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German & Austrian Hutmachers

Steve1857

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,829
Location
Denmark
Stefan, I was also thinking F and S but E and S is a partial match for EMS. I thought it might be a sheep but too much wear to say for sure.
Super logo Steve on a super hat. I'd go for E S. F is also a possibility. The creature in the middle doesn't look sheep like to me. I was thinking lion, but it has no mane. Could it be a not so young lion cub, or other wild cat of some kind?
Mythical is always a possibility.

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Steve1857

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,829
Location
Denmark
Thanks, Steve. What I meant was, I don't think this style of velour hat would have been made for a 1950s English market. It looks very pre-war to me. That's why I said sold in the Dunn & Co shop in Piccadilly in the 50s, but perhaps NOS from the 30s.

It could equally have been made by Tonak in the 50s from old 30s material.

The two examples you attached are exquisite, but not as plush a velour as Garrett's.

If only every hat maker put a date in their hats [emoji4]

Thanks for your expert input, Steve. We amateur hat detectives learn a lot from them.


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the_imperialist

One of the Regulars
Messages
217
Location
New Zealand
"Bellona", 58 cm, Back Bow, Crown Open 6 inches, Brim 2 3/4 inches, possibly 1920s. The black Wool felt easily dry creases and has a nice glow. I have few of these old Wool hats with similar paper labels but I believe this is the oldest. The Crown Patch is missing. I wasn't able to take very good photos so I will take some wearing it outdoors.

48390749347_129ceef747_b.jpg


48390756742_c93fc516c8_b.jpg


48390705521_da6e0a109b_b.jpg


48390873137_5fc800d80f_b.jpg


This could be a Sheep surrounded by an "F" and a "S" so possibly Friedrich W. Schneider Köln.

48390786526_f0e625a01d_b.jpg


48390935527_84d8f46786_b.jpg


48390948482_076fb193b3_b.jpg


Open Crown

48390904197_8b30e3bc7a_b.jpg


48390913627_9d4a49044d_b.jpg

Absolutely stunning hat! Looks to be in exquisite condition as well - wouldn't look out of place fresh on the factory floor!

I'm glad someone picked up that G.A. Dunn velour on etsy - was killing me seeing it sit there so long unloved.
 
Messages
17,477
Location
Maryland
Thanks, Steve. What I meant was, I don't think this style of velour hat would have been made for a 1950s English market. It looks very pre-war to me. That's why I said sold in the Dunn & Co shop in Piccadilly in the 50s, but perhaps NOS from the 30s.

It could equally have been made by Tonak in the 50s from old 30s material.

The two examples you attached are exquisite, but not as plush a velour as Garrett's.

If only every hat maker put a date in their hats [emoji4]

Thanks for your expert input, Steve. We amateur hat detectives learn a lot from them.


Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
Steve, Yes it does look older style wise. It's really hard to know what happened in the first couple of years after WWII when JHS was in a state of flux. There was a very short time when it was still in the hands of the Hückel family. I am sure there are post WWII records at Tonak but the local historians don't care about such things. It's all about family history and other such nonsense.
 
Messages
17,477
Location
Maryland
Super logo Steve on a super hat. I'd go for E S. F is also a possibility. The creature in the middle doesn't look sheep like to me. I was thinking lion, but it has no mane. Could it be a not so young lion cub, or other wild cat of some kind?
Mythical is always a possibility.

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
Steve, Definitely more mysteries. :) I think one day something (trademark?) will give away the source (either maker or distributor).
 

Steve1857

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,829
Location
Denmark
Steve, Yes it does look older style wise. It's really hard to know what happened in the first couple of years after WWII when JHS was in a state of flux. There was a very short time when it was still in the hands of the Hückel family. I am sure there are post WWII records at Tonak but the local historians don't care about such things. It's all about family history and other such nonsense.
Steve, it would be great to be able to dig through those archives and get beyond the sales nonsense and put a historic hat record straight. I guess that's not going to happen in the near future.

In the meantime, it's such an advantage to have your knowledge and hands on experience. Thanks for putting up with my academical surmises.

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
 
Messages
17,477
Location
Maryland
Steve, it would be great to be able to dig through those archives and get beyond the sales nonsense and put a historic hat record straight. I guess that's not going to happen in the near future.

In the meantime, it's such an advantage to have your knowledge and hands on experience. Thanks for putting up with my academical surmises.

Sent from my HUAWEI VNS-L31 using Tapatalk
Steve, I have asked about JHS production information but there is no interest. I am sure if I spent some time in Novy Jicin I could dig up some detailed information but it would be like pulling teeth.
 

Steve1857

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,829
Location
Denmark
Here is my VEB Vereinigte Hutwerke Guben (thanks Steve for the info) find, earlier posted in the Homburg Nation thread. There is some moth damage (not holes) but the rest condition is good. Felt is very soft and the overall hand a dream. Unfortunately it's not my size... View attachment 178722 View attachment 178723 View attachment 178724 View attachment 178725 View attachment 178726
Unlucky that it's not your size, Panos. However, it is a nice find. Hope it finds its rightful head.

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PanosChris

Practically Family
Messages
977
Unlucky that it's not your size, Panos. However, it is a nice find. Hope it finds its rightful head.

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Thanks Steve, Indeed it's a pity not to fit my head. I am a 56-57 and my best guess for that one would be 59-60. Otherwise I would definitely sporting it despite the moth spots, some modern hatters charge extra for a bespoke distressed look :)
 
Last edited:
Messages
17,477
Location
Maryland

Mean Eyed Matt

One Too Many
Messages
1,142
Location
Germany
Here is my VEB Vereinigte Hutwerke Guben (thanks Steve for the info) find, earlier posted in the Homburg Nation thread. There is some moth damage (not holes) but the rest condition is good. Felt is very soft and the overall hand a dream. Unfortunately it's not my size... View attachment 178722 View attachment 178723 View attachment 178724 View attachment 178725 View attachment 178726

Great find! Congratulations!
The lining is equal to the lining of my grandfather's hat,
where Steve also suspected a production at the Gubener VEB based on the label:
32349801wg.jpg

32349804wp.jpg

32349806fx.jpg
 

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