German & Austrian Hutmachers

[Mario]

I will try and find out more of him. Since it is a recent production, he might still be working. His dialect sounds Bavarian/Tyrolian. I will see, if I can trace him.

I'd locate him in the Allgäu, probably Ober- or Ostallgäu. I've lived in the Westallgäu myself.

 

[Mario]

Ok. I just read that you found him in Austria. I'm baffled. I'm Austrian myself, and this doesn't really sound like your average Austrian dialect to me. But then, I've been in Germany for almost all my life...and I've never travelled to Tyrol.

 

[le.gentleman]

That might be the son!

At least it seems to be the same household as the address matches. In addition to that, the phone number you found is identical to the fax number I found - so, it's one or the other I suppose.

 

[le.gentleman]

Mazur from Vienna in black:

 

[le.gentleman]

Found him:

Kiniger Gottfried
Hut- und Filzerzeugung (hatter and feltmaker)
9920 Sillian 109
Austria
0043/(0)4842/6465


Called up the cameraman the documentary is to be found at: www.handwerksfilme.de (Der Hutmacher)

The film was done five years, ago. These films are ment to document the very last of their professions. Here is the English version: www.old-world-crafts.com

It seems like one could think about taking a little hat vacation in Silluan:

http://www.kiniger.com/edocs/frames.htm

 

[mayserwegener]

I received the following information from the Nový Jičín museum after resending the pictures of le.gentleman's black Hückel.

"First I thought that it will be pre-war collection too. This style of hats is specified for thirties. We have a big collection of this types from known persons as the Czech presidents –T. G. Masaryk, E. Beneš, sculptors, painters and many others. When you will see a Hückel trade mark with prices from world grand prix or any other awards, you can identify all of products to the pre-war period. But problem is with Weilheim company after WW II, we don´t know everything about this production here. We were a part of communist bloc and Weilheim was situated on the other side. And now we search in practice everything about this Hückel company. Could you make a better photo from the lining of hat – specially tha logo KORN. Thanks.

Enclosed are linings of Hückel hats from cca 1930-1940 from our exposition. "

In my opinion there is no way le.gentleman's hat is not post WWII (my guess late 50s early 60s). I also believe this is the case with my Exclusiv.

Based on the supplied 1930-40 Hückel liners (appear to be from bowlers) only my Surperior and Dreispitz's Mercur appear to fit in.

My Hückel Superior liner as a contrast. It appears to fit in.

I asked the person at the museum if they can have someone at TONAK look at the pictures.

Le.gentleman when you get a chance could you please take some more pictures of the sweatband of your black Hückel? Also behind the sweat if possible. I am going to do the same with my Exclusiv Homburg.

I took this picture of the inside of my Exclusiv Homburg. As you can see there is a protective plastic liner . I wouldn't associate this with a pre 1945 hat. I am thinking 1950s or later.

Same plastic in the liner.

 

[le.gentleman]

Here you go:

I am also convinceed that this is a post WWII production hat.

 

[le.gentleman]

Here a Homburg from Mayser Milz. It doesn't not flatter my face and appearance that's why I'd be willing to sell or trade this one... let me know if you are interested. Although it is sized 58cm it could also fit 59cm = 7 3/8" head. I think it is a post WWII hat probably from the 50ies. It has never been used as it is a new old stock - you rarely find those hats in that condition and felt quality nowadays!

 

[Mario]

le.gentleman: If you have stuff to sell, this is not the appropriate place. Just head over to the Classifieds thread. There you can buy or sell hats and other vintage stuff to your heart's content. And now: begone!

 

[le.gentleman]

le.gentleman: If you have stuff to sell, this is not the appropriate place. Just head over to the Classifieds thread. There you can buy or sell hats and other vintage stuff to your hearts content. And now: begone!

Thanks for letting me know!

 

[mayserwegener]

Here a Homburg from Mayser Milz. It doesn't not flatter my face and appearance that's why I'd be willing to sell or trade this one... let me know if you are interested. Although it is sized 58cm it could also fit 59cm = 7 3/8" head. I think it is a post WWII hat probably from the 50ies. It has never been used as it is a new old stock - you rarely find those hats in that condition and felt quality nowadays!

Very nice looking Homburg. I like the thinner ribbon showing the bowler influence.

I love Homburgs but I have too many at the moment. I do like to look at them though.

Might want to post it on the Homburg Nation thread.

 

[mayserwegener]

Interesting! My Super Sport was also sold through Stattmann of Stuttgart. Since there are no records of the shop existing after WWII, it should be pre 1945!

