Would you wear it?

[Big J]

As time went by, the pilots and crew stopped wearing the Blood Chit on the outside, because, you did not want to be rescued by communist gorillas wearing the Nationalist flag!

I think that after the massive Japanese reprisals in China for the Doolittle Raid, no Chinese really wanted to accept blood chits.

 

[tropicalbob]

I'm coming in a bit late so please excuse if this is a stupid question, but where's the 'Z' in Japanese writing?

 

[Big J]

I'm coming in a bit late so please excuse if this is a stupid question, but where's the 'Z' in Japanese writing?

There is no 'Z' in Japanese writing.
This is the internationally recognized semaphore flag for the letter Z, which the Imperial Japanese Navy used as a prearranged signal to launch the Pearl Harbor and Midway air attacks (so that carriers did not have to radio the order and risk giving away thier positions).

 

[havocpaul]

More proof for me that The Few is now just a fantasy label, overpriced and unauthentic. Don't get me started on their attempt at an Irvin!

 

[Big J]

More proof for me that The Few is now just a fantasy label, overpriced and unauthentic. Don't get me started on their attempt at an Irvin!

Got a pic of that Irvin?

 

[Big J]

I couldn't be paid enough to wear that flag on my arm for the same reasons you stated, Worf. Too many innocent millions were murdered beneath that flag …
The art is very nicely done - but thanks to Big J's translation as to the meaning of the patches, I feel that the content and intention behind it is quite wrong. They were the losing side and they shouldn't seek to be defiant or glamourize that evil chapter of their past with jackets like this.

I agree with your and Worf's sentiments entirely.
As Bentusian pointed out, the loooong explanation about the jacket on the web page basically goes on at length about 'The Few's' love of vintage, and how well made the A-2 is, and other products they hoped to launch in the 'Zero range'.
Then, there's this one little paragraph that says 'Despite the fact that we were killing each other 70 years ago, we are now like brothers. This jacket is a symbol of conciliation'.

I think that's a little disingenuous considering the meaning of the patches, which they obviously know the meaning of, since they chose them.

 

[havocpaul]

It was discussed here.....http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?35314-ALL-REPRO-R-A-F-Irvin-type-jackets/page43

 

[Big J]

It was discussed here.....http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?35314-ALL-REPRO-R-A-F-Irvin-type-jackets/page43

Nasty jacket.

 

[Dumb&dumber]

+1

 

[Stand By]

I think you're pretty safe with a blood chit;
It's basically a big IOU. It says that the 'holder' is a US ally in the fight against the Japanese, and you will be financially compensated for aiding and assisting him.
The pilot was supposed to detach it from the jacket and hand it over to locals that saved his bacon.

I didn't know that the chit was intended to be given to the locals … as if that'd happen around here!
"I'm sorry, what? You want … what? The blood chit? But … it's on my jacket. Of course you can't have it! It'll leave unsightly stitch marks on the back panel! Are you mad? Be off with you!"

 

[nick123]

I didn't know that the chit was intended too be given to the locals … as if that'd happen around here!
"I'm sorry, what? You want … what? The blood chit? But … it's on my jacket. Of course you can't have it! It'll leave unsightly stitch marks on the back panel! Are you mad? Be off with you!"

lol

 

[Big J]

I didn't know that the chit was intended too be given to the locals … as if that'd happen around here!
"I'm sorry, what? You want … what? The blood chit? But … it's on my jacket. Of course you can't have it! It'll leave unsightly stitch marks on the back panel! Are you mad? Be off with you!"

Oh yeah. That's why they all have that big red ink Chinese stamp on the original fabric ones- they're like Chinese government cheques!

 

[Big J]

If anyone's interested in mainland Chinese memory of the Flying Tigers, this is an interesting article;

https://flyingtigersus.wordpress.com/2011/03/29/chinese-tribute-to-the-flying-tigers/

N.B. Glen Beneda is wearing a KMT (Chinese nationalist) Army issue cap in one of the photos. This is exactly the same as the German Field Cap Overseas as worn by the Nazis, (after all, the KMT were fighting Mao's communists, so it must have seemed like a good idea for the Germans to supply them). Makes for rather an odd look on an American. I can't imagine me wearing one with an M442a!

Although, I am now thinking that I need an AVG M442a!

 

[2jakes]

If anyone's interested in mainland Chinese memory of the Flying Tigers, this is an interesting article;

https://flyingtigersus.wordpress.com/2011/03/29/chinese-tribute-to-the-flying-tigers/

N.B. Glen Beneda is wearing a KMT (Chinese nationalist) Army issue cap in one of the photos. This is exactly the same as the German Field Cap Overseas as worn by the Nazis, (after all, the KMT were fighting Mao's communists, so it must have seemed like a good idea for the Germans to supply them). Makes for rather an odd look on an American. I can't imagine me wearing one with an M442a!

