Formal Wear Primer

[DocMustang]

Slightly off topic, but I wasn't sure where else to post this question. What is the correct attire to wear underneath academic regalia? I looked about online and it seems that the defacto mode is whatever is correct dress for said commencement ceremony. Any insights anyone?

The commencement mass/graduation ceremony at my university is held in a historic cathedral. The only guidelines we were given was "dark pants and 'appropriate' shoes"

White dress shirt with spread collar(never button down). Select a tie that coordinates with the color of the lining of your hood or stripes on your gown. A tie that TASEFULLY (a gentleman understands that one should NEVER wear a tie with obvious lettering or mascots printed on it) represents your college or university would also be appropriate.

Your pants should be charcoal grey with matching socks. Plain or cap toe oxfords would be the best choice for shoes.

You should have a jacket but it would be stifling to wear under your gown. Once the commencement is over and gowns put away put the jacket on.
There may be a role for morning dress surrounding commencement, particularly if royalty is involved. Otherwise a charcoal suit is sufficient.

 

[Auld Edwardian]

Dear Sir, Your article was well written and interesting. Might I recommend handy book for those that are interested in all things sartorial, that being “Dressing the Man” by Alan J. Flusser. His book is well written and illustrated and gives sound advice on how to dress well in both formal and relaxed occasions. And I must add, I thought that I was the only one that wore starch collars on this forum, bravo to you for raising the bar in doing so!

 

[dhermann1]

Re: Graduation. DON'T do like most of the guys will do, and wear jeans and flip flops. Our own Doran wore a vintage suit and tie under his gown, and sported a nifty pair of spectators on his feet, when he received his PhD at Berkeley the other day. You can't do better than to emulate the good doctor.

 

[Charlie Huang]

Slightly off topic, but I wasn't sure where else to post this question. What is the correct attire to wear underneath academic regalia? I looked about online and it seems that the defacto mode is whatever is correct dress for said commencement ceremony. Any insights anyone?

The commencement mass/graduation ceremony at my university is held in a historic cathedral. The only guidelines we were given was "dark pants and 'appropriate' shoes"

Depends where you are graduating. In Britain, since the gowns are worn open then it is very important that a suit be worn. In places like the ancient ones like Oxbridge, TCD and St Andrews; they prescribe a specific dress code to be worn known as 'sub fusc' (Latin for 'dark or dusky colour') and that term is being commonly applied to specific dress worn under gown outside these places. I often advise people to wear morning dress or black lounge or a dark lounge suit as it would be very appropriate.

In the US, gowns are worn closed so what you wear underneath is really hidden save your trousers and shoes and collar and neck tie. In any case, wear a suit of dark colour and black shoes. For the tie, wear your university's striped tie and if that doesn't exist then your club tie or a tie colour that matches your degree colour.

My rationale is that the colour should come from your gown/hood, not from your sub fusc.

 

[Cobden]

I'd disagree about a spread collar, Doctor Mustang - depending on the meaning - but I would agree that button downs are out. I feel that fairly close points work better myself, on account of the way the hood goes beneath the tie, as it gives a rather nice look akin to a collar pin being worn. I was the only chap in a three piece suit at my graduation (went for a vintage pinstripe), but I feel that three piece is the best option with British style robes (cleaner lines and allows you to wear the jacket open with the lapels slightly over the robe). Agree about sobre ties - either a regimental stripe (regimental, old boys, university club, or university. Perhaps the Lounge Tie) or something with a very plain pattern (think of the sort of pattern you might expect Ronald Reagan to wear). Black oxford or brogues would be safe.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Thanks for the input gents. A three piece is a good idea. I'd heard that in the UK morning dress, or even white tie, is often worn under robes at Oxford. I'll probably forgo the spread collar for one of my standard spear point, 30s-style custom jobs. The ole school tie is a good idea . . . too bad I've never found my particular school's colors, other than in horrid polyester! Unfortunately my regalia is all over the place color wise: emerald green and golden yellow lined hood with tan velvet edging for my specific college, an orange honors mantel, yellow and navy society tassels.

 

[Cobden]

Oxford and Cambridge have a very particular sub fusc. It's not exactly white tie per se, but consists of a black suit, white bow tie and white shirt

 

[Chasseur]

Similar to the other posters I normally go with a dark suit, black plain toe oxfords (or captoes), and university tie. I wear my robe open so I normally have a jacket under it. Unfortunately, we have evening ceremonies so I have not attempted morning dress under the robe. If we had day ceremonies I'm tempted to try it...

Not the best picture but it conveys the concept, forgive the dopey expression and messed up tie we were in process of getting ready here...

 

[Charlie Huang]

Thanks for the input gents. A three piece is a good idea. I'd heard that in the UK morning dress, or even white tie, is often worn under robes at Oxford.

No, they wear subfusc as described here:

http://www.admin.ox.ac.uk/statutes/regulations/48-012.shtml (point 5)

Military uniforms may be worn.

Their guests may wear morning dress or white tie which is appropriate (white tie can be worn in daylight if the event is very formal).

