Woodstock?

[Paisley]

If their parents didn't indulge their children, court psychologists would. One of them told my mother that if her daughter (14 years old, truant, and into trouble) wanted to have a baby, she should let her. Well, she had two. Nearly 40 years later, one has three kids with three different fathers; the other is a 36-year-old grandmother. Both families go from one disaster to another. Wonderful. Great advice.

My parents were blue collar people b. 1929 and 1930. I wasn't around when they were raising my brothers and sisters, but I know they didn't have the means or the inclination to indulge their children.

 

[Pilgrim]

this was my whole point of the thread. I have always wondered though why Janis sang this song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z031l0E_5n4

it was released after she died.

I assume it was FUN!

 

[Edward]

this was my whole point of the thread. I have always wondered though why Janis sang this song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z031l0E_5n4

it was released after she died.

I always read the song as being an intentionally ironic comment on materialism..... and one which went far over the heads of the Mercedes PR people when they violated it for a television advertisement campaign of recent years.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Indulgence?..Oh probably so. However...I remember a pretty nice childhood throughout the '50s&'60s. Kinda old fashion parents and grandparents with strong concrete unchanging values. Record collection..record player...toys...bicycle...but one TV...and,if lucky..a transistor radio. Like Paisley I remember psychologist types becoming more liberal...but moreso at the time my age group started having children. In my area that is when Dr. Spocklike mentality seemed to creep into young families.
I graduated in 1965 while 17 yrs old..to face the draft...and going off to a controversial war..like the majority of my age group. Most of us had little idea of what this war was about. It was a frightening time wondering about the immediate future. Kennedy,MLK,and RFK had been shot. Camelot faded into the smoke of burning neighborhoods. "What's going on"!!..."What's going on"!! A nation in tears. Many of us were so disallusioned..that dropping out...seemed like we were actually dropping in. Into a carefree life of our own rules..reguardless of all those other problems bombarding us...or even in spite of them.
Well..I trudged off to war...and came back...more than ready to find some peace. More than ready to trade fatigue green for faded blue jean. More than ready to forget trying to understand just what the hell was going on.
Eventually marrying...finding a good job that carried me through retirement..my values and outlook returned to similar values of my parents and grandparents. Through all that turmoil..it turned out..in my view..they weren't so wrong afterall.
I expect no one to understand...unless they lived during that time.
However..it's not easy sitting here reading armchair history buffs speculating about how awful the greatest generation surely were.
I must say that the mentality and mindset that developed and came out of the '60s&'70s did set the stage for the permissiveness and numorous problems of today. In fact..we are now getting a good serious dose of it from those idiots recently put in charge.
Sorry for the rant...
Erase this post if it's too intolerable...
HD

 

[Foofoogal]

HoosierDaddy,
I do still think the greatest generation was the greatest. I had depression era parents who passed in the 1980s.
I was in a very small town back then and would of never even had a clue about hippies where I was.
The one thing that made the difference was my 2 older brothers went to Vietnam and both came back using drugs and introduced them to me.
One of my brothers truly is still in that war. Many of his friends have died due to habits back then that come back to bite you years later. One of his friends that has been a preacher for years and totally clean now just died from Hepatitis.
Like a huge family with warts and all America is what it is and I do love it. I also immensely appreciate all the sacrifices of the earlier generations and especially the warriors.
I also know one will never ever understand unless they were there.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

HoosierDaddy,
I do still think the greatest generation was the greatest. I had depression era parents who passed in the 1980s.
I was in a very small town back then and would of never even had a clue about hippies where I was.
The one thing that made the difference was my 2 older brothers went to Vietnam and both came back using drugs and introduced them to me.
One of my brothers truly is still in that war. Many of his friends have died due to habits back then that come back to bite you years later. One of his friends that has been a preacher for years and totally clean now just died from Hepatitis.
Like a huge family with warts and all America is what it is and I do love it. I also immensely appreciate all the sacrifices of the earlier generations and especially the warriors.
I also know one will never ever understand unless they were there.

I just think that many..if not most of the parents of my generation where pretty solid with their values. We(my generation) made it pretty tough on them for many reasons(they didn't go down easy). In fact...I would say...and admit that it was my generation that failed their children with permissiveness and over-indulgence. Progressing to the next generation of multiple video..computer...designer tennies....treating children as a friend or adult rather than a child etc....blah blah blah. So here we are. It's still the best there is...but it is sure changing fast.....

