Help! Quick opinion on Kreosote boots.

[bigmanbigtruck]

lol nobody is saying he’s gonna be the next Madoff.

But one can easily imagine a situation where he keeps collecting the payments upfront to pay for expenses and keep the lights on in order to pursue his dream. Eventually these “deposits” will dry up and he’ll be forced to call it quits.

Meanwhile you’re out 2 grand and a pair of boots.

 

[Aloysius]

lol nobody is saying he’s gonna be the next Madoff.

But one can easily imagine a situation where he keeps collecting the payments upfront to pay for expenses and keep the lights on in order to pursue his dream. Eventually these “deposits” will dry up and he’ll be forced to call it quits.

Meanwhile you’re out of 2 grand and a pair of boots.

* 3 grand lol

 

[bigmanbigtruck]

* 3 grand lol

Nevermind, he’s gonna be the next Madoff then

 

[vividIT]

lol nobody is saying he’s gonna be the next Madoff.

But one can easily imagine a situation where he keeps collecting the payments upfront to pay for expenses and keep the lights on in order to pursue his dream. Eventually these “deposits” will dry up and he’ll be forced to call it quits.

Meanwhile you’re out of 2 grand and a pair of boots.

Yeah, from being on his list for boot builds, something is definitely up. Shouldn't take this long. Even Carl said in his write-ups, who knows how long he'll continue to build boots and would agree, what happens then.

I'm not an attorney nor do I know Missouri law (where he's located), but from researching Missouri's laws, they have an MMPA (Missouri Merchandising Practices Act) in place. If I'm reading correctly, someone can file a complaint to the Attorney General's office and they would look into his business and for mediation if he's not giving refunds while violating the MMPA.

Based on his email schedule it shows 16 boots being built in a 17 month period, while promoting 30-35 builds on his website, on top of sending delays year after year to receive a product.

Missouri Merchandising Practices Act (MMPA) protects consumers from unfair business practices, including delays in product refunds:

407.020. Unlawful practices, penalty — exceptions. — 1. The act, use or employment by any person of any deception, fraud, false pretense, false promise, misrepresentation, unfair practice or the concealment, suppression, or omission of any material fact in connection with the sale or advertisement of any merchandise in trade or commerce or the solicitation of any funds for any charitable purpose, as defined in section 407.453, in or from the state of Missouri, is declared to be an unlawful practice.

 

[Aloysius]

Yeah, from being on his list for boot builds, something is definitely up. Shouldn't take this long. Even Carl said in his write-ups, who knows how long he'll continue to build boots and would agree, what happens then.

I'm not an attorney nor do I know Missouri law (where he's located), but from researching Missouri's laws, they have an MMPA (Missouri Merchandising Practices Act) in place. If I'm reading correctly, someone can file a complaint to the Attorney General's office and they would look into his business and for mediation if he's not giving refunds while violating the MMPA.

If he's only building 16 boots per year or per 17 months as he did in 2024, while promoting 30-35 builds on his website, on top of making false promises year after year to receive a product. I feel like he would be cutting it close to violating that. We can easy say he has a bad business model right now.

Missouri Merchandising Practices Act (MMPA) protects consumers from unfair business practices, including delays in product refunds:

407.020. Unlawful practices, penalty — exceptions. — 1. The act, use or employment by any person of any deception, fraud, false pretense, false promise, misrepresentation, unfair practice or the concealment, suppression, or omission of any material fact in connection with the sale or advertisement of any merchandise in trade or commerce or the solicitation of any funds for any charitable purpose, as defined in section 407.453, in or from the state of Missouri, is declared to be an unlawful practice.

I think you should take this step. It’s not exactly great when people use our fondness for small businesses as a cover to kind of blow off the customer.

 

[Tom71]

Yeah, from being on his list for boot builds, something is definitely up. Shouldn't take this long. Even Carl said in his write-ups, who knows how long he'll continue to build boots and would agree, what happens then.

I'm not an attorney nor do I know Missouri law (where he's located), but from researching Missouri's laws, they have an MMPA (Missouri Merchandising Practices Act) in place. If I'm reading correctly, someone can file a complaint to the Attorney General's office and they would look into his business and for mediation if he's not giving refunds while violating the MMPA.

If he's only building 16 boots per year or per 17 months as he did in 2024, while promoting 30-35 builds on his website, on top of making false promises year after year to receive a product. I feel like he would be cutting it close to violating that. We can easy say he has a bad business model right now.

