30s-50s British Suit Trouser photo resource

[Baron Kurtz]

They (trousers w/ high, fishtail back) are around to this day. You need only ask your tailor, and he/she will oblige.

bk

 

[BellyTank]

I've recently started climbing into high-waist pants, mainly due to their not being so unflattering as the below-the-belly low-risers. Three pairs now and rising...

Edit: And, BT, since you're posting here, I've a PM pending, awaiting an in-box cull.

Mr. Creeping, I have culled my in box.

High-waist trou' are great for active adventuring, especially when used with braces. The braces hang the trousers from your shoulders, of course, so there's not any binding, or pressure on your waist/gut/etc. and you don't end up with a bare strip or getting untucked. Allows for a shorter jacket and less fighting of the clothing. Good for the man without a waist, or an over-waist too, don't want to be recovering your trousers whilst hanging from an overhang...
I can only image climbing in low-rise jeans- useless and uncomfortable.

And as the Baron correctly mentions, highwaist/fishtail trousers are alive and well but you will find them as an option when having trousers made.
It is not "just" of past eras but a classical thing, seen, for example, in contemporary Tweed country suits. Fashion, what fashion?


B
T

 

[Anthony Jordan]

They (trousers w/ high, fishtail back) are around to this day. You need only ask your tailor, and he/she will oblige.

bk

Indeed they will. Here are a couple of (fairly poor) images of a pair of high-back trousers I had made by a Newcastle tailor back in 1998:

I've since gone back to made-to-measure tailoring, and both my latest suits have at least one pair of fishmouth-back trousers with them.

 

[Sir RBH]

Fishtail back

here we go
These are a pair of Navy moleskin trousers I am wearing today

These were bespoken for me from Bookster
And I cannot recommend them highly enough
these feature Brace buttons, button fly, turnups and a fishtail rear as you can see
Worn with Thurston boxcloth braces and a Lewin shirt
Good Day all
RBH

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Does anyone have any of the "zoot suit" style pants?

I have a pair of "Zoot" trousers. they are unlike anything else i've encountered. There is a thread somewhere about zoot suits.

these date from the same era more or less, would they essentially be the same as these save with a baggier pants look? I always thought the ultra high waist was a trademark of the zoots

No. The zoot trousers were extremely baggy at the thighs and knee, and extremely pegged at the cuffs. They are very weird looking trousers; very different from anything in this thread so far.

The very high waist is a bit of a Calloway thing. I'm of the opinion that most people's idea of what a zoot suit was is markedly (sadly) tainted by Calloway's pastiche of the style, not by the photographs of the kids wearing the suits. No doubt they were high (even very high) waisted, but i don't know if it was more than an inch or two higher than the accepted average. Not the armpit ticklers we associate with Calloway's vaudeville routine.

bk

 

[benstephens]

Mr. Ben, do you think those trousers were intended for some particular sporting, or other purpose, or just different from the norm?
Cricket? I guess the magazine ad., or the magazine itself would point to any specialised useage, but anyway... just curious, as to this departure.

So they don't have a fly in front, right?


B
T

BT,

That is correct, the zipper is in the side as seen on a lot of womens trousers. The trousers are just casual slacks, stripey flannel trousers to be precise, to be worn with a sports jacket.

The idea they are trying to advertise is that the trousers keep a neat line not having a seam or break in the front of the trouser, and having the zipper in the side effectively uses the side seam.

The advert is from 1940. Other parts of the magazine talk about the fact stripey flannels are now much more popular than plain flannels for casual wear.

Kindest Regards

Ben

 

[benstephens]

I have just got my scanner working. Here are some trousers from very early 1940, I think May or June being the latest, which, apart from the side zip trousers would make me think they would have been late 1930s in styling.

This is from the Simpsons of Piccadilly window. Sorry about the quality, it is enhanced, as the original is quite small. It is also on the bend of the magazine!

And here are the side zipper trousers for men

Again, I am sorry for the quality, it is on the bend of a bound set of Menswear magazines.

Kindest Regards

Ben

 

[Sir RBH]

Servicemans/Workmans trousers

Hello All

Have been looking for some heavy Serge/ Wool trousers that (I think) may have been worn by fireman/ Policeman in England in 40's 50's etc.. They may have even been Prison officers.. I have some but sadly not quite the right size..
Looking for 36 Waist and 32 inside leg. they feature Fishtail back, brace buttons and button fly. usually about 10" width at the bottom of the leg and VERY heavy wool...here are some images of the sort of thing I'm looking for...
RBH
These are 35 waist and 30.5 inside leg so don't quite fit me.. but are available for sale!

 

[H.Johnson]

I'm looking for similar. They are military mess waiter's gear, I believe. The ones I have seen have a 'broad arrow' label and are dated as late as the 1960s. Do you know about the matching waistcoat?

 

[GBR]

Compton Sons and Webb are/were uniform suppliers in the UK of some note even if their quality was far from wonderful at times.

 

[GBR]

I'm looking for similar. They are military mess waiter's gear, I believe. The ones I have seen have a 'broad arrow' label and are dated as late as the 1960s. Do you know about the matching waistcoat?

The trousers illustrated by Sir RBH were certainly not mess waiter's trousers. the label suggests that the user was a "motor driver" from"Smithfield station". Probably a fire man.

 

[BellyTank]

Ambulance.


