Civil War Forage Caps: A Review of Several Modern Sutlers

[ChiTownScion]

I bought both an officer's kepi and an officer's Hardee hat from Dirty Billy. Excellent quality, but very poor customer service. I waited two and a half YEARS for the kepi to arrive and when it did, it was so small that it fit atop my head like a yarmulke. He did replace it (another 4 weeks) and I finally ended up with a kepi that was a fine complement to my officer's cloak coat.

Got out of the Hobby a few years ago. Portraying a 28 year old regimental surgeon is just plain silly when you're 60. There's a time when we all need to leave the party and I'm glad that I did: now I can spend my spare cash on Art Fawcett's hats and other fine clothing more attuned to the present day.

 

[Doc Glockster]

While we're all reading this thread, I have a question for some of you hardcore reenactors: how do you store your forage caps between seasons?

We all know to store a brimmed felt hat with a hat jack to wick moisture away from the sweatband and prevent shrinkage/deterioration of the sweatband.

Is that necessary with a forage cap?

Right now I keep all but the one I wear frequently in a breathable mothproof garment container, each with its own hat jack stretched just enough to slip under the dowel reinforcement for the visor so the cap doesn't shrink.

I started thinking: is a hat jack really necessary for a hat like this?

 

[Guttersnipe]

The main characteristic of IW kepis is that the crown is shorter than a CW kepi, leaving the wearer with the feeling that it's going to slide off your head.

Dirty Billy's is the only authentic maker I know of, and his are not 100% authentic to that feel, if you judge by the two examples I bought from him.

The trouble is, IW reenacting gear is not nearly as popular as CW gear, so there aren't as many makers.

I would not use the Quartermaster Shop IW kepi. It's not even close.

Superior Cap Co. makes a very good pattern 1872 kepi. They show up in their eBay store from time to time.

 

[Guttersnipe]

While we're all reading this thread, I have a question for some of you hardcore reenactors: how do you store your forage caps between seasons?

We all know to store a brimmed felt hat with a hat jack to wick moisture away from the sweatband and prevent shrinkage/deterioration of the sweatband.

Is that necessary with a forage cap?

Right now I keep all but the one I wear frequently in a breathable moth proof garment container, each with its own hat jack stretched just enough to slip under the dowel reinforcement for the visor so the cap doesn't shrink.

I started thinking: is a hat jack really necessary for a hat like this?

I've never found it necessary to use hat jacks on my kepis or forage cap. When I get home from a weekend in the field, I wipe down and clean the sweatbands same as a vintage fedora, then leave them upside down to air out. I store them all together in a hat box with cedar chips. One thing to bear in in mind though, since my intention is to represent a soldier on campaign in the field, I (almost) never use a hat brush on my "campaigner" hats.

 

[liten]

Superior Cap Co. makes a very good pattern 1872 kepi. They show up in their eBay store from time to time.

yer butt the superior cap is very expensive , and its too bulky around the top edge, not refinded enough for me , dirty bills or starbuck kepi looks more like the orignals

 

[Guttersnipe]

yer butt the superior cap is very expensive , and its too bulky around the top edge, not refinded enough for me , dirty bills or starbuck kepi looks more like the orignals

While you may prefer the style Dirty Billy chose to base his reproduction on over than one Superior chose, saying that Superior Cap Co.'s pattern 1872 isn't accurate is not correct. Nineteenth century U.S. military uniforms and equipment were not centrally manufactured and, even when produced at one of the major arsenals, were frequently made by subcontractors, who themselves often employed their own sub-subcontractors. As a result, there is almost invariably dizzying array of subtle differences between items of the same "pattern."

Also, FWIW, Dirty Billy's pattern 1872 kepi costs $25 more than Superior's. Also, Greg Starbuck unfortunately doesn't regularly make caps for the general public anymore. As a result, his caps actually command a pretty penny on the secondhand market these days...

EDIT: I also think a lot of people confuse the pattern 1880 kepi, which had much lower profile, for the pattern 1872.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Here is an original kepi from the 1870s:

And, for comparison, here is an original kepi from the 1880s:

 

[DaveProc]

I am satisfied my my Jarnigan, the price was right, Free!

 

[Robieman]

View attachment 187071
I am satisfied my my Jarnigan, the price was right, Free!

I have several from Jarnigan. Had them for years. Were made really well and are still in good shape now.

 

[Doctor Jones]

This is an interesting thread, and not the sort I expected to find on The Fedora Lounge!

I started ACW reenacting in the mid-1970s, when it was a strange mix of the residual afterglow of the centennial combined with a hippielike laisser-aller attitude towards authenticity. (By the mid-1980s I was out of reenacting for good.)

Yes for someone with a reenactor past the OP's criticism of reproduction 19th century hats because they don't perform like modern hats is a bit like someone posting on a gun forum a negative review of a reproduction Enfield musket because it only holds one shot. But fair enough, because he did make it clear that he wasn't coming at it from a reenactor's viewpoint.

Anyhow everyone on this thread, if they haven't done, owes themselves a visit to Dirty Billy's in the lovely village of Gettysburg PA. Check out the Irish Brigade shop too, and have a pint in the Garryowen Irish Pub.

