eusa_clap

 

[dhermann1]

I see from your other posts that you're 16, right? That means you haven't stopped growing. I think maybe you should go as cheaply as you can, because you'll be passing it along to someone else by the time you're 20. Just a consideration.

 

[Feraud]

^^ So true.

 

[Undertow]

Oh my, 16? Yes, the others are quite right; you'll most definitely grow out of this in no time. This sort of thing is an investment and in 5 years, your investment will no longer work for you.

However, I do commend you for researching and (hopefully) adhering to the tenets of proper dress, and impeccable style! :eusa_clap

 

[Max Flash]

Cufflinkmaniac

You're thinking about this WAY too much. The difference between a peak lapel and a shawl collar has no other significance today that personal preference and what you think you look good in. You will not go to any black tie event where you will be pulled up on what cut you are wearing, regardless of how "diplomatic" it is. I have been to balls, opera, weddings, parties and dinners, both formal and celebratory (all black tie, rather than white tie, I should add), and have worn the same double-breasted DJ to all of them. At no point have I felt over- or under-dressed, or been marked out because of my choice of jacket.

Therefore, you should try on the different styles and decide whih you feel most comfortable and best-looking in, and buy that one. Comfort is the key factor - if you feel trussed up and uncomfortable, you will look it, which destroys the air you are trying to carry off.

Good luck!

 

[cufflinkmaniac]

I see from your other posts that you're 16, right? That means you haven't stopped growing. I think maybe you should go as cheaply as you can, because you'll be passing it along to someone else by the time you're 20. Just a consideration.

Good point.

 

[cufflinkmaniac]

Oh my, 16? Yes, the others are quite right; you'll most definitely grow out of this in no time. This sort of thing is an investment and in 5 years, your investment will no longer work for you.

However, I do commend you for researching and (hopefully) adhering to the tenets of proper dress, and impeccable style! :eusa_clap

Thank you!I certainly plan on adhering to classic style.

 

[Tomasso]

The difference between a peak lapel and a shawl collar has no other significance today that personal preference

Don't forget the notch lapel, Prince Philip's favorite.

He eschews studs as well.

 

[cufflinkmaniac]

Don't forget the notch lapel, Prince Philip's favorite.

He eschews studs as well.

I've heard that a fair number of Brits reserve studs for white tie.Personally,I think a formal shirt looks nude sans studs.And the notch lapel was not the only travesty commited by the Prince,

For some reason,the picture won't come up,but he was wearing bit loafers.

 

[Max Flash]

Don't forget the notch lapel, Prince Philip's favorite.

He eschews studs as well.

True. You don't see many of those though.

I don't think studs are mandatory either, but may risk looking like you're not wearing a dress shirt. My Brooks Brothers dress shirt has the option to wear with studs or buttons (the buttons are attached to a strip of material so you can remove them completely), but I rarely wear it without studs. Usually, a non-stud dress shirt will have covered buttons to hide them.

 

[Max Flash]

I've heard that a fair number of Brits reserve studs for white tie.

Well, he is Greek after all! ;-)

 

[Tomasso]

True. You don't see many of those though.

Actually, you see a fair share in the US.

My Brooks Brothers dress shirt has the option to wear with studs or buttons (the buttons are attached to a strip of material so you can remove them completely)

Most shirts are delivered that way, even bespoke.

BTW, you can make your own stud set on the cheap by sewing shanked mother of pearl buttons onto that strip of material and then making matching cufflinks. I've made a couple sets from very exotic buttons found at Tender Buttons in NYC.