Childhood, Today's Kids...and The Goonies

[C-dot]

Computers, video games, home schooling...they're all tools of the overprotective parent.

Especially home schooling. If you live in a school district, I don't understand why you would do this. Don't you want to socialize your children, so they know how to handle themselves in the real world?

 

[Edward]

I don't believe for a minute that Hollywood ha ever reflected true childhood experience. Well, apart from maybe Stand By Me. I would never have done what those kids do in that film at any age, but that said the dynamics of their friendships rang very true. Interestingly, I find myself looking at it in a very different way now, in middle age, than I did back when I first saw it, when I was only a little older than the characters. Age perspective, I suppose.

Especially home schooling. If you live in a school district, I don't understand why you would do this. Don't you want to socialize your children, so they know how to handle themselves in the real world?

It's something that is pretty much unheard of here in the UK, though it does seem popular in the US. The most common reason I hear for the option being taken is where parents who don't want their kids to be taught evolution in science classes, preferring the creationist theory.

 

[C-dot]

It's something that is pretty much unheard of here in the UK, though it does seem popular in the US. The most common reason I hear for the option being taken is where parents who don't want their kids to be taught evolution in science classes, preferring the creationist theory.

Just like in Inherit the Wind. I think its so wrong to limit your childrens' learning... Or anyone's, for that matter.

 

[Yeps]

Especially home schooling. If you live in a school district, I don't understand why you would do this. Don't you want to socialize your children, so they know how to handle themselves in the real world?

I was homeschooled until high school, and I have to say, there is more to socializing that going to class. Every home schooler I knew (myself included) was involved in countless groups and activities. In my case these were mostly theatre/dance and the Boy Scouts. Most of my peers who went to school are actually less socially adept for the real world, because they never really got used to interacting with anyone who was older than them.

It's something that is pretty much unheard of here in the UK, though it does seem popular in the US. The most common reason I hear for the option being taken is where parents who don't want their kids to be taught evolution in science classes, preferring the creationist theory.

This is a common reason, but far from the only one. My older siblings were taken out of school primarily because the classes moved so slowly that they were bored. My sister could read in kindergarten and the school system would not let her read at a faster pace. My brother was similarly frustrated with the slow pace that his classes were going.

I didn't go to elementary school, so I am not sure how it would have worked for me, but I can almost guarantee that they would have been trying to give me ritalin and such, as well as calling me dyslexic. As it was, I just learned in ways that worked for me. I was always very far ahead in math, science, and history, but it took me a little while to catch up in reading. By the time I got to high school, I was the best student in my class (following in the footsteps of my brother and sister).

 

[LizzieMaine]

Didn't the whole homeschooling thing not really take off until the mid-'80s or so? I've never met anyone my age who was homeschooled, but I know quite a few people age thirty and under who were. They don't seem much different socially than those who went to "alternative" schools (Waldorf, Montessori, etc.), except that they won't talk about their school experiences much.

 

[C-dot]

Most of my peers who went to school are actually less socially adept for the real world, because they never really got used to interacting with anyone who was older than them.

I didn't mean to say that all children who are home schooled become Boo Radley, because that would be a silly thing to say, especially given your example. However, I don't know if it relates to better socialization, because I was never home schooled and have always gotten well along with people of all ages. I was also one of the top of my class, even in post-secondary. These were the days before every kid had a learning disability or was prescribed ritalin, though, and as a consequence, had a dumbed-down curriculum.

That leads to an interesting question: Do you think that many perfectly developed children are being labeled with a disability (autism, dyslexia, ADHD) by their parents? My own theory is that they want their children to be more "special" than others. Not surprising in today's self-centered and psychologically obsessed society. It's a shame in the face of children who really do have these disabilities.

 

[sheeplady]

Many of the people I know who home schooled did so because of the school districts they were in- either the education was poor, the school district was considered too violent, or their child had been bullied to the extent they feared for their safety. Some did so for religious reasons.

When I was young (and this was in the early 90s) the tuition was $6,000 a year to attend a neighboring public school district in my state. Home schooling is a lot cheaper. In my area, most school districts only have a single school for a given grade level, so you cannot transfer between schools in the same district to avoid something like bullying, your only choices are a different district or to home school.

