Finds and Deals - Leather Jacket Edition

[JMax]

The GMW—

 

[Will Zach]

^^
Straighten that tape and it's 19.. Hem width will be key.
That thing is minty, though.

 

[Will Zach]

^^ GMW seller also has this for $250

https://www.etsy.com/listing/1308247487/

View attachment 452037

Cal, right? Somebody please get it for $250.

 

[Blackadder]

Cal, right? Somebody please get it for $250.

Not Cal but looks like it could be an Al's leather. Al's quality is also good, heavy leather, thick silky lining.

 

[Claybertrand]

I usually stay away from sellers who start out like this:

View attachment 452027

I have a basket case and this is much better. LIke the guy says, make him an offer and go from there. No one is going to pay $1500 for this jacket without a lot of questions and pics, no one.

They don't know anything about vintage leather jackets, just like most people. They pick a crazy price, so what? you don't have to pay it.

If you think a mint one is worth $1200 then make him an offer for this one based on that.

Tell me, if you owned this jacket what would you ask for it?

for comparison; a basket case
https://photos.app.goo.gl/n2J3p18MBdz3iGW77

That's a good question. I guess what one's willing to pay depends on the type of buyer/collector.

Personally I only buy jackets that I can wear without having to worry about them falling apart. I like to wear them on a night out, to the gym, to the office, even when running errands. Therefore most of my jackets are in near mint condition. If not I'd have to baby them which would take the fun out of it for me. Therefore I'm not willing to pay much for a jacket like this.

Now from a collector's standpoint this is a crazy rare jacket, a holy grail in reasonable condition. You could search all corners of the internet for years and not find another one like this. If I were that kind of collector and this would be the missing piece from my collection then yeah I'd pay whatever the guy is asking.

I don't begrudge anyone for asking what they want for things they are selling. The Market will ultimately bear out what something is worth and if the Seller really wants to move something, he/she will listen to THE MARKET and adjust their price expectations accordingly.

That said, pretty much---its what @Marc mndt highlighted. I was turned off by the sassy nature in which a person who doesn't seem to know as much about what he has as the prospective buyers do, is setting parameters about "wasting his time" with offers below what HE deems it worthy of. I ESPECIALLY did not like this tone given the guy didn't have a great sales write up at all for this jacket and has no measurements. Smart Sellers asking higher prices can justify their asking more if they are themselves confident and educated on what they have. If the Seller can demonstrate a level of knowledge, you know they know what they have and will be firm on their pricing.

BTW----What in the HELL is with Sellers that say, "MEASUREMENTS UPON REQUEST" or "MESSAGE ME FOR MEASUREMENTS"???!?!?!?!?!!?!?!? You are trying to SELL an item of CLOTHING....... often with NO SIZING LABEL.......... to people who......I don't know.........might want to ...... W E A R it!!!!!!! ANYONE buying it is going to logically ask for measurements!!!!!! How bout just POSTING THEM IN THE LISTING so that you will narrow the inquiries to more interested parties!?!?!?!?!?!?!? Talk about WASTING SOMEONE's TIME!!!!!! I also hate when a car is for sale or a house is for rent or sale and they have NO PRICE given. What is the end game anyway!?!?!?!?! If the point is YOU WANT MONEY FOR SOMETHING YOU HAVE-----why hide the ball from the buyers!?!?!!?!?!? END OF RANT.

EVERYTHING has its price. Even basket cases. I would throw an offer for sure on this jacket if it is in my range. But it would likely WASTE HIS TIME as I would NOT be offering $1500. How hard is it to say NO anyway!??????? Why is bartering wasting his time??? I mean----sure there will be some low balls but this is part of the market dictating the price. How bout DON'T SELL STUFF if you don't want people to try to buy things from you at prices they want to pay.

Americans need to visit the Middle East where the barter system is alive and well. Its an education in arms length deal making that a lot of people could benefit from.

 

[photo2u]

Cal, right? Somebody please get it for $250.

Al's I have that leather hide. Nice not stiff. Heavy.

 

[Bluechel]

How do you spot an Al's?

 

[Bluechel]

YKK zippers?

 

[JMax]

YKK zippers?

And the hide. In pictures, Al’s just look different. It may be a Cal but you aren’t sure. Cals are Cals, if that makes sense. I had an Al, awesome jackets. Someone snagged a great jacket for $250

 

[Claybertrand]

How do you spot an Al's?

