Aero ebay frustrations

[Silverpoint]

Schitz fer Prez!

 

[ButteMT61]

...

 

[HoosierDaddy]

A shocking new voice rings in town! Yay! You guys really need to find a place where the residents are a little more dense. I guess you're used to myspace or something.

Aw come on..a good case of the schitz can rejuvenate the plumbline.

 

[coloradorider]

Waiting for an aero on ebay is just like waiting for a bus.
Nothing in my size for months then about 5 come along at once.

I share your issues in finding Aero leather jackets on ebay. Between weeding through the borderline "Key Word Spamming" listings that Worf noted, the Pearl Izumi Aero jackets (an excellent light-weight bicycling jacket BTW), and the Aeropostale stuff on ebay is a chore.

I have been outfitting my clientele for over 20 plus years and the reason they come back year after year is they trust my judgment. Aero makes a nice jacket, But Al and some other makers make them just as well and with the same or superior hides. All I ask is people make a fair judgment, try one in person before making any judgment. It only makes sense. Ignore the bias on the group and go with the designs that catch your eye, gets that lust going for a new prize.

I am here to be honest and up front, not kiss peoples asses and make the wrong kind of friends. I have an established clientele of over 20 years that come back year after year, That doesnt happen if you do not treat people right.

I've bid on a Lost Worlds A-1 you listed on 2-3 years ago. I've been waiting, impatiently ever since, and not seen another come through in my size although you've had listings for Lost Worlds, Aero, Alexander Leathers, and a lot of A-2's. You seem to be in a unique position to share opinions on these jackets since so few of the members here would have the opportunity to see so many. I would personally appreciate you continue to share your observations on the makers and leathers and do some actual comparisons when possible. If you're partnered with Alexander Leathers all the better if you can help your customers make informed decisions. I feel competition between jacket makers is good for the consumer otherwise Himel would be the only maker still selling a 20's jacket knock off like this one.

No, the current crew ARE Aero. The others, a p*ss-poor imitation for a while...the evidence of unhappy Storse customers and other foxes paws is duly documented...

Anyone have an informed estimate of when the discussed legal proceedings re: storse will be done? I'm anxiously waiting to see how this turns out. I disagree with the "p*ss-poor imitation" comment though. My Aero Highwayman was built by Moira and the jacket cutter are both now at Alexander Leathers. Are you suggesting their change in address means they forgot their craft and make a "p*ss poor imitation" or are all the jackets they made previously "p*ss-poor". This sounds like a strong opinion but I'm a little confused whether the jacket I own is sh*t or just any that are built in Selkirk and not Galashiels.

Disappointing that Will's reputation is where it is now as compared to this thread from three years ago - "read this". I liked Will's adventurous spirit in letting a customer try just about anything to a jacket design and offering polite opposition if the design change seemed inappropriate. This is quite the contrast to Ken who seems very reluctant to make changes to jacket patterns - even simple ones like the leather hem option so many FL members prefer. I'm not suggesting either approach is wrong, just different.

FTR, Horween's position in this mess is anything but transparent.

I feel Horween's position is the clearest in the storse issue. They were informed by Ken Calder that Will Lauder was mislabeling heavy steerhide as heavy FQHH jackets and issued a joint statement with Aero. What isn't clear is the scope and timing of the criminal and civil proceedings mentioned in the statement and what role Horween will play going forward, here.

Ignore all the rumours, both the MM story and the end of the old Aero staff - people got "screwed".

I personaly have had only good experience with Aero and all my jackets are bought from Will and Amanda, I have had nothing fishy going on so I should be happy. In fact I have been more "weierdly" handled by the new staff. But when it comes down to it, the old crew lied, the new crew doesnt - what is more important when sinking $1000 into a jacket? You decide.

Personally its gonna take time before I feel fully comfortable with either.

To be fair - Holly (the new management at Aero and Ken Calder's daughter - founder of Aero) has been great working with me on making three jacket orders I placed through Mark Moye right. I paid for two new jackets I never received and returned a third jacket that he never refunded my money for. $2500 grudgingly refunded after spending hours on the phone with Paypal to finance future jacket purchases. Mark Moye was Aero Leather USA - not to be confused with Aero Leather Clothing since he was only a reseller... I got jerked around by Amanda in the churn near the end of her time at Aero so it would take a satisfactory resolution of the storse issue for me to even consider doing business with Alexander Leathers.

With respect to the OP - I bought InLikeFlynn's Goodwear Californian and couldn't be happier. Expand your search for manufacturers (unless you want Horween's CXL - Aero seem to be the only game in town for that leather), good luck finding the jacket you want, and don't get stuck with a storse jacket off ebay (unless you want something exotic), and jackets are like Lays potato chips in that you'll have more than one...

 

[rocketeer]

'Keyword spamming' and Aero dont really mix in my opinion. Nor Aero Jacket and a few other forms. Try it, the largest contributor to the word Aero and Leather appears to be SAAB motor cars, Aero can also bring up ventilated motorcycle jackets by Dainese, Alpinestars etc plus many other item descriptions.