I found a record of STATTMANN-HÜTE , Stuttgart - Königsbau from 1966.

http://www.dav-bibliothek.de/webOPAC/Sektionsschriften/SektionSchwaben/SektionSchwabenNachrichten1966-web.pdf

Go to pages 37 and 48.

 

[le.gentleman]

Thanks for the article!

I got a reply from Lembert stating that they have no information what so ever... I don't really believe that and hence will call in sometime next week.

Mayser did not get back to me. However, I had someone on the phone who ask me to call another day.

 

[le.gentleman]

Here is another Mayser:

 

[Mario]

Very nice looking Homburg. I like the thinner ribbon showing the bowler influence.

I love Homburgs but I have too many at the moment. I do like to look at them though.

Might want to post it on the Homburg Nation thread.

Too many Homburgs! Poor you! I have one black Mayser-Milz that's a wee bit on the loose side of things for me. I'm still looking for a grey/taupe Homburg (I think I posted pictures of the one that slipped me on the bay a few posts back). Grey Homburgs in my size seem to be a rare thing...

 

[Mario]

Here is another Mayser:

Nice one!

 

[mayserwegener]

Thanks for the article!

I got a reply from Lembert stating that they have no information what so ever... I don't really believe that and hence will call in sometime next week.

Mayser did not get back to me. However, I had someone on the phone who ask me to call another day.

Hard to believe Lembert didn't know anything. Hopefully when you call you can find a old timer. Same with Mayser.

Did you try contacting Wegener and Bahner?

Too many Homburgs! Poor you! I have one black Mayser-Milz that's a wee bit on the loose side of things for me. I'm still looking for a grey/taupe Homburg (I think I posted pictures of the one that slipped me on the bay a few posts back). Grey Homburgs in my size seem to be a rare thing...

The grey ones are much harder to come by. My guess is they got more wear so less survived.

I would like to find a Homburg from the originators, Möckel of Bad Homburg. I believe this is a Möckel Homburg in the Gotischen Haus Hutmuseum in Bad Homburg.

http://www.taunustipp.de/Hutmuseum.html

 

[le.gentleman]

Hard to believe Lembert didn't know anything. Hopefully when you call you can find a old timer. Same with Mayser.

Did you try contacting Wegener and Bahner?

No, I did neither contact Wegener nor Bahner - maybe someone else here might want to do that?

 

[mayserwegener]

C. G. Wilke Hutfabrik, Guben, Germany

I found some interesting information regarding C. G. Wilke Hutfabrik, Guben (East Germany) . Appears Guben was important hat making center similar to Nový Jičín (Neutitschein) -> Peschel, Brüder Böhm, Peschel. Unfortunately the hat museum closed in 2005 but the site has some good information.

http://www.acol.de/hutmuseum/index.htm

Translated links.

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-res&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.acol.de%2Fhutmuseum%2Fsammlung.htm&lp=de_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-res&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.acol.de%2Fhutmuseum%2Fausstellung.htm&lp=de_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-res&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.acol.de%2Fhutmuseum%2Fausstellungsort.htm&lp=de_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-res&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.acol.de%2Fhutmuseum%2Fgeschichtev.htm&lp=de_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-res&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.acol.de%2Fhutmuseum%2Fgeschichten.htm&lp=de_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?doit=done&tt=url&intl=1&fr=bf-res&trurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.acol.de%2Fhutmuseum%2Fgeschichtemu.htm&lp=de_en&btnTrUrl=Translate

Photo Gallery

http://www.acol.de/hutmuseum/galerie.htm

This one has a bunch of photos of hat making machinery.

http://www.acol.de/hutmuseum/maschinen.htm

Appears some it was moved here.

http://www.technikmuseen.de/127.0.html

 

[Dreispitz]

That is really an interesting source! I didi not know about this company, nor about the history of the fate of established pre war manufacturers in the GDR.

Shame, that even the museum did not make it in the end. ?

Might ge still existing, though. I found some notes on running exhibitions in the polish part of Guben´s town museum.

Here is another likn to a video of Guben hats. Click on the video with the top hat box

In the film it is mentioned that Mr. Wilke invented the production method for wool felt hats in the 19th century. That raises the question: were there wool felt hats before? Well, wool felt dates back almost to the stone age. High class hats in europe were made of beaver felt, until the beaver was almost extinct. Then hare and rabbit came in. So, it would be interesting to know, what exactly was the innovation in wool felt processing?

The other question would be production scale and quality.

Scale is answered. Their outturn reached up to around 1 million hats p.a. in the 30/40ies. Exports also went to the States, India, China ... .

With that scale and wool felts, I guess they were mainly aiming for the mass budget market. Maybe, I am wrong here, but it would need some real pieces for proof.