Aero Leather Clothing trial update

[hidetanner]

Who are the dodgy characters

 

[Sloan1874]

Go and read the trial narrative thread, then tell us who you think they are, hidetanner.

 

[Big J]

I think it would be a good idea to perhaps sticky this thread, if possible. That way, once this is all over and buried, someone won't buy an Alexander, chance upon this thread, and regret supporting a business if they feel as most do in this thread.

Also it's then unnecessary to be off topi

That's a fair point. It's my fault, sorry.

 

[Big J]

Who are the dodgy characters

Well, Will Lauder isn't a dodgy character, he's a convicted criminal.

The dodgy characters, IMHO, are all those who knew in full or in part, about Will's illegal activity, and assisted him by doing nothing, during his time at Aero, and then followed him to Alexander Leathers.
Also, there's Alexander Leathers, who are dodgy for not being honest about themselves, and re-writing/removing statements that link them to Will Lauder on their website.

Whatever the truth of the suspicions outside of the established facts of the court case, Alexander Leathers looks as dodgy as hell to me, and seems to have embarked from day one on a concerted campaign to put Aero out of business (hence the selling of Horween jackets below market value).

It does no good if Alexander Leathers indulges in a 'race to the bottom' in order to bankrupt competition, since that also harms suppliers, and customers too. Not to mention the vintage manufacturing skills that will be lost when staff leave the industry.

Dodgy, dodgy, dodgy. Alexander Leathers and all their now hidden/deleted connections to convicted criminal Will Lauder. Maybe you've met him? You're in Scotland too...

 

[Sloan1874]

I think the narrative could justify a sticky, but I'm not sure the update thread does - there's a lot of info but also a lot of 'comment'.

 

[Big J]

I think the narrative could justify a sticky, but I'm not sure the update thread does - there's a lot of info but also a lot of 'comment'.

Definitely a 'sticky' for the narrative.

As Superfluous has shown, there are people in the trade out there denying things established as fact in court.

 

[Sloan1874]

Yes, once we have the sentencing in, I'll add an appendix of sorts, mopping up the stuff that didn't have a natural 'fit' within the narrative, such as the accountancy evidence. It's interesting but very much a digression - we spent two days listening to both sides, but it all fell to pieces when the defence's witness admitted that he had no idea that Aero produced high-end leather jackets, which effectively rendered most of his evidence kinda pointless [huh].

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I really can't see the FL making a sticky out of either thread. I haven't notice this forum putting themselves in that position in the past...unless I've missed something.
I think that some of us sometimes have a tendency to become a little personally over zealous at times about certain issues and lose sight of what this forum is really about.
From my perspective, the Aero Trial Narrative was endorsed by the FL to provide proven information in order to clear up any confusion for those who are interested and the Update thread in order to vent.
Most likely, these topics will remain available to link to, when or if done in an appropriate manner. In the update 'vent' thread other good info was dug up with opinions of probable 'why and how' actions taken by AL and others. However, I still honestly can't see piling on someone if they dare mention interest about purchasing an AL jacket. Things need to play out more and see what the future may hold.
As far as Will Lauder is concerned, the court findings and, I assume sentencing and possible civil trial info will be added on the trial narrative.
With all this info and various opinions remaining on the FL, anyone can find it if they so desire.
Just my 2¢ once again, fellers...
HD

 

[Peter Mackin]

Yes, once we have the sentencing in, I'll add an appendix of sorts, mopping up the stuff that didn't have a natural 'fit' within the narrative, such as the accountancy evidence. It's interesting but very much a digression - we spent two days listening to both sides, but it all fell to pieces when the defence's witness admitted that he had no idea that Aero produced high-end leather jackets, which effectively rendered most of his evidence kinda pointless [huh].

I also picked up two of my four jackets up from the factory & the promised receipts didn't get sent on to me,,,,,I paid Mr Lauder in nice crisp banknotes,,,,,go figure

 

[Fanch]

I also picked up two of my four jackets up from the factory & the promised receipts didn't get sent on to me,,,,,I paid Mr Lauder in nice crisp banknotes,,,,,go figure

Cash on the barrel head minus receipt equals no paper trail and possible unreported income to the appropriate taxing authority.

 

[KILO NOVEMBER]

I've been looking all over TFL for the trial narrative thread and all I can find is this discussion of the trial narrative thread. Where do I find it?

 

[BobHufford]

I've been looking all over TFL for the trial narrative thread and all I can find is this discussion of the trial narrative thread. Where do I find it?

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?82006-Aero-Trial-Narrative

 

[Edward]

The old cliche that 'people could leave their doors unlocked' because the Krays and co kept everyone in line wasn't true. You just have to walk into the Blind Beggar close to where Ed lives to see what the Twins were really like: it's where George Cornell of the Richardson gang was shot by Ronnie. A lovely place for a pint nowadays, though...

Yeah. Fascinating people. Possibly glamourous in a certain way, but very definitely not folks you'd want to cross, or even be around. I've met some very charming poeple in my time who I suspect were also paramilitary murderers back in the old country. Even the devil loves his own, an aw that. Wrapped in the contemptible flag of one patriotism or another, but ultimately no different than any other orangised crime gang. I have no time for dispalys of self-righteous chest-beating, but equally I found it pretty sickening when pointless airheads like Barbara Windsor used to take up the Krays as a celebrity cause.

Cornell... Nasty piece of work, worked as an enforcer for the Richardsons. Their big thing was drugs; the Krays were a low-level protection racket by contrast. Cornell was a very nasty piece of work.... and also stupid enough to shoot his mouth off round the East End, calling Ronnie Kray a "fat poof". (Ronnie was strangely ahead of his time with regards to being entirely comfortable with his sexuality, and unashamed of it, but he was also a very manly man type who took great offence at being called effeminate, or, indeed, disrespected in any way.) I'd never condone what Kray did, obviously, but it's hard to mourn lowlife like Cornell all the same. Jack McVitie - called "the Hat" because this vain little man (metaphorically speaking - he was six two phyisically) always kept his hat on indoors, the better to hide his bald spot - was much the same. He once threw a woman with whom he was having a relationship from a moving car because she commented on his baldness. She broke her back. Some have claimed she was pregnant at the time. So, yeah. Ronnie and Reggie were nasty people, and deserved to go to prison for murdering some other people, who were themselves pretty nasty.

They say crime doesn't pay..... I don't know about that, but certainly had the Krays gone legit when the casinos were legalised, and kept their noses clean, they'd have been fine. Earlier than that, Reggie showed promise as a boxer (Ronnie always flew off the handle too easily to have the mental control a rewal champion needs), but that was done for when they got in trouble with the law early on, while AWOL from national service. Ronnie, however, was in love with playing at being Al Capone, and Reggie would never cross him. The most interesting element of Ronnie Kray's character is his mental illness; a lot of his obsessions and violence was certainly exacerbated by undianosed problems - he was probably bipolar, and quite possibly skitzophrenic too. Quite possibly this contributed to the lack of self control that was his ultimate undoing.

I have little real sympathy for Cornell and McVitie. Those I pity were the shop owners and others leaned on for protection money, groceries for which they were never paid, and such. The 1990 film, The Krays had its flaws, but it was certainly accurate as to the type of people involved. I'm interested to see two new films due out soon; one starring Tom Hardy as both twins, the other written by a guy who live in the East End at the time and remembers the truth of the Krays, filmed on a low budget, on location in the East end. I hope they at least get the Begger right this time - the 1990 version looked nothing whatsoever like the real thing! A lot like Dillnger, ultimately, the Krays: easy to paint as Robin Hood, folk hero types unless you were the one that got hit.

Wildly off topic, but.... [huh]

 

[HoosierDaddy]

I've been looking all over TFL for the trial narrative thread and all I can find is this discussion of the trial narrative thread. Where do I find it?

Quite easy really. Just click on the "Outerwear' section and scroll down...or type in 'Aero narrative' in search.
HD

 

[Sloan1874]

I think it'll be down to mods to decide if it has use to the Lounge beyond its current interest. Certainly, whatever happens, I should be locked once it's completed, but I'd argue it will have an abiding interest and use as the trial explains a lot of stuff that happened over the past four years which, from the outside, appeared strange and was prone to misinterpretation.
What is interesting, though, is that when you look at the case overall, the single pebble that caused the landslide, so to speak, was the anonymous guy who posted his jacket on the Iron Heart forum with the comment that he got a 'great cash deal' with the owner of Aero. If he hadn't done that, KC and LC's suspicions about Will's actions would not have aroused and they wouldn't have dug up Will's eBay account.

 

[Bunyip]

It's often the way Sloan. The smallest coincidence or a very random comment brings everything undone. I caught a staff member drinking a red bull out the back one night after a really bad stock take, and told her to pay for it. She burst I to tears and said " what about the money x and y have been stealing?" Boom! Uncovered a huge theft ring that my bar manger and two best bar guys where running. Manipulating stock takes etc. Sadly for them it was in Dubai, 3 guys jailed for 5 years account s frozen etc, turned out to be over $100k USD over 2 years....would never have known if the silly girl hadn't stolen a $2 drink.

 

[ProteinNerd]

Wow!

 

[dan_t]

Wow +1 !
Live an honest life, earn what you are given & have nothing to worry about. Karma is a fierce enemy.

 

[Sloan1874]

That's amazing. But it's the collusion in that sort of situation that I find fascinating. These things are never seem to be one person acting just by themselves, even if it's others just tacitly turning a blind eye to what they're up to.

 

[Bunyip]

I don't think there is a great deal of honour amongst thieves these days. From my experience once the cats out of the bag it's everyone for themselves.