Tie length - again and again

[donCarlos]

There´s already been written more than enough on this topic, but I just found an interesting inconsistency in all our theories on tie´s length.

This is a screenshot I captured from a movie from 1937:




And now what? The guy in the middle is very well dressed through the whole movie, so what´s the matter with the tie?

The tie shall, and always should cover the belt. I found this rule mentioned in a book of etiquette from cca 1923, not only in the modern ones.
However, we agreed that the ties were shorter because of higher waist of pants.
His pants are not high waisted and his tie definitely hardly covers his belly.

What do you think about this?

 

[Michaelshane]

I think he was trying to look silly....mission accomplished.

 

[skyvue]

I've seen short ties with lower pants like that in many an old movie.

 

[Feraud]

Shorter length ties produce short looking knotted ties.
I am not sure any theories have been blown out of the water..

I think he was trying to look silly....mission accomplished.

I am not sure this was the case. Ties from the era were shorter than modern ties and look necessarily shorter when tied. If a man generally wears his jacket buttoned the length is not an issue.

Personally I find modern men's ties that hang down into their crotches equally silly.

 

[donCarlos]

Shorter length ties produce short looking knotted ties.
I am not sure any theories have been blown out of the water..

Of course, but what are these ties for, then? They are not usable according to the etiquette...

edit: yes, these modern too long ties are equally bad. And what about the patterns... There are in fact about three ties today - stripes leaning to the left, stripes leaning to the right and plain color ties. That´s basically all I can usually see these days.

 

[Feraud]

The ties are for wearing!

I've seen more than a few modern tie patterns I like. My dislike of modern ties are the length and thickness rather than the patterns.

 

[dhermann1]

There is also the subjective issue. If the overall proportions just look OK, then tie length can be moot. It also helps to have a flat tummy, and a suit that is well proportioned itself.

 

[Feraud]

Well said dhermann1.

 

[avedwards]

I don't care if this is unorthodox but I find that I look best when the tip of my tie stops just before reaching my belt. I don't like the tie to go longer than the belt, vintage style or not. I think too short ties are no good either.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Nothing in film is random. There will have been a good reason for him to have his tie that short. It was supposed to say something about the character.

Though ties were short, i have seen very few that would have tied such a short tie. That is not a large man (this is typically the reason that 1930s ties tie ridiculously short).

bk

 

[Edward]

Personally I find modern men's ties that hang down into their crotches equally silly.

With you on that. I like mine a good four inches or so above the waistband - ties hanging lower than the waist are one of my pet hates. I have a fair few modern ties I really like, and have actually considrred having them shortened by a tailor (though with care I can tie them short enough while avoiding a knotg the size of your fist, soccer-player style).

 

[MisterGrey]

He's wearing a very high-chested suit. If it were buttoned, no one would be the wiser.

 

[Sefton]

He's wearing a very high-chested suit. If it were buttoned, no one would be the wiser.

That sounds about right. Also, a vest would certainly make a very short tie length a non issue. And what about the film itself; is this a comedy and is this character with the short tie played as a joke? Many is the old and new film that resorts to an odd usage of ordinary clothing to get a laugh; short / too long ties, pants, etc.

 

[Will]

The tie shall, and always should cover the belt. I found this rule mentioned in a book of etiquette from cca 1923, not only in the modern ones.

I wonder what etiquette book that is?

Few well dressed men even wore belts in 1923. They wore braces.

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Few well dressed men even wore belts in 1923.

Not true, especially in 1923. Hart, Schaffner & Marx catalogs from that era show suit after suit being worn with a belt.

.

 

[Corky]

Ties used to be shorter than they are now...

Newer ties should reach to the belt in front at least.

 

[donCarlos]

I wonder what etiquette book that is?

Few well dressed men even wore belts in 1923. They wore braces.

This book I was talking about is called "Společenský katechismus" (Social Catechism) and is by Jiří Guth-Jarkovský (1861-1943), who was president Masaryk´s Master of Ceremonies. He wrote about eight other books on the etiquette topic, all of them interesting, but a bit outdated. The oldest issue I found is from 1913!

BTW, the last book about etiquette released here is written by ex-president Havel´s Master of Ceremonies and it grasps all the modern stuff, like cell phones etc. However, I didn´t buy it, because he mentions the hat manners by only about two sentences and he simply accepts the general bad dressed state of this nation, instead of encouraging people to dress appropriately and better.


Sefton
The movie actually is a comedy, the short tied guy is a gambling musician who lives from his wife´s money. However, I felt that ll characters are very well dressed... Who knows.

 

[univibe88]

I like the tip of the tie to fall right on my belt buckle. If it goes below my belt it feels to long for me.