 

[Foofoogal]

...but it is sure changing fast.....

you ain't akidding. way, way too fast for me. This year has been like none other since I have been on the face of the earth. I do think without my parents and others teachings from back then I may not have any hope. Thank God I still do.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

you ain't akidding. way, way too fast for me. This year has been like none other since I have been on the face of the earth. I do think without my parents and others teachings from back then I may not have any hope. Thank God I still do.

Groovy!...I can dig it! Far out!... :eusa_clap

 

[Lincsong]

Why aren't the hippie haters bitching about how badly a number of "the Greatest Generation" raised its children? Or do you think those kids became hippies out of thin air? Sorry, that's not the case. Mom and Dad had lain the groundwork.


.

I agree with you Marc. I've also been saying this for quite a while. It was the misnamed "Greatest Generation" that raised the hippy's of the 60's. To me the "Greatest Generation" was the Spanish-American War Vets and World War I Vets who raised the kids that fought in World War II.

Haven't we talked this subject to death in the "Why I Hate the '70s" thread?

As far as who/what/where the hippies came from, I know this for darn sure; they all weren't born and bred here in San Francisco Bay. Yeah, we have a history of squatters, cattle rustlers, rogues, charletons, half-wits, train robbers, hobo's and such making their way here, but most of the hippy's were from all over the U.S. and from all backgrounds; the New Yorker, the Iowan, the Georgian. Anyone who couldn't fit in/be accepted back home made their way here. Like that Merle Haggard song Okie from Muskogee if you didn't fit into that song odds were you fitted in San Francisco.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UZUJQ5i8gk

 

[reetpleat]

Absolutely Marc, after the depression and the war it was pure indulgence after except in my father's home of course.

Yikes, English teacher.
I used to know all the rules.

<---------exhippie!

Not indulgance so much, as having created a world that could no longer be tolerated by a large percentage of the kids.

 

[reetpleat]

Fashion was dying as early as 1960, when clothing quality QUICKLY became worse and worse: fewer stitches per inch, more brittle plastic buttons, crappy plastic zippers, polyester blend fabrics that pilled, and on and on. It laid the groundwork for the next decade and a half. And guess what? The company bosses who led the charge downward were from the World War II/Korea generation.


.

Not to mention, a big part of the movement was back to the land, rediscovering traditional ways, communal living, planting gardens organically and naturally, heck, they even led a revival of folk and old time music. It kind of amazes me that lovers of the golden era do not appreciate the love the hippies shared for that era, against an increasingly soulless society.

 

[reetpleat]

It'd be interesting to do a demographic survey of hippiedom, actually -- how many were spoiled suburban middle class kids versus how many came from rural/urban working-class environments.

My beef with hippiedom has always been that its overall cultural prevalence been greatly exaggerated. For every kid that tuned in, turned on and dropped out, there were many, many who did no such thing, just as the majority of young women in the '20s were not flappers. But the permanent image of the sixties remains the doped-up free-lovin' hippy, instead of the working-class kid who got drafted and went overseas, served uneventfully, came home, and got a job on a loading dock or something. The latter makes for a far-less sensational TV documentary, I guess.

For what it's worth, I never saw a hippy anywhere but on TV until the late '70s. As a kid, I thought they were just made-up characters for Joe Friday to fight.

Yes, but their cultural impact, impact on music, the war, social conventions, racism etc was far reaching. And many kids who were not really hippies still shared their ideas.

 

[Dinerman]

heck, they even led a revival of folk and old time music. It kind of amazes me that lovers of the golden era do not appreciate the love the hippies shared for that era, against an increasingly soulless society.

Take Stompin '76 as an example. Over 150,000, mostly hippies, in attendance for a bluegrass festival. Not exactly a small number of fans for something rooted in golden era musical traditions which might have otherwise faded into obscurity.

It was my father who introduced me to vintage hats and clothes, they provided the staple of what he wore in his younger hippie days.

Part of the massive crowd.

My dad on the right and the classic Chevy he got back from Galax in.

Him with the harmonica, patched navy jeans and bush hat

The vintage look we're all about here now isn't exactly "normal" or conformist to everyday current society either, you know. Yes, the look and sound of that generation is different than the '30s-'50s thing we do here, but to each their own.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Yes, but their cultural impact, impact on music, the war, social conventions, racism etc was far reaching. And many kids who were not really hippies still shared their ideas.

Conversely, though, I'd imagine that quite a few of the actual hippies were in it more for the dope and sex than they were for the ideology.

I don't know as I'd give the counterculture kids as much credit as they've liked to claim for a lot of the social reforms, either. If you look at the generation of leaders and activists who accounted for the most real progress in the civil rights movement, for example, nearly all of them were people born between 1915 and 1930. The earliest wave of boomers were still in high school at the time of the Freedom Rides, and while some of them might have been on the buses, it wouldn't exactly be honest or fair to claim they were the ones doing the driving.