 

[PrettySquareGal]

Just today I saw two junior-high looking kids sitting on the curb smoking cigarettes and flipping off passing cars. Ah, what nostalgic memories they'll have one day.

I did that growing up in NYC in the 80s.

 

[Nathan Dodge]

Didn't the whole homeschooling thing not really take off until the mid-'80s or so? I've never met anyone my age who was homeschooled, but I know quite a few people age thirty and under who were. They don't seem much different socially than those who went to "alternative" schools (Waldorf, Montessori, etc.), except that they won't talk about their school experiences much.

I was in high school in the mid '80s and never knew of anyone who was home schooled, but then if they were home schooled I wouldn't have seen them, would I? It seems to have taken off during the late '90s/early '00s phenomenon. I guess I'd want my kids at home instead of at, say, Columbine, with those gun-worshipping monsters stalking the student body.

Even though I'm not particularly sentimental about my childhood--which I count as the start of elementary school ('76) and ending when I began high school ('85), I'm thankful that I grew up in a world that, while dangerous as always, didn't consist of millions of neurotic worrywart--yet permissive parents--who depended on technological gadgets to raise their child and allowed my generation the freedom to roam and play outside and not get into too much trouble. The teen in the opening post (now seemingly deleted off the IMDB) has made a most correct observation in how subsequent generations are doomed to a life at the end of an electronic leash while still being raised poorly.

I'm also amused that this thread is one of the rare free-of-rue topics.

 

[JimWagner]

So you believe that kids remaining indoors these days is due to an improved financial situation and not because of overprotective parents and a fearmongering media?

Yes, in a word. Inside is where their parents have given them their own tv's, video games, pc and internet. All of which are more fun to the kids than running around outside. Add in the basic lack of physical fitness because of sitting around and it's a vicious circle.

 

[JimWagner]

I don't believe for a minute that Hollywood ha ever reflected true childhood experience.

Everyone - repeat after Edward.

 

[kamikat]

It's something that is pretty much unheard of here in the UK, though it does seem popular in the US. The most common reason I hear for the option being taken is where parents who don't want their kids to be taught evolution in science classes, preferring the creationist theory.

I know several families who homeschool. Each family has different reasons. One family is definitely of the "no evolution" variety, but one family does it because they don't want their children exposed to "liberal brainwashing" and "multiculturalism" (usually said with a derisive tone). Another family did it because the Army dad was stationed in a place that had horrible schools and the children went back into school as soon as he was stationed elsewhere. Another family I know did it for the worst possible reason: the school had determined that the oldest had dyslexia and needed special help. Mom refused to see that anything was wrong with her son and pulled her kids out of school in anger. He didn't get the help he needed until several years later but they are now convinced that homeschooling is the only way to protect their kids from the "evil school system".

 

[kamikat]

This is a common reason, but far from the only one. My older siblings were taken out of school primarily because the classes moved so slowly that they were bored. My sister could read in kindergarten and the school system would not let her read at a faster pace. My brother was similarly frustrated with the slow pace that his classes were going.
I didn't go to elementary school, so I am not sure how it would have worked for me, but I can almost guarantee that they would have been trying to give me ritalin and such, as well as calling me dyslexic. As it was, I just learned in ways that worked for me. I was always very far ahead in math, science, and history, but it took me a little while to catch up in reading. By the time I got to high school, I was the best student in my class (following in the footsteps of my brother and sister).

It really depends on where you are. PG county isn't known for a good school system. On the other hand, my kids go to school in Montgomery county, which is frequently rated as the second best school system in the country, behind Fairfax. My children were required to read by the end of kindergarten and were allowed to read as quickly as they wanted. My older son was diagnosed with dyslexia in first grade (it runs in my husband's family) and was given specialized training and went on to read and complete the entire Harry Potter series by the end of first grade. Same with math. He is currently taking high school level math classes at age 12. If the school is good, it will provide the learning experience that the child needs.

 

[Nathan Dodge]

Everyone - repeat after Edward.

Why do some people persist in misrepresenting the topic? I've already stated the following:

No one's claiming that the fantastical events that were seen in The Goonies movie ever approximated reality.

 

[kamikat]

That leads to an interesting question: Do you think that many perfectly developed children are being labeled with a disability (autism, dyslexia, ADHD) by their parents? My own theory is that they want their children to be more "special" than others. Not surprising in today's self-centered and psychologically obsessed society. It's a shame in the face of children who really do have these disabilities.