Also, I see the phrase 'candidates who are not members of the University are required to wear formal clothing' is a bit vague. Surely you have to be a member of the Univeristy to read degrees in the first place or is this clause talking about external or 'lifelong learning' students? If so then you could wear morning dress I suppose.

 

[Guttersnipe]

For all the input gents. That's interesting about Oxford, one of my parents' colleagues from grad school did her masters at Oxford and she remembers men wearing either white tie, morning dress, or lounge suits under robe, depending on occasion. But of course, that was the late 60s, and she may not be quite clear on the specific definitions of formal attire.

For what it's worth this is what I opted for:

This what I wore under my robe (such a rebel in my tow-tone shoes, I know, but technically they are correct for a daytime event during May in California):

Oh yes, and just to get the thread back on topic, what is the correct firearm to match with one's dinner suit? Is it bad form to mix a mid 40s Walther P38 with an early 30s dinner suit?

 

[DocMustang]

Oh yes, and just to get the thread back on topic, what is the correct firearm to match with one's dinner suit? Is it bad form to mix a mid 40s Walther P38 with an early 30s dinner suit?

First off young man, Congratulations on your degree. To answer your question, The P38 is far too heavy a pistol for formal occasions. Going for classic designs I prefer a Colt 1908 hammerless.

There are other more modern designs that make really good cumberbund guns. However, I have a rather large issue with treating firearms as a matter of style. The decision to carry half the power of God is one not to be taken lightly nor one to be made light of.

 

[Charlie Huang]

For all the input gents. That's interesting about Oxford, one of my parents' colleagues from grad school did her masters at Oxford and she remembers men wearing either white tie, morning dress, or lounge suits under robe, depending on occasion. But of course, that was the late 60s, and she may not be quite clear on the specific definitions of formal attire.

Well, it depends on what ceremony you are going to and in what capacity. If you're in statu pupillari or a lecturer attending graduation, examination, any formal univeristy ceremony then you must wear subfusc. If you've graduated, not reading any degree, etc going to a graden party or some other event then you won't have to wear subfusc; thus morning dress, etc may be worn.

But I suppose it depends on the wording involved. A 'dark suit' is a bit vague but I suppose you could say that could extend to morning dress and white tie. I'll actually like to ask the Proctors whether this is the case but it seems, now that I have thought about it, to be the case. 'Dress for each sex should be such as might be appropriate for formal occasions.'

 

[Charlie Huang]

Just received clarification from the Oxford Proctors:

'“Dark” doesn’t necessarily mean black. For instance, dark blue would also be acceptable. The definition could be extended to full evening dress or morning dress (provided that the trousers were sufficiently dark), however the Proctors might take the view that wearing morning dress to an exam is not the correct kind of dress for that particular formal occasion. In any case, the jacket (whatever kind) is always covered by an academic gown.'

There you have it. Morning dress can be worn as part of subfusc but not to exams!

 

[adouglasmhor]

Depends where you are graduating. In Britain, since the gowns are worn open then it is very important that a suit be worn. In places like the ancient ones like Oxbridge, TCD and St Andrews; they prescribe a specific dress code to be worn known as 'sub fusc' (Latin for 'dark or dusky colour') and that term is being commonly applied to specific dress worn under gown outside these places. I often advise people to wear morning dress or black lounge or a dark lounge suit as it would be very appropriate.

In the US, gowns are worn closed so what you wear underneath is really hidden save your trousers and shoes and collar and neck tie. In any case, wear a suit of dark colour and black shoes. For the tie, wear your university's striped tie and if that doesn't exist then your club tie or a tie colour that matches your degree colour.

My rationale is that the colour should come from your gown/hood, not from your sub fusc.

I find sub fusc looks strange with bands and no white tie as is required in some professional settings.

 

[Charlie Huang]

I find sub fusc looks strange with bands and no white tie as is required in some professional settings.

You should not wear bands without white tie as that is legal dress (or clerical dress if wearing a cassock). Oh yes, if you're in Holy Orders you can wear a cassock as well for subfusc (often worn with the DD gown).

 

[Anthony Jordan]

On another note, I recently turned up this rather interesting picture of evening dress:

I believe that full evening dress is being worn, as would befit the occasion, although I am not positive on this. The things that struck me included the variety of collars, including two turndowns (one with the ends of the bow tucked underneath it!) and a rounded wing, the strip of broguing on the toe cap of the shoes on the gentleman in the middle, the scoop neck waistcoats, the variety of styles of lapel facing, and the apparent total absence of stripes on the trousers. I don't particularly favour the look, but I think it is interesting nonetheless.

 

[Tomasso]

the variety of styles

This is the reality that the Rules crowd like to ignore.

 

[Dr Kilroy]

There are no stripes on white tie trousers. Rounded wing collars (called butterfly collars) are entirely acceptable, however.

Best regards, Dr

 

[Lokar]

Au contraire, every time I've seen white tie trousers discussed on the lounge, and in all the vintage plates I've seen, white tie trousers have had one or two stripes.

 

[Anthony Jordan]

I would have to agree with Lokar here, at least so far as post-WW1 usage goes.