Is thicker leather actually any more protective?

[LightenUpFrancis]

I have no empirical data on this, but I have seen Vansons of professional riders who took a fall and slide and the Vansons held up good; both leather and seams. I have yet to see a Shinki, either American or Japanese made, that has taken this test. Would they hold up as well? Maybe, but I would rather ride in the battle tested leather and construction.

I think this point carries a lot of weight for me, and why most of the jackets I ride in happen to be Vanson. And as someone who understands the heat concerns (commuting through late Texas summers), the perforated option they offer changed my life.

Aside from a very intentional cut that is designed around being in a riding position, it's from a company that's been invested in active motorsport competition for so long - the build process absolutely compensates for points of failure, and their experience seems to really pay off here. Recognizing that not all Vanson jackets are armored, the handful I have that are - easily the best/most intuitive fitting.

I also have a couple of Goldtop jackets that have done really well, and mask the armour options comfortably. I'd trust them in a slide, but I still get more of that ******proof confidence when zipped in a Vanson. Still, the best option truly is the one you'll always wear.

 

[LightenUpFrancis]

What are people’s thoughts on armored synthetic Vs a thick leather jackets and pants. Or unarmored synthetic vs leather. Those should offer similar protection right? I bought panda moto pants which are dyneema with armor in the hips and knees but for years I rode in horsehide Y2 leather horsehide pants. The leather feels more protective despite not being armored but people have told me The synthetic actually has better abrasion resistance but I was more thinking I’d rather have thick leather between me and a hot exhaust while sliding on blacktop but again i don’t really have any experience. Thankfully.

Zoltan had a great point on modern textiles having improved quite a bit, specifically mentioning aramids. I have a Type III from a company Resurgence that is fully lined with pekev aramid, and I have yet to see data of another company beating their reported slide times. I've also used them for riding pants - jeans/chinos, which have held up remarkably well over the last 8 years.

That said, I'm always aware of the compromise. I don't feel as protected in any of my textiles as I do in a comparable leather option. But knowing I'd never ride if I had to put on race pants or motocross boots, I stay conscious of what I decide to wear and try to ride accordingly.

 

[Boulderunner]

Isn’t all horsehide pretty much going to have the same abrasion resistance unless they are finished differently? They are all horses right? So aside from differences between veg and chrome tanned there isn’t a whole lot of variability in horse hides…. I read that pigment finished horsehide has way better abrasion resistance because of the top coat. My Vanson uses Horween cxl and I just wonder if there is that much of a difference aside from sewing perhaps and seam strength when you actually compare 1 “brand “ of horsehide to another.

 

[Zoltan]

What you (us) have to remember is how the jacket is put together.
My BKS Made To Measure:
Has typically feature 3 to 4 stitches per cm (equivalent to 7 to 10 stitches per inch). This dense, closely spaced stitching is heavily reinforced with triple-stitched seams using Ticket 20 nylon bonded thread to ensure maximum burst resistance and structural integrity in the event of a slide.

While EN 17092 and EN 13595 (the European standards for motorcycle protective equipment) dictate strict seam strength and abrasion thresholds, BKS is known for exceeding these legal minimums by using robust, hand-applied construction methods directly from their workshop. Hence classified as protective equipment by UK Police, Military Police and other emergency departments.
His fabric gear is even stitched denser using Kevlar thread. He is also incorporating the Alpinestar Air jacket.
Hence a casual leather jacket may burst at the seams. Nothing to do with the quality of the leather.
Also the thread used in casual jackets is mostly cotton. I doubt they are triple stitched seam, will ask Aero when I visit them.

 

[Bender]

Listen, silly videos where a guy is being dragged at like six miles an hour aside, the short answer is yes, thicker leather is actually more protective.

The qualifier is that in an actual high-speed slide, thicker leather gives you maybe an extra second before it goes, and you are literally friction-flayed alive, your skin essentially cheese-grated off while simultaneously taking a low level cauterization from the heat, as you scream and scream in unmitigated agony like a damned soul being tortured by Satan in the deepest bowels of hell.

Wear something with Kevlar in it.

 

[Peter Mackin]

Had my first made to measure bike jacket made by BKS Made to Measure, full Roo leather (half the weight of cow leather) he makes all the leathers for the UK Police & MP https://www.bksleather.co.uk/information/police-emergency-services
The design was a one off based on the Police Jacket with a central venting system. Also to be used as a casual jacket. The jacket is snug so the armor doesn't shift, now he incorporated the Alpinestar air bag. The main issue between casual and a bike jacket is the stitching and the type of thread and leather.
Today the textiles are as good as leather especially the single layer gear, I am a fan of stuff made by ROKKER, I have few chino and cargo trousers with. DuPont™ Kevlar® can withstand temperatures up to 450C. The material is also 4 ways stretch.

Rukka Merlin was a UV treated waterproof Goretex laminated perforated leather jacket, cost a fortune. But the cut for me was to slim. Great idea. Also RUKKA offers the largest armor in the business. D3O.

However my Half Belt Deluxe CXSH is 1.7mm thick and with the Dainese Smart Air Bag over the top is as good as any bike specific jacket. When I arrive to destination the airbag goes in the pannier.
I use Held Titan gloves and Daytona trans open gtx boots. I have a ton of other gear from Klim, Belstaff North Circular and BMW, depending on the weather or if I go touring. However the airbag now is a constant.

Above contributors already mentioned what is good or bad. Ultimately is down to you, nothing is 100% safe.
If you ride like a **** no gear will save you. Advance ride course is a better investment than a £2000 race suit.

Few examples of accidents:
My mate went down the motorway(slide and roll) in a IXS race suit at 100mph. Leathers were scuffed. Only the collar bone was broken and he walked away. Helmet (Arai), gloves(SPIDI), boots(Alpinestar) were ruined. He was fortunate he didn't hit any street furniture and no car hit him.

My other friend went down in a BMW Tourshell jacket at low speed in town and hit a lamp post. Walked away, the back plate in the jacket covers the entire back, shoulder and elbow are huge in thickness and length. Got holed in the elbow. Not even a bruise.
RIDE SAFE! View attachment 786596 View attachment 786597 View attachment 786604 View attachment 786603 View attachment 786601 View attachment 786598 View attachment 786599 View attachment 786606

Few jackets from the past

That bks

closely resembles my Strathclyde police issue jacket,,brilliant made to measure so fits perfectly

 

[Zoltan]

That bks View attachment 790141 closely resembles my Strathclyde police issue jacket,,brilliant made to measure so fits perfectly

Wow, that is an early 4 pocket model. I see the Police badge stitching marks above the ****** pocket and the old label without the CE label. I missed recently on a fully perforated summer jacket. Unfortunately they are no allowed to sell on to the public anymore. Something to do with liability. Suit is returned to quartermaster and destroyed...So I was told.

 

[Peter Mackin]

Wow, that is an early 4 pocket model. I see the Police badge stitching marks above the ****** pocket and the old label without the CE label. I missed recently on a fully perforated summer jacket. Unfortunately they are no allowed to sell on to the public anymore. Something to do with liability. Suit is returned to quartermaster and destroyed...So I was told.

Yip,serving officers could keep their own equipment when leaving the force or replacing