About the sizing and fit of hats, we might keep in mind that styles changed considerably from around the beginning of the Civil War to the late 19th century. In the mid-19th century military stand collars were more or less the height that would look right to us today, ditto the size of hats people chose, fully fitting on the head.

But a style thing happed where people wanted more and more of their face and neck to show: military stand collars kept getting lower/narrower and hats kept getting smaller. By the late 19th century you would see tiny hats that we would consider several sizes too small precariously perched on the side of the head.

So when one discusses the fit of a hat one needs to keep the style of the period in mind, if one wants to wear a period hat as it was designed to be worn.

 

[Hurricane Jack]

This is an interesting thread, and not the sort I expected to find on The Fedora Lounge!

I started ACW reenacting in the mid-1970s, when it was a strange mix of the residual afterglow of the centennial combined with a hippielike laisser-aller attitude towards authenticity. (By the mid-1980s I was out of reenacting for good.)

Yes for someone with a reenactor past the OP's criticism of reproduction 19th century hats because they don't perform like modern hats is a bit like someone posting on a gun forum a negative review of a reproduction Enfield musket because it only holds one shot. But fair enough, because he did make it clear that he wasn't coming at it from a reenactor's viewpoint.

Anyhow everyone on this thread, if they haven't done, owes themselves a visit to Dirty Billy's in the lovely village of Gettysburg PA. Check out the Irish Brigade shop too, and have a pint in the Garryowen Irish Pub.

About the sizing and fit of hats, we might keep in mind that styles changed considerably from around the beginning of the Civil War to the late 19th century. In the mid-19th century military stand collars were more or less the height that would look right to us today, ditto the size of hats people chose, fully fitting on the head.

But a style thing happed where people wanted more and more of their face and neck to show: military stand collars kept getting lower/narrower and hats kept getting smaller. By the late 19th century you would see tiny hats that we would consider several sizes too small precariously perched on the side of the head.

So when one discusses the fit of a hat one needs to keep the style of the period in mind, if one wants to wear a period hat as it was designed to be worn.

I didn't know this thread existed either & once started a similar picture thread of original CW veterans & ACW reenactors. I've never been into ACW reenacting but have been exposed to the CW era all my life hearing the stories of my ancestors from my grandfather who heard them firsthand from some of those who lived it, his grandparents. I grew up to take more the historical research approach, participating in roundtables & CW honorary societies, speakers panels, etc, but have always been around ACW reenactors.

All that just to say that I have been aware of modern day suttlers such as Dirty Billy's & their products for a while. As to the original CW hats & their variations in quality & fit, keep in mind that both sides of the conflict would issue purchase order contracts often overlapping, for thousands of hats at a time to various vendors, many of which were offshore & selling to both sides. Standardization was attempted, especially with the Union Army but quality control was yrs away.

 

[Redshoes51]

I am quite taken by the history of the War Between the States... and the various kinds of headwear that the soldiers wore... I have a collection of kepis and forage caps that I am quite fond of... as Hurricane Jack stated above, standardization left a great deal to be desired...

This fellow... Russell Osmianski, makes some great hats... here's his Face Book page... https://www.facebook.com/groups/465700263454026/


The discs on the top of the forage caps seem to have run several different sizes... different types of bills on the caps...

My Dad took me to Vicksburg when I was a kid... bought me a cloth Confederate kepi... and I've been hooked ever since...

~shoes~

 

[dirigoboy]

I was involved in living history for many years before stepping away. Having been out of the loop for a host of years now, I've lost track of the vendors and discussion on authentic gear, yet having been one of the Campaigner ranks, I believed in buying only quality uniforms and equipage, even if it meant I had to wait and save for it.
That said, one vendor who I used to stop by and see on occasion on my way in to Gettysburg was Paul Smith. He may have been unknown to the masses, but among those who believed in quality and research, he was well known. I always enjoyed stopping by his place and he would walk me around and show me the pieces he was working on. I was fortunate to own a couple of his forage caps, as well as a pair of his braces and they were high quality. Since it's been eons, I had to do a search to see if he was still out there and happily, it looks like he is. Some of his hats can be found at S+S Sutlery.
https://ss-sutler.com/headgear.htm

 

[M Hatman]

Standardization was attempted, especially with the Union Army but quality control was yrs away.

Judging by today's standards in mass manufacturing........I am not sure we have achieved good "quality control" yet!

Interesting thread......

MOST mass produced reenacting cloth goods use the wrong weight and weave of cloth....often MUCH heavier than was originally used. The trousers and overcoats are about the closest to the real deal......the caps tend to use way to heavy of a cloth and they never look right (This is also due to using too thick of leather for the bills).

I will say as to the leathers, there is a LOT of good out there, almost too good. Often now using proper company and inspection stamps these will be difficult to separate from originals 100 years from now!

As an aside we also have re enactors filing modern marks off their muskets and stamping them with correct markings.....

There are a LOT of good people offering many goods and cloth items that not only fit the bill, but will be difficult to distinguish 100 years from now.......a collectors nightmare, though a re-enactors dream!!!