B
T

 

[Forgotten Man]

here we go
These are a pair of Navy moleskin trousers I am wearing today

These were bespoken for me from Bookster
And I cannot recommend them highly enough
these feature Brace buttons, button fly, turnups and a fishtail rear as you can see
Worn with Thurston boxcloth braces and a Lewin shirt
Good Day all
RBH

I must say, the details are fantastic! However, to me they don't seem to hang right... is it just me or are there many wrinkles that seem to break a clean cut that I'd expect from a pair of bespoke pants. Kinda bunched up if you will... I don't want to sound rude but, I'd expect a cleaner drape as I've seen on other tailored pants... given they don't seem to be very generous in the seat or legs, and that may be why they may not appear relaxed.

 

[Sir RBH]

I must say, the details are fantastic! However, to me they don't seem to hang right... is it just me or are there many wrinkles that seem to break a clean cut that I'd expect from a pair of bespoke pants. Kinda bunched up if you will... I don't want to sound rude but, I'd expect a cleaner drape as I've seen on other tailored pants... given they don't seem to be very generous in the seat or legs, and that may be why they may not appear relaxed.

Somehting to do with being quite heavy Moleskin.. and the fact that I had been sitting for a quite a while
Thirdly.. for some reason trousers always seem to bunch round my lower regions.. its possibly my shape!!

 

[BellyTank]

Quite.
Moleskin and a close cut.
The heavy stuff is quite "boardy", to use a textile term.

No room for "drape" here.
Drape requires volume.

Pants from the 1900s and 10s have the same effect.


B
T

 

[herringbonekid]

old thread which brought up the idea that high waisted trousers had no sex appeal whatsoever (see page 2).

here's a recent blog post on the same topic:


http://asuitablewardrobe.blogspot.co.uk/2014/07/sex-appeal.html

 

[Fastuni]

Well, interesting thoughts, and while it advocates high-waisted trousers, I disagree with the assertions.

The aim of fine men’s tailoring has never quite been “sexiness” as we know it today, but rather an aesthetic of balance and proportion, seeking to impart an ideal male form: broad shoulders, developed chest, narrow waist, long legs.

The "aesthetic of proportion" in fine tailoring which the author refers to, is more accurately that of the 1930-40's.
And it is very much meant to be "sexy". The male ideal is just different from the skinny youth of todays fashion.
If broad shoulders, narrow waist and long legs are not intended to give the impression of an athletic, strong - "sexy" - man... what else?

And I doubt that for most women the ideal of male "sexyness" has turned away from "athletic/strong".
This ideal is still valid, however few men try to achieve it by a suit, but rather through phsyical exercise or other "masculine clothing".

They [women] want butts.

The nipped waist and tight fitting rear of the jacket and high trousers of 30-40's suits actually accentuate the butt more than modern low and tight trousers and vented jackets.
Also wider cut high-waist trousers allow the wearer to (pardon the bluntness) "let it hang" and give freedom of movement. Anyone who has worn them knows what I mean.
Contemporary fashion cut suit trousers are to me impossibly uncomfortable.

I also disagree with the closing thought that high-waisted trousers are part of "starchy, mature and modest neo-traditionalism".
It depends on what you wear them with. They can be worn with a three-piece suit or with a tight-fitting sports-shirt and leather-jacket. The "aura" is quite different.

Much of the perceptions of clothes seems to be instilled by "opinion-makers" such as television, fashion mags and movies.
If it is constantly hammered into the public that A is sexy and B is not, enough people will start to buy into it.

The "sexyness" of any clothes much depends on numerous other factors:
Good fit is of course critically important.
Wearing clothes with confidence also goes a long way.
Self-concious and "costumey" behaviour will always be seen as awkward and off-putting.
And sometimes an unattractive man is just an unattractive man... whatever his clothes.
In the end the man makes the clothes.

 

[herringbonekid]

i think it's just a different kind of 'sexiness'. the tight butt & crotch, low-waisted trousers brought in by people like Jim Morrison and Robert Plant give off a very 'bad boy', unsubtle, type of raw sex appeal.
the high-waisted trouser is more to do with elegance and smartness of tailoring. it's understated while the tight trouser is overstated. i think there will be an appreciative audience for each, just as some men prefer Audrey Hepburn over Madonna.

i have definitely heard young ladies say that a high waisted trouser is 'sexy' so i disagree with people (such as the blog writer) who state categorically that it is a non-sexy garment.


edit: (there do seem to be some women who agree with the 'non-sexy' viewpoint though. see Marc C's comment on page 2).

 

[Fastuni]

there do seem to be some women who agree with the 'non-sexy' viewpoint though

Sure. As you say every garment has an appreciative or non-appreciative audience.

Some like women in skirts... some think jeans are more sexy.

Or taking two popular and frequently forms of contemporary female leg-wear:
very tight shorts/hot pants and loose, low-crotched "harem pants".
I abhor the look of these modern harem pants on women - especially where the crotch starts almost at the knee. Contorts and hides any feminine shapes that may exist.
Hot pants of course can be... well hot... but again it greatly depends on the content. A non-attractive woman in hot pants won't be any more attractive.

I only wear wide high-waist trousers. I never had young ladies deem them "non-sexy", to the contrary I get usually appreciative remarks for my clothes (even though many struggle with recognizing the correct period - but that's another matter ).
I am more comfortable in high ones and natural confidence shines through. A guy more comfortable in modern low-waisters will be better advised to stick with them.

Actually the only time I got a negative remark on high-waisted flannel slacks, was by a bunch of male hipsters in tight neon-colored skinny trousers, who promptly got an appropriate reply.

 

[herringbonekid]

i don't think i've seen the word 'varsity' used on British college clothing before.