The back-to-the-land crowd were the first hippies to make it up here. We got a lot of them starting in the late '70s and early '80s, but by the end of the '80s most of them had realized the whole plain-dirt-farmin' routine wasn't quite as romantic as they'd imagined. Now they drive Saabs and run for seats on the Board of Selectmen and do IT consulting on the side.

 

[Viola]

My parents moved to Maine in the '70s and lived in a non-mobile schoolbus with 7 cats and a dog. Hippies, though as my dad clarified "I had a job!"

That's why I was born in Maine, though I can't say I'm a local, as I moved away at a whole 6 mos. of age.

My parents would still do the back-to-the-land thing if they could, but it'll be a retirement thing for them... and they'll probably find a new locale to horrify. I don't know if they're allowed back to New England. lol

 

[reetpleat]

Conversely, though, I'd imagine that quite a few of the actual hippies were in it more for the dope and sex than they were for the ideology.

I don't know as I'd give the counterculture kids as much credit as they've liked to claim for a lot of the social reforms, either. If you look at the generation of leaders and activists who accounted for the most real progress in the civil rights movement, for example, nearly all of them were people born between 1915 and 1930. The earliest wave of boomers were still in high school at the time of the Freedom Rides, and while some of them might have been on the buses, it wouldn't exactly be honest or fair to claim they were the ones doing the driving.

The back-to-the-land crowd were the first hippies to make it up here. We got a lot of them starting in the late '70s and early '80s, but by the end of the '80s most of them had realized the whole plain-dirt-farmin' routine wasn't quite as romantic as they'd imagined. Now they drive Saabs and run for seats on the Board of Selectmen and do IT consulting on the side.

True, the civil rights movement started much earlier, and that and the anti war movement were started and led by many clean cut youth and college students. But they were the genesis from which was born the hippie culture.

But there is no denying that many people in any counter culture or sub culture are just in it for the fun, and the babes.

 

[Warbaby]

Having been an active participant in the Sex and Drugs and Rock & Roll culture of the 60s and 70s, I can't say that we accomplished anything lasting (other than the music), but it sure was fun while it lasted.

I didn't go to Woodstock, though. By the time it rolled around, I had been going to folk and old time music festivals for several years and experienced all the camping out in the mud that I cared to. When I heard it looked like rain upstate, I decided to stay high and dry at home. I've never felt like I missed anything other than being wet and dirty.

 

[Spitfire]

Having been an active participant in the Sex and Drugs and Rock & Roll culture of the 60s and 70s, I can't say that we accomplished anything lasting (other than the music), but it sure was fun while it lasted.

I didn't go to Woodstock, though. By the time it rolled around, I had been going to folk and old time music festivals for several years and experienced all the camping out in the mud that I cared to. When I heard it looked like rain upstate, I decided to stay high and dry at home. I've never felt like I missed anything other than being wet and dirty.

:eusa_clap :eusa_clap lol

 

[Foofoogal]

Conversely, though, I'd imagine that quite a few of the actual hippies were in it more for the dope and sex than they were for the ideology.

yep, pretty much agree. I love reading your stuff Lizzie. :eusa_clap

How I went from one part of the spectrum to the complete other part is beyond me. I rebelled against hippiedom somewhere. lol
For myself I would truly love to see a poll that showed how many of the most conservative people were originally hippies and because of what they saw and experienced went the other way.
Something along the lines of one too many joints shoved in my face.

 

[Doctor Strange]

I dunno, some of us are still hardcore liberals.

In my experience, people don't really change. The people I've known for 30 and 40 years are all still essentially the same - the same strengths and weaknesses, the same passions and interests. Despite the mantra of CHANGE! that our society promotes so loudly, I just haven't seen it.

Sure, financial situations, families, careers, experience/wisdom, bring their particular variations in people's lives... But look beneath the trappings of middle age, and I'm still very much the same guy I was at 25!

It may be that I'm just a poor example, but the vast number of my old friends are still pretty much the same people after all these years. The ones who were self-centered and immature still are; the ones who were social butterfiles still are; the ones who were political (or in my case, non-political) still are; the ones who embrace every trend (vs. the ones who follow their own drummer) still do; the ones who strive to make money - and conversely, the ones who live for artistic satisfaction (or to just make sexual conquests) - still do.

The older I get, the more I see human life as a continuum, not a series of ongoing redefinitions. Heavy, man...