Missouri Merchandising Practices Act (MMPA) protects consumers from unfair business practices, including delays in product refunds:

407.020. Unlawful practices, penalty — exceptions. — 1. The act, use or employment by any person of any deception, fraud, false pretense, false promise, misrepresentation, unfair practice or the concealment, suppression, or omission of any material fact in connection with the sale or advertisement of any merchandise in trade or commerce or the solicitation of any funds for any charitable purpose, as defined in section 407.453, in or from the state of Missouri, is declared to be an unlawful practice.

Please don´t.

Making a complaint to a consumer protection body doesn´t get your money back. If things start to unravel you want to be gone before the tsunami hits the coast.

Send him a formal notice, demanding your money back; follow up with a lawyer that works on a "cost of the action" basis or even succes based (I am sure, you know somebody who knows somebody...). Get you money back before everybody else tries.

 

[Brandrea33]

At the time, I liked his style as well and gave him the benefit of the doubt. Back in 2020, 1 year was tough to fathom at the time. It obviously is turning out very poorly. It gets worse......

I have an email from him dated 10/2023 that 16 builds were ahead of mine. We can do the math. Should be June or July if he is doing 2 - 2.5 builds per year if he builds 30-35/yr (per his website). Just received a new update last week (November), after checking in with him that my new schedule is 3/2025. That's 16 builds for 17 months!!! These are for 2020 purchases. He's NOT even building 30/yr or even 35/yr per his website.

Wow … not good indeed.

My conversation happened in 2022 and at that time I believe he had a 18 mo - 2 year wait. I just couldn’t get my head around paying upfront and waiting that long.

Im happy with my Vibergs.

EDIT: I agree with @Tom71 … ask for your money back. If nothing else, it may move you next up in the production cue lol

 

[Tom71]

I will say that I always liked the look of the "Nail Shank" Boot. At one point, I was close to getting on the wait list, but then life happened and I had other concerns. Some things work out just by doing nothing...

 

[ABCD]

Not going to happen. Himel and quite a few others tried to pull this off, too and it didn't happen.

There is no brand image.

He's still trying though.

 

[jonbuilder]

these will look goofy with a suit

42 months is insane. think about your taste 4 years ago...do you want the same things now?

The wait is now 54 months.

 

[jonbuilder]

One can not order Kreosote boots directly from his website. You request an appointment to discuss the order with the man after you have summited the foot measurements from the instruction on his website. Taking 100% deposit in effect lowers the his order count and eliminates tire kickers time wasters. I believe his website states once you place an order there are no refunds. I know baker Shoes has a similar policy; 100% deposit and no refunds once the order is accept by White's

 

[Bfd70]

Can’t imagine he’s getting any new orders. If so, caveat emptor right ?

 

[jonbuilder]

Interesting boots. I like the look of them. They would pair well with a suit - but only the *right* suit. Specifically, something in a late teens / into the early 20s style (think: first couple of series of Peaky Blinders). Very common back then for working men to wear boots like these with a suit. (Not least because it would have been their only footwear at any one time - and likely their only 'good' suit too.) In a pinch, these would work well with something like one of the Darcy Clothing 'workwear' suits.

In leather terms, if you ever want to wear them in a 'dressier' style, then I would suggest plain black. I'm not a particular fan of teacore (it always felt to me like trying to rush-replicate the look of a jacket or a pair of boots that had been hard-abused for decades, rather than something more period-realistic - ymmv) anyhow, but as a practical matter, a pair of plain black boots will be much easier to match into a smarter outfit than something that mixes black and brown. Looked after ( polished regularly in particular), there's no reason these couldn't stay tidy looking for a long time, as opposed to fashionably abused.

As to wait time, much like price, only you can decide whether they are worth it to you. I can't imagine paying up front and waiting that long for almost anything shy of the kind of house I'll never be able to afford in the locations I'd want it. Plenty of other folks wait a long time for things they passionately would love to have, and for which there is no substitute. Some folks have waited as long for a Goodwear A2, others up to eight years at one time for a new Morgan sportscar. I have a friend who is now many years in to a long wait to be able to become a member at Lords cricket ground. Only you can know if you'll still want it by that point. That's the aspect that wouldn't give me any pause for concern: my own clothing tastes are now in the main decades old, particularly footwear.

The one thing I would be wary of - if I've picked this up correctly - is that kind of wait after paying out the full cost upfront. It's a long time pre-production to be out that amount. I'd at least want to be clear before deciding anything on that score what the cancellation policy was, and the extent of any non-returnable deposit element of the price.

If I read his current website correctly, there is no cancellation and no refunds. You order a pair of boots assume you are in until delivery. Same policy as Baker Shoes White's Boots