I am not an expert............ but it seems that IF you think you found a CAL.......and its in really good shape but you can't find a label.... It could well be an AL's........ (I say this tongue in cheek) ---SO if its a CAL but its NOT a CAL, its an AL's........ I don't think Al's did any Cafe Racers........

@JMax , @photo2u Did Al's also have the fur lined cuffs????

 

[JMax]

I am not an expert............ but it seems that IF you think you found a CAL.......and its in really good shape but you can't find a label.... It could well be an AL's........ (I say this tongue in cheek) ---SO if its a CAL but its NOT a CAL, its an AL's........ I don't think Al's did any Cafe Racers........

@JMax , @photo2u Did Al's also have the fur lined cuffs????

Si señor.

 

[Monitor]

I don't begrudge anyone for asking what they want for things they are selling. The Market will ultimately bear out what something is worth and if the Seller really wants to move something, he/she will listen to THE MARKET and adjust their price expectations accordingly.

That said, pretty much---its what @Marc mndt highlighted. I was turned off by the sassy nature in which a person who doesn't seem to know as much about what he has as the prospective buyers do, is setting parameters about "wasting his time" with offers below what HE deems it worthy of. I ESPECIALLY did not like this tone given the guy didn't have a great sales write up at all for this jacket and has no measurements. Smart Sellers asking higher prices can justify their asking more if they are themselves confident and educated on what they have. If the Seller can demonstrate a level of knowledge, you know they know what they have and will be firm on their pricing.

BTW----What in the HELL is with Sellers that say, "MEASUREMENTS UPON REQUEST" or "MESSAGE ME FOR MEASUREMENTS"???!?!?!?!?!!?!?!? You are trying to SELL an item of CLOTHING....... often with NO SIZING LABEL.......... to people who......I don't know.........might want to ...... W E A R it!!!!!!! ANYONE buying it is going to logically ask for measurements!!!!!! How bout just POSTING THEM IN THE LISTING so that you will narrow the inquiries to more interested parties!?!?!?!?!?!?!? Talk about WASTING SOMEONE's TIME!!!!!! I also hate when a car is for sale or a house is for rent or sale and they have NO PRICE given. What is the end game anyway!?!?!?!?! If the point is YOU WANT MONEY FOR SOMETHING YOU HAVE-----why hide the ball from the buyers!?!?!!?!?!? END OF RANT.

EVERYTHING has its price. Even basket cases. I would throw an offer for sure on this jacket if it is in my range. But it would likely WASTE HIS TIME as I would NOT be offering $1500. How hard is it to say NO anyway!??????? Why is bartering wasting his time??? I mean----sure there will be some low balls but this is part of the market dictating the price. How bout DON'T SELL STUFF if you don't want people to try to buy things from you at prices they want to pay.

Americans need to visit the Middle East where the barter system is alive and well. Its an education in arms length deal making that a lot of people could benefit from.

Recently I've witnessed a rather large argument on a social media post, about whether any measurements other than the size number should be included in the listing and I was shocked how many people argued - Or at least attempted to argue - that measurements are a waste of time. The idea that this even is a debatable subject never even occurred to me.

While one side argued that actually knowing whether an item you are considering paying money for will actually serve its only intended purpose does indeed matter a lot, it is as if the other side couldn't understand that people do wear clothes they buy and defended their position with asinine attempts to justify something that is fundamentally illogical, parroting that only time-wasters request measurements.

My theory is that the anti-measurements camp are people who are exclusively all dumbass re-sellers who don't seem to grasp the idea that someone actually might not want to re-sell a piece of wardrobe.

 

[JMax]

Midwestern Sport Togs Deerskin 44, $70 BIN

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1754215602...CJi9omFSVa&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[Bluechel]

Unless you're buying to throw it in a box, measurements are the ONLY way to even get CLOSE....now we have to train the world how to provide them properly. Can't believe the choices people make to measure a jacket.

 

[Marc mndt]

My theory is that the anti-measurements camp are people who are exclusively all dumbass re-sellers who don't seem to grasp the idea that someone actually might not want to re-sell a piece of wardrobe.

I'll give you a different perspective...

Last week I sold my Eastman A1 on Vinted. I didn't include measurements in my listing and that was on purpose.

I think that to the uninformed buyer measurements can only cause confusion. They might compare them to one of their textile jackets or maybe even to a leather jacket they own but chances are great that those measurements will differ from the A1's measurements which might lead them to conclude that the jacket will not fit them.

Yet when I only list the tagged size they are more likely to take their chances.

