Berets, Anyone?

[J.L. Picard]

Sexy Béret...

 

[Daan]

Not just military

Reading back the posts about berets, I am surprised how many people link the beret to the military, while soldiers with berets is a relative novelty (apart from the battalion of Chasseurs Alpins in the French army, less then a 100 years).
I guess the beret never really got ground in North America, except among the small group of Basque immigrants, beatniks and film directors. Canada is slightly different from the US, with a number of mills that manufacture nice (civilian) berets (and possibly Quebec helped a bit as well).
On the return in France, the beret (or boina) has never left the streets of Spain, the Czech Republic and to a lesser extent the North Western European countries.
In Uruguay and Argentina the beret is still a very common sight, popularized by the Gaucho culture after being brought in by Basque immigrants in the 19th centrury.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_4sDK3codoaA/SdloVRRDNjI/AAAAAAAAAF0/jjlixElzJYw/s320/Bombeando.jpg
Manufacturers of great quality berets are found in Buenos Aires (Bonigor SA with their Tolosa and Espinosa range), Uruguay (the Fabrica Nacional with their Lanutria and Cataluna models) and Bolivia (Sucre).
I see the beret as the most refined design of any contemporary headwear. Portable, pocketable, practical and elegant they can be used for all occasions.

I am presently working on a book about The Beret and set up a web site along the process; www.BeretAndBoina.blogspot.com Suggestions, interesting pictures, anecdotes or questions are very welcome.

 

[Fletch]

I was given an Espinosa a few years back by a relative who visited Argentina. I'm afraid I couldn't quite bring it off - being a musician, it tends to smack of cliché.

The original: Dizzy Gillespie ca. 1947

 

[Daan]

More labels

Don't know if this is helpful, but Elosegui has five grades.
1. Super luxury (super lujo): top of the line, Teflon coated, in black and blue, other colors on request.
2. Txapeldun: black, other colors on request.
3. Closely-woven Exhibition: in black, blue, red.
4. Fine Exhibition: in five colors.
5. Basic: in black and red, other colors on request. Only one with diamond-shape label.

Here is the label in either of mine:


I doesn't match the labels on their website for any of the grades.
Here is a sampling of the first four, in order:

Adding to Woodfluters post: the Elosegui 'Australia' label is not available anymore. There are many other beret-labels though, some of them real pieces of art in their own kind.

 

[pretty faythe]

I've been wearing a beret (mines crocheted) to work the last few days with my hair tucked under to keep my hair off my neck..the humidity in the convention center...its a killer!!

 

[Edward]

Recently refound the military beret I own - turns out it's German. Label bears the company name Bekleidung u. Mutzen GmbH Berlin [GmbH is the German equivalent of 'ltd' ). I've been wearing it round the house, the red hammer and sickle star I put on it way back still attached - makes an excellent 'head cosy', for now fulfilling the role of a smoking cap for me. etween this and Paddy's great photos, I decided to throw caution to the wind, and having recently been given a small monetary gift by a family member, have now ordered a Basque beret from Ropey Soles (they also sell espedrillas):

http://www.ropeysoles.com/mens_berets.php

I'd rather have seen it modelled by somethin more humanoid.... they do feature a cat prominently on their site, though (I guess puss' head wasn't big enough to model this one!), which I tend to find a good sign.

Judging by the photo of the labels, aboove, the body is pure wool with an acetate lining. I may remove the smaller, white label with the WEnglish script when I get mine, as I think it would look classier without that. The one thing that concerns me is sizing. Their sizing chart told me to order a 56 for a UK7 / US 7 1/8, when in actuality these sizes equate to 57. The site does, however, clearly state that the hats run a little large, so they cite a size to allow for that. In the end I followed their advice as I figured I can always have them change it iff it turnns out to be wrong, and more easily if I'm gonig back saying 'I ordered as advised, but...' rather than 'I ignored your advice and...' lol Just so long as it doesn't shrink over time....

We'll see how this turns out when it arrives. Expect photos then. I plan to wear it with, inter alia the leather jacket Fishmeok made, and which I now own, that was based upon that worn in a photo by a Spanish antifascist fighter during the '36 civil war.