J

 

[Edward]

'Keyword spamming' and Aero dont really mix in my opinion. Nor Aero Jacket and a few other forms. Try it, the largest contributor to the word Aero and Leather appears to be SAAB motor cars, Aero can also bring up ventilated motorcycle jackets by Dainese, Alpinestars etc plus many other item descriptions.

J

I've seen a *lot* of it on eBay UK in recent months, typically in relation to anything approaching an A2. Lots of the Saab stuff too, but this is rising. I see the same with Buzz and other TMs being infringed in this way too. There is a US eBay seller also using Aero's name in auctions for multiple new jackets. It's all (in relation to same/similar goods, that is) both TM infringement, and agsinst eBay's own rules. I'm inclined to start reporting these auctions as I see them, though eBay is notorious for doing nothing unless they are threatened with legal action by TM owners. They are certainly quick enough off the mark when Rickenbacker get on their case, as those guys are prepared to follow through.

 

[majormajor]

Anyone have an informed estimate of when the discussed legal proceedings re: storse will be done?

Just to be clear, the "discussed legal proceedings" do NOT concern the "storse" issue. That has already been dealt with, by Aero replacing jackets where this has been discovered.

Cases where a large amount of evidence is involved can take many months to collate - but ultimately they will come to fruition. They WILL happen - but we have to be patient. No amount of "put up or shut up" (not from you, CR, but we do see it in here) is gonna get any more details discussed on here. Jeopardising legal proceedings is stupid, and possibly illegal.

 

[schitzo]

Aw come on..a good case of the schitz can rejuvenate the plumbline.

lol

well played HD that is very good for you

 

[schitzo]

I feel Horween's position is the clearest in the storse issue. T

I don't speak for Horween. But if you consider all of the info, and perhaps a few other possibilities, it absolutely isn't


BTW, to my surprise I got an email from aero Ken today. Apparently it was 11 out of 19 who went to AL and not the 13/14 as previously stated by me

 

[Grayland]

The one thing that caught my attention in this mess and I haven't seen anyone address it is the Horween issue. I'm honestly not trying to lob a grenade in this mess. I was one of the very last people to make a deposit with Aero USA and I did get a refund from PayPal. I also bought a seemingly new Aero LHB off eBay that was made during the "Storse era" It never occured to me to check if it was HH or Steer - it is a great jacket regardless, but I can understand people being angry is they were mis-led.

So here it goes and there may be an easy answer or something I missed, ....but If WL is guilty of mis-labeling Horween leather as this press release states:

http://www.aeroleatherclothing.com/news-detail.php?id=131

why is Horween associated with WL at Alexander Leathers as below:

08/04/13

Horween Leather Company™

We at Alexander Leathers are delighted to announce that Horween Chromexcel Steerhide 1.4mm is now available to pre-order in Black, Havana Brown and Dark Burgundy.

 

[Sloan1874]

:thumb::eusa_clap

 

[Swoosed]

I don't speak for Horween. But if you consider all of the info, and perhaps a few other possibilities, it absolutely isn't


BTW, to my surprise I got an email from aero Ken today. Apparently it was 11 out of 19 who went to AL and not the 13/14 as previously stated by me

Man i don't want o touch this but i have to. the fact that horween is selling thier hides to AL should be telling enough for anyone with an OPEN MIND!. I have jackets from BOTH manufacturers, a fact that not many of the aerophiles on here can atest to, which kind of makes all thier input BS since they have nothing to compare with and have no idea what they are talking about. Both companies make a fine product. I have personnaly seen in the past that Aeros QAQC was lacking, but in all fairness they do agree to make it right. I have to say that both companies have fine employees and wish them both the best of luck. Personally, I'm interested in the one who will construct MY custom jacket the way I want it made.

Now back on topic, I wouldn't buy an Aero on Ebay anymore due to the whole mislabling issue, alot of what I see on there is BS and either the sellers know it or they don't either way it's still questionable.

 

[Otter]

All depends on how busy the District / Sherrif Court is where it is being prosecuted and how long the PF is taking to assemble the case. I would expect around 18 months to two years before the case is finaly called.

 

[Edward]

Cases where a large amount of evidence is involved can take many months to collate - but ultimately they will come to fruition. They WILL happen - but we have to be patient. No amount of "put up or shut up" (not from you, CR, but we do see it in here) is gonna get any more details discussed on here. Jeopardising legal proceedings is stupid, and possibly illegal.

The Contempt of Court Act 1981 is pretty tight on that sort of thing. The internet, of course, has opened this up immensely as a discussion that previously would have had a circulation that wouldn't have gone near the area in which the case is to be held now does indeed. Many factors involved and it's more an art than a science, but better safe than sorry.

All depends on how busy the District / Sherrif Court is where it is being prosecuted and how long the PF is taking to assemble the case. I would expect around 18 months to two years before the case is finaly called.

If I recollect correctly, across the UK as a whole, one year is about the norm for criminal charges, approaching two years for civil suits.