Don't lump dyslexia in with things like autism and ADHD. Dyslexia has a very concrete set of indicators. My old son has it, my younger does not. Until my son got help, he flip letters and numbers around, wrote them backwards and couldn't really learn math because he saw and wrote the numbers switched. After working with a specialist for about a month in first grade, he suddenly leaped ahead. He's now in all advanced placement classes. Dyslexia runs in families. We knew to look for it from an early age.

 

[kamikat]

I did that growing up in NYC in the 80s.

Me, too! (not the NYC bit, but you know...)

 

[C-dot]

Don't lump dyslexia in with things like autism and ADHD.

They're all very different, but they're all considered disabilities. I knew of a lady who claimed her son had dyslexia, and took him to specialist after specialist because they kept saying he didn't. The same thing happens more often with autism and ADHD, by far.

 

[sheeplady]

That leads to an interesting question: Do you think that many perfectly developed children are being labeled with a disability (autism, dyslexia, ADHD) by their parents? My own theory is that they want their children to be more "special" than others. Not surprising in today's self-centered and psychologically obsessed society. It's a shame in the face of children who really do have these disabilities.

I don't think it is as easy to pinpoint as that. I think there is a combination of growing awareness, perhaps increasing rates of certain issues/ learning disabilities, and unrealistic expectations for some children. Some children are going to be misdiagonosed and missed- period.

I do think that mainstreaming has had a definite affect on the rates of things we see in schools. In the days when "special schools" and institutions were more common, some of the children seen in a typical school environment wouldn't be seen today. Because we have a better understanding of learning disabilities than we did even decades ago, it is more likely that we recognize it as a learning disability and not as the child being "stupid" or misbehaving. Teachers, because they are more aware of these issues, are more likely to refer a child for diagonosis. This is a good thing- because many individuals with these issues fall through the cracks.

With ADHD and ADD, I think a large part has to do with unrealistic expectations. A nearby school wanted to get rid of recess for all children above grade 1 (about age 6-7). I think it is unrealistic to expect a child who is age 8 or even age 10 to sit patiently through a 6 hour day in the same classroom with no break. I don't have ADD or ADHD, and as a adult I have trouble staying in the same room for that long without some type of break- even if it is just a 5 minute walk around the building, or the chance to go outside for a few minutes.

There is also a significant chance that the rates of these learning disabilities actually are increasing as well. I don't deny that some parents are probably misdiagonosing their kids. I've seen parents do a lot of screwy things in my life. Unfortunately, as you said, this takes away resources and casts doubt on the ones who do struggle with these issues.

 

[kamikat]

They're all very different, but they're all considered disabilities. I knew of a lady who claimed her son had dyslexia, and took him to specialist after specialist because they kept saying he didn't. The same thing happens more often with autism and ADHD, by far.

Well, there's something wrong with that lady. Dyslexia has a specific set of symptoms. It's like saying "my son has a cold" but the kid doesn't have a fever or runny nose. It's not a psychiatric disorder like autism or ADHD. The specialist we saw said that flipping letters and switching letters is not uncommon for all children up to a certain age, so is it possible she was having him evaluated too young? They typically evaluate kids at 8 or 9.

 

[kamikat]

I don't think it is as easy to pinpoint as that. I think there is a combination of growing awareness, perhaps increasing rates of certain issues/ learning disabilities, and unrealistic expectations for some children. Some children are going to be misdiagonosed and missed- period.

There is also a significant chance that the rates of these learning disabilities actually are increasing as well. I don't deny that some parents are probably misdiagonosing their kids. I've seen parents do a lot of screwy things in my life. Unfortunately, as you said, this takes away resources and casts doubt on the ones who do struggle with these issues.

They've learned that with many learning disablities, the younger the child is diagnosed and treated, the better chances for mainstreaming. When my brother-in-law was a kid, they didn't diagnose him until he was in high school. Until then, they thought he was dumb because he was a slow reader and didn't really understand what he read. Once he got treatment, he had to bust his bum to catch up. It's the same thing with hearing problems. My kids' elementary school is the magnet school for the county's deaf/hard of hearing kids. They work with them as young as 3 years old so they can be mainstreamed as soon as possible. When I was in school, the deaf kids were always in the special ed classes, even if they were smart.