 

[besdor]

After doing quite a few hours of research on berets for my stores , I see now that there is only one factory located in France and the other in Spain. They quality on both are pretty much the same.
My question to beret lovers-what is the most popular diameter beret today. I see that they are available in different widths.
Borsalinos beret is made in Italy , not in France.


Steven
www.bencrafthats.com

 

[Mark Brody]

Someone asked a while ago about military berets. I don't think their question was ever answered. I believe the US military uses Bancroft berets. They're nothing special. Some have liners, some don't. The ones I've seen with a liner were glued in so cheaply that the glue was visible when the beret was worn. Because of this, anyone I've sen with a liner has removed it. That takes care of the poor appearance when the hat is being worn. While it does appear to have a leather band around the bottom with an adjustable tie, the leather band is fake. There may be some sort of deluxe version of a military beret out there, but the military has better things to spend money on than a quality beret that none of the troops will truly appreciate.

Here are a few pictures of my beret. The photo of the inside should give you some idea as to the quality of these things. It's been years since I've worn it, so the second photo isn't in peak condition.

 

[Lone_Ranger]

Whatever happened to officer's peaked caps, shakos, and all those nice hats we used to see people wear, now the beret is worn, simply because it is easy to fold up and such. Its a shame really.

You've answered your own question. The shakos, campaign hats, and peaked caps went out, with the common use of the steel helmet. When you are wearing the helmet, you have to keep the other hat somewhere. A shako would take up your entire pack, and the campaign hat would look like a taco. The beret rolls up, and still looks good when you unroll it after a week in the field. It may not keep the sun out of your eyes, but it does keep you head warm when you are wearing a high-and-tight all the time. And it's offered in many colors for unit identification. Thus in some ways it is very practical.

 

[Kreissaege]

I just received my one-size-fits-all 13" beret and how do I make it fit my size 61 noggin?
Cut away some fabric around the hole or what?
Please advise me!

 

[Mark Brody]

The shakos, campaign hats, and peaked caps went out, with the common use of the steel helmet.

It's not entirely out. I still wear my peaked cap whenever I'm in my dress uniform. I'd say about 1 in 20 men have them, and even fewer wear them. Being a hat aficionado, I like them, and don't mind carrying it under my arm.

 

[Lone_Ranger]

It's not entirely out. I still wear my peaked cap whenever I'm in my dress uniform. I'd say about 1 in 20 men have them, and even fewer wear them. Being a hat aficionado, I like them, and don't mind carrying it under my arm.

I believe that the peaked, or 'service cap,' is authorized (US Army) for Corporal and above. Worn at the discretion of the Commanding Officer. And, I do admit it looks better in a dress situation, than the beret. My premise still applies. It would be a bit hard, to do close quarters battle, with a peaked cap tucked under one arm.

Maybe that's why I look at it the way I do. I always hated the "ball cap" style BDU hat. I thought it was the least military looking hat a soldier could wear. For me, the beret was a welcome change. When it comes to 'packable' headwear, I prefer the beret, to the garrison cap.

I'm with you in missing the days of distinct Class-A dress caps/hats.

 

[Edward]

It's not entirely out. I still wear my peaked cap whenever I'm in my dress uniform. I'd say about 1 in 20 men have them, and even fewer wear them. Being a hat aficionado, I like them, and don't mind carrying it under my arm.

From an outsider's purely aesthetic point of view.... if you're going to have a dedicated dress uniform, then I favour the idea of a distinct, separate hat for the same. (I imagine where this is not done, it's a combination of the military having better thnigs to spend the money on, and perhaps being unwilling to require troops to buy another hat.... I guess it could be optional, but that starts to lose the point of dress uniform, which is surely where conformity across all personnel at same rank should be at its maximum?) I've seen berets with full dress uniform; I particularly remember a young soldier attending what I took to be his girlfirend's graduation ceremony - which also happened to be that of a then-girlfriend of mine - in full dress uniform. Looked really sharp, all apart from the beret, which just seemed oddly out of place. That said, my first association with the beret is always going to be squaddies on patrol in Northern Ireland - back not long post-ceasefire when they sent them out in the beret instead of the combat helmet. (Community relations issue - personally, I think the folks that would consider themselves threatened by the army would have been more likely to prefer they lsot the guns , but that would kinda defeat the point, eh? lol ). for this reason, they're something I just always associate with combat gear, I suppose.