 

[Capesofwrath]

Man i don't want o touch this but i have to. the fact that horween is selling thier hides to AL should be telling enough for anyone with an OPEN MIND!. I have jackets from BOTH manufacturers, a fact that not many of the aerophiles on here can atest to, which kind of makes all thier input BS since they have nothing to compare with and have no idea what they are talking about. Both companies make a fine product. I have personnaly seen in the past that Aeros QAQC was lacking, but in all fairness they do agree to make it right. I have to say that both companies have fine employees and wish them both the best of luck. Personally, I'm interested in the one who will construct MY custom jacket the way I want it made.

Now back on topic, I wouldn't buy an Aero on Ebay anymore due to the whole mislabling issue, alot of what I see on there is BS and either the sellers know it or they don't either way it's still questionable.

Do you or indeed anyone know if Horween is selling leather to AL? They are getting some supplies but that doesn't mean they are getting them from Horween. The FQHH is not available from AL and is a main reason to buy a jacket from Aero for me.

I've bought from both, but the quality of Aero's hide swings my preference their way. I was not impressed by ALs light steer but their goat hide was very good. I don't like their designs much either, but having said that I'm not impressed by Aero's latest efforts. The twenties and early thirties seem to be the flavour to savour right now but those styles leave me cold for the most part.

 

[Sloan1874]

Front Quarter Horses for courses, no? My understanding is that Horween has sold some steer to AL, but not horse. Don't know if the former's an ongoing situation, though. [huh]

 

[ButteMT61]

IAnyone have an informed estimate of when the discussed legal proceedings re: storse will be done? I'm anxiously waiting to see how this turns out. I disagree with the "p*ss-poor imitation" comment though. My Aero Highwayman was built by Moira and the jacket cutter are both now at Alexander Leathers. Are you suggesting their change in address means they forgot their craft and make a "p*ss poor imitation" or are all the jackets they made previously "p*ss-poor". This sounds like a strong opinion but I'm a little confused whether the jacket I own is sh*t or just any that are built in Selkirk and not Galashiels. ...

What I'm talking about here is the eBay "rep" using the Aero history as a selling point for their AL lineup. That, and the incredible similarity with the lineups.I also find so many new folks here overlooking the past with numerous issues to fly the flag of this new endeavor in a place that was filled with people who got taken. In more ways than one.And for personal taste, I've not seen any examples of anything I say "wow, I gotta have that". I've not commented on them as it's not appropriate - I generally don't post negative comments on jackets I don't like - I ignore them.In the end, I saw the original Aero company and lots of clients get the shaft. I also hear of the impending legal issues and think "do I want to do business there?". The answer is no. The deal sealer was the guy above posting as an "impartial haberdasher". If you got an AL jacket and like it, that's awesome. But I have to laugh a bunch of new folks dissing the experiences of the longer-term regulars that went through (or saw) all the drama of the last few years...

 

[GriffDeLaGriff]

Griff, that's spoken like a fact

I thought the whole point was to not speculate any further. If that still is true, then as there is no proof of the new crew lying, then the fact as of now is that they dont lie about what hide you pay for.

 

[Jeff M]

A fair amount of touchy history going on with Aero/AL. Many of those who were affected either by the Aero USA situation or "Cowgate" when Aero was run by the old management/current AL group have strong feelings.

Toss in some folks with an initially non-disclosed financial interest promoting the manufacturer they carry......sometimes it's hard to separate out the product from the dust it stirs up.

There are a couple of reasons why I haven't been tempted by AL.
I am a big fan of Horween's full weight FQHH with Aero's designs. Unless they haven't gotten around yet to changing their web site, AL does not offer this.
From what I can tell, most of AL's designs seem to be slight variations of what Aero offers. Being used to Aero's, AL's just look a bit "off" to me. If I want an "Aero like" designed jacket, I'll buy an Aero.
I haven't had the chance to see an AL up close and personal, but so far the photos I've seen haven't excited me.

I have no complaints about Aero's customer service. They seem to have bent over backwards to handle the unfortunate situations that occurred under prior management.
I currently have an Aero half belt purchased about 2 years ago that I had lined with rayon lining in the sleeves. (Based on recommendations of some folks here.) Back then, Aero would not line a FQHH jacket with just rayon in the sleeves. They used a double lining..with cotton twill between the rayon and the leather. (I was told this was because otherwise the rayon would wear through quickly).
The jacket is a beaut...but I rarely wear it as the sleeve lining bunches up down at the wrist when I put it on....very very uncomfortable.
I recently decided to have the double lining removed....before checking with local tailors I contacted Aero.
They told me to send the jacket back, they would correct the issue at no cost. The current management no longer double lines sleeves.
Sent the jacket in....anxiously awaiting it's return.

 

[schitzo]

I thought the whole point was to not speculate any further. If that still is true, then as there is no proof of the new crew lying, then the fact as of now is that they dont lie about what hide you pay for.

The point I was making is that you and I don't have the facts so the best thing for us to do is to resist making ignorant judgements and deductions based on some of, as opposed to all of, the information. Does that seem sensible Griff?