It might be hard to believe but I've sold numerous jackets without having stated the actual measurements and without the buyer having asked for them.

 

[Bluechel]

I have to admit that I have too, but mostly Schotts which in standard common styles/models are pretty easy to guess correctly.

 

[Claybertrand]

I'll give you a different perspective...

Last week I sold my Eastman A1 on Vinted. I didn't include measurements in my listing and that was on purpose.

I think that to the uninformed buyer measurements can only cause confusion. They might compare them to one of their textile jackets or maybe even to a leather jacket they own but chances are great that those measurements will differ from the A1's measurements which might lead them to conclude that the jacket will not fit them.

Yet when I only list the tagged size they are more likely to take their chances.

It might be hard to believe but I've sold numerous jackets without having stated the actual measurements and without the buyer having asked for them.

This is interesting--almost surprising to hear as I would assume most people would want to have some degree of certainty on the size. One would think that at the dollar amount some of these jackets can go for, that the buyers would really want those measurements. Unless something is priced so low that its a no brainer not to buy and just move it on if it doesn't fit. At least in the case of the Eastman or another known reputable maker, you can possibly find fit information on their webpages that correspond to a given tagged size. Pretty sure Aero includes some measurements. All of this IF you wanted to track down measurements.

When I first got into the Lounge, I was not into measuring and I have the DON'T FIT PILES to prove it!!! I figured you guys were crazy (It ends up---I was NOT wrong Lol) in doing all these measurements. But when I finally started selling jackets, I HAD to do measurements and I try to do measurement pics so you see the measuring method. Then I started realizing why things weren't fitting me. So I just started being rigid on measurements and only buying in my size range. Its night and day even WITH the oddball measuring some Sellers do. The percentage of jackets that DON'T fit is almost zero. There are degrees of better fit vs. worse etc. But largely, the measurements are key for me. Sometimes, you can comfortably rely on only a couple of key measurements. Like if you can tell they aren't doing a correct Pit to Pit you can look at the totality of the other measurements to gauge fit rather than trying to walk them through exactly how to measure.

The madness that can be the various strange ways Sellers measure is a totally different subject and one on which I'm sure we all have strong opinions and shocking tales to tell.

 

[Bluechel]

My two biggest scores have been pure luck because like many people I don't have the simple "off the rack" body (except for a standard 48 long suit jacket) so it's quite the journey to have the shoulders AND sleeves fit without having the 50" waist to ruin the whole op. Still.....measurements are an absolute must if it's for you and not for reselling. I wonder how many other TFLers buy and sell just to fuel the hobby (madness?) and end up with more jackets for less dough (net).

 

[Monitor]

I'll give you a different perspective...

Last week I sold my Eastman A1 on Vinted. I didn't include measurements in my listing and that was on purpose.

I think that to the uninformed buyer measurements can only cause confusion. They might compare them to one of their textile jackets or maybe even to a leather jacket they own but chances are great that those measurements will differ from the A1's measurements which might lead them to conclude that the jacket will not fit them.

Yet when I only list the tagged size they are more likely to take their chances.

It might be hard to believe but I've sold numerous jackets without having stated the actual measurements and without the buyer having asked for them.

That may very well be so but the premise with which all of my listings are made is whether they contains every bit of information that the buyer should need, rather than what they shouldn't, as after all, the numbers of the correctly measured item do not constitute a misrepresentation eiusdem.

The fact of the matter is, provided that the included measurements are truthful, the buyer will have received exactly what they paid for, id est, what was sold. Buyers misinterpretation of what is otherwise correct information regarding an item cannot and should not be my fault as ways in which any given listing might be misinterpreted are indeed infinite.

Ergo, whist, I in universum, understand your point, I do believe that statistically speaking, more information does constitute a better listing.

After all, truth by definition cannot be wrong.

I miss SF.

 

[Marc mndt]

I figured you guys were crazy (It ends up---I was NOT wrong Lol) in doing all these measurements.

I thought exactly the same when I was new into the leather jacket game. I didn't understand which measurements were relevant, how measurements are taken or what range of measurements would fit me.

Same holds for 95% of buyers on Vinted imo. Even American size numbers like 40-42-44 are confusing to them.
Therefore, imo, when selling on platforms with mostly uninformed buyers, stating the actual measurements won't increase your chances of selling the item. To the contrary, they will probably confuse potential buyers.

This is how I list my jackets there, saying 40 corresponds to medium.