 

[Mysterious Mose]

How you doin' Edward,

I have the Vrai Basque beret, it's really nice. Very maquisard. My 59 fits my 59-7 3/8 head perfectly. It does have a drawstring sewed to the sweatband, so you should be alright.

M.M.

 

[BellyTank]

Snap!

59- Snap!

Mark Brody, my apologies for your photo reminding me of Animal House.
Maybe that was a chromed helmet, though. Maybe it's the Ascot.
Pretty sharp, anyway.

B
T

 

[Mysterious Mose]

Crackle!

The sweatband did.

 

[BellyTank]

Pop!

-a new one in then, Daddyo.
(just wait, for gratuitous dairy activity...)


B
T

 

[Mark Brody]

From an outsider's purely aesthetic point of view.... if you're going to have a dedicated dress uniform, then I favour the idea of a distinct, separate hat for the same. (I imagine where this is not done, it's a combination of the military having better thnigs to spend the money on, and perhaps being unwilling to require troops to buy another hat.... I guess it could be optional, but that starts to lose the point of dress uniform, which is surely where conformity across all personnel at same rank should be at its maximum?) I've seen berets with full dress uniform; I particularly remember a young soldier attending what I took to be his girlfirend's graduation ceremony - which also happened to be that of a then-girlfriend of mine - in full dress uniform. Looked really sharp, all apart from the beret, which just seemed oddly out of place. That said, my first association with the beret is always going to be squaddies on patrol in Northern Ireland - back not long post-ceasefire when they sent them out in the beret instead of the combat helmet. (Community relations issue - personally, I think the folks that would consider themselves threatened by the army would have been more likely to prefer they lsot the guns , but that would kinda defeat the point, eh? lol ). for this reason, they're something I just always associate with combat gear, I suppose.

Berets, I think, are the only hat that works with every military uniform. Unfortunately, it also seems to be the second best hat to wear with any military uniform. There are hats that are much better suited for a combat uniform than a beret. There are also much more appropriate hats to wear with dress uniforms.

You're absolutely right about standardization of dress uniforms. That's the one time everyone really should look exactly the same. As far as the expense of the peak caps is concerned, they cost about 3 times as much as the flight caps/garrison caps/piss-cutters (call it what you will), but they last about 10 times as long. The only inconvenience, than, is not being able to tuck it under your belt. I really hate the flight cap. It looks like you took a mailing envelope and turned it upside down on your head (not to mention the horrible tan line it leaves on your forehead).

 

[Kreissaege]

I definitly like my new 13.5" basque cap:

 

[Orvil Newton]

Part of the uproar about the general issue beret in the Army was the choice of the black beret, which had previously been designated as headgear for Rangers. That's how mine was issued to me. Dark green was for the SF boys. Maroon/red to the 82nd Airborne. I believe in the past, the 101st Airborne (Air Assault) had its own beret as well. By making the blak beret general issue, it seemed to diminish the value of that issued to the Rangers over the years. The tan/khaki beret currently issued to Rangers gives them back their identity, but at the cost of their history.

I recall reading once upon a time that Navy SEALs issued a beret. Anyone know if that's accurate?

By the way, my beret is on a shelf with numerous other items of my personal history. Purely decorative, not worn any longer. Doesn't fit anymore, as I don't wear a high and tight haircut.

I served in the US Army from 1966 to 1980 (The horrible ugly baseball-type cap era) Actually from the tail end of the "Castro" cap days.

After the US Army Special Forces became popularly known as "Green Berets", Rangers, who felt equally special, adopted the black beret and some airborne troops started wearing the maroon (82nd IIRC) and the "Screaming Eagles" 101st (Bi-polar Airborne/Air Assault) adopted dark blue as their distinctive unit headgear. By the early seventies, there was a rash of unauthorized "Special" unit headgear, mostly berets of different colors; red for artillery, light blue for infantry, even orange for signal corps. Some units of air and armored cavalry adopted black Stetson campaign hats reminiscent of the Indian wars era. After about 1977 the Army started cracking down on distinctive unit headgear eliminating most, ultimately giving berets to everyone.

That's the way I remember it anyway.

IMO, the beret is no worse than the overseas cap for dress uniform wear and is preferable to, at least in terms of convenience, the garrison cap. However, I can't imagine how anyone could propose a beret for fatigue duty.