Although, I am now thinking that I need an AVG M442a!
View attachment 32251

From looking at images of the “Flying Tigers”,
I wondered why there was no consistency with the jackets worn by the pilots.

Then I read, A Flying Tiger’s Diary by Charles R. Bond Jr.
He explains that most jackets were bought at civilian places by the pilots.

I also found interesting the variety of footwear from boots to brogans
that these guys wore.

 

[Justhandguns]

If anyone's interested in mainland Chinese memory of the Flying Tigers, this is an interesting article;

https://flyingtigersus.wordpress.com/2011/03/29/chinese-tribute-to-the-flying-tigers/


View attachment 32251

I am not trying to be political here, but I would not be reading too much into articles written by PRC news agencies. Currently they are trying very hard to down play the original Chiang Kai-Shek's KuoMinTang's involvement and effort in resisting the Japan invasion. The Red Army at that time did very little in the resistance themselves.

Unless you are the older generation of Chinese, you will only see the KMT/Taiwan flag as a traitor's flag, very few people in China know about the true history anyway. Wearing the KMT/Taiwan flag inside China would very likely get you in trouble. It is better be safe than sorry.

 

[Stand By]

I think they look fantastic (though not that KMT cap, you're right Big J. But very interesting!).
I'm always surprised at how short on the leg their khakis appear in photos … but they still look so cool to me.
I read an old Ballentine's war history book on flying the "Hump" and the adversity of flying in the jungle was unbelievable - lack of supplies, terrible weather, overworked equipment, disease, lack of clean water, relentless monsoons and mud, mud, mud - oh, and the Japanese trying to kill you.
And one part that stuck with me was the fear of baling out - and pilots would be found by rescue parties waaay up in the canopy of trees, their bodies picked clean by the bugs and ants. Horrendous.
Total respect is due.

 

[2jakes]

I think they look fantastic (though not that KMT cap, you're right Big J. But very interesting!).
I'm always surprised at how short on the leg their khakis appear in photos … but they still look so cool to me.

I’ve noticed that as well. Probably that was the style or was acceptable back then.

Also I’ve seen photos of some of these guys with the jacket sleeves on the short side.

One thing I like is the crude paintings these guys applied to their leather jackets.
There was some nice artwork for sure, but the ones I like are the “home-made” style.

 

[Big J]

I am not trying to be political here, but I would not be reading too much into articles written by PRC news agencies. Currently they are trying very hard to down play the original Chiang Kai-Shek's KuoMinTang's involvement and effort in resisting the Japan invasion. The Red Army at that time did very little in the resistance themselves.

Unless you are the older generation of Chinese, you will only see the KMT/Taiwan flag as a traitor's flag, very few people in China know about the true history anyway. Wearing the KMT/Taiwan flag inside China would very likely get you in trouble. It is better be safe than sorry.

You can be political if you like, I don't mind.
This article plays up the role of the KMT affiliated AVG, and portrays the AVG in a very good light. It doesn't really matter if the modern Chinese have a bad opinion of the KMT (after all, Chiang Kai Shek did his military training down the road from me, here in Japan), they have a good opinion of the AVG.

There is a debate to be had about the comparative roles of the Red Army and the KMT in resisting Japanese invasion, but given Cold War imperatives, how reliable and unbiased is our conventional understanding of that? The Chinese invasion of Tibet is seen as a travesty, but no one remembers the KMT's invasion of Taiwan, and total destruction of it's native institutions, culture, language, and traditions. In any event, the Red Army fell back over and over again, drawing the Japanese further and further into China, over-stretching their resource weak army. Kind of like Napoleon in Russia. With the Japanese implementing the 'Three All's' policy (kill all, burn all, take all), the Japanese weren't really making it easy for themselves. It was a good strategy on Mao's part.

 

[AdeeC]

The " Flying Tigers" and their leader General Chennault have a good reputation in China despite Chennault being a leading man for CKS in his anti Communist fight after the war. Their efforts are not forgotten for assistance in the anti Japanese war. There are memorials honouring The Flying Tigers and Chennault in Hunan Province.

As for the native Chinese, I have not met one over there who is openly hostile to Taiwan. People are careful with their political talk but one would think it would be OK to vituperate against Taiwan. It doesn't happen.

 

[Big J]

The " Flying Tigers" and their leader General Chennault have a good reputation in China despite Chennault being a leading man for CKS in his anti Communist fight after the war. Their efforts are not forgotten for assistance in the anti Japanese war. There are memorials honouring The Flying Tigers and Chennault in Hunan Province.

As for the native Chinese, I have not met one over there who is openly hostile to Taiwan. People are careful with their political talk but one would think it would be OK to vituperate against Taiwan. It doesn't happen.

That's been my experience too.