The Conversion Corral

[moehawk]

I fumbled around for too long trying to trim nicely with scissors. Finally I built a rounding jack that works, but isn't perfect. Lounger humanshoes was selling rounding jacks he made for a decent price compared to the 300 dollar starting price for ones sold by some guy online.

 

[moehawk]

Crudely made rounding jack.
Made by a non-woodworker.
Me.

 

[moehawk]

Dang, that is a high crown. 7"?

 

[javadave61]

WARNING: What I'm about to say is pure sacrilege (but it works just fine and you'll be okay). I've taken a really good pair of kitchen scissors and just trimmed reaaaally slow and carefully and have had great success. There's usually one or two places where the cut isn't exactly right, and a little bit of sandpaper fixes that right up. I start with a pencil, hold it a quarter inch down from the lead (if you're cutting a quarter inch off), hold it firmly, and lightly slide my hand around the brim, making a nice little pencil line as I slowly turn the hat. Then I trim away. Or better yet, I carefully trace a hat with the brim dimensions I like, as I did with my FED IV as I converted my Akubra Stockman to a dimensional brim.... remnants seen here.

 

[Bob Roberts]

ok... so I've decided to take this Stetson Beaver 25 that I acquired and turn it into a fedora

I don't wear cowboy hats ... and I love a tall crown ... so it seems only natural to me for me to convert it

as you can see by the pic I have just started to block it and flatten out the brim... actually looks pretty cool like this....

... anyway.... I would love your input

I know a few guys like DOGMAN and TJones have done these sort of things

a few questions

how did you go about cutting the brim ?

what did you use to cut it ?

... and really anything you would like to add

maybe I could learn from your mistakes ?

looking forward to hearing from you

U have the "perplexed" look down pat.

 

[T Jones]

I think the best advise I could give is to wait until you can collect all the right tools to work with. You can make your conversions look fairly decent using what you have available to work with but making a hat to look " just fairly decent" isn't what you're after, especially if you have some investment in a nice Western you plan to convert. You can use scissors or a razor knife to cut your brim, but it won't look as crisp if you had a rounding jack to do the trimming. You can shape a snap brim to look somewhat decent, but not nearly as nice if you had a brim flange. You can use a paint can, as I did once, to reblock a fairly decent looking crown, but why settle for something that looks just fairly decent when I could get the right tools and make it something that looks near perfect? Even after you have all the right tools to do the job with you still have a bit more work to do, like pouncing that thick western weight felt to make it easier to work with, ( especially if it's a Resistol Stagecoach), and those tall 6.5 crowns are a lot of material to move around to make it look right when you're creasing it. You can bring the height down only so low until it starts tapering with an open crown that tall. If you're after a tall crown fedora look, I think a straight 5 3/4 block would be plenty tall for what you're after. Lately I've been leaving mine Westerns rather than converting them.

That Stetson 25 Beaver you have is a nice hat. I think I'd leave it alone. Some people can wear all kinds of different hats and look good in them, but there's always one type that they look best wearing. I know you like your fedoras, but that wide brim Stetson actually looks real good on you. It definitely works. IMHO, I think you'd look better wearing the wider brimmed Westerns. Maybe give the crown a Center Dent and see how it looks.

If you latch on to earlier vintage Westerns, I'd leave them as is and just make a few adjustments if needed. Unless they have some sort of damage where a conversion would be the best possible solution to saving a hat.

 

[Joao Encarnado]

Lastly, Joao I feel like you do about the brim cutting every time I see a homburg converted. Everybody's conversions are inspiring and I've learned a lot from this thread.

Thanks for compassion and understanding. New hat bodies aren't that expensive if you have a block and some tools.

 

[Joao Encarnado]

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

 

[Joao Encarnado]

plus I want the experience

I can trade that beaver 25 for the free hat if you want the experience... (at least I tried).
Even Terry said wise words!! Now that impressed me.

 

[DOGMAN]

Moon, to answer your Question .I made my own rounding jacks to cut the brims.When I first started doing conversions all I had was a rubber ball some rubber hose and distilled water and a tea pot for steam.I made a crude rounding jack at first(you can see it in the conversion corral thread).Then I made some better ones.

 

[DOGMAN]

I have some blocks and flanges now.But if I want a flatter brim I still use the rubber hose.And if I don't have the right size block,I still use a rubber ball to work it into a open crown.I throw caution to the wind and go for it.I think I got some pretty good results.

 

[Frunobulax]

Two great pieces of advice from Terry and Dogman.

Be prepared.

Be fearless.

 

[moehawk]

Actually, the soundest advice so far (assuming the hat will be cut down) was from Joao. Not the cry of existential angst, but the mention of a free hat for the experience. Get a funky old western of similar dimensions to work on first. They come in handy when testing rounding jacks for sure, and there is always plenty of opportunity to screw things up when trying something new. Best it's not to your 25 when those mistakes could be made on a ratty Bailey instead. And Dr. Jones' mention of pouncing down the weight will come into play as well. You will find to do that properly will require a full dismantling. Another process best done first on that thrift store western instead of the nice one.
Above all, though, is the feeling of satisaction that comes with the compliments on your work. It is as heady and addictive as the hats themselves!

 

[EstherWeis]

well, l did fine without a rounding jack for ages. it's a handy tool to have, but i wouldn't say it is a must perse if you are starting out. it's even not that known about here with the European hat makers. Most use the edge on their brimblocks.

it might be good to practice on an old cheap felt just to get the feel. but you can get away with it if you are carefull like Dave said.

this is how I used to do it ;
choose the length you want and decide how you want to finish it. i suspect you want a raw edge?
take your tape measure and lay it flat touching the edge of where the crown meets the brim. Make sure you have a straight line where you can start from ( either tie a little rope or use the ribbon on it if it's straight)
use either tailor chalk or what works well too is a piece of sharpened white soap ( this will not stain and will dissapear if you steam it)
start marking with a little line on the length you want and move your tape measure to the side by a bit and mark again, go all the way around until you get a circle. better to put too many markings.
Leave it flat on the table and look at it from a distance, hold it up and check again. you can adjust if you find neccesairy, what i like on a men's fedora is that the back is shorter than the front, but if you would like to do that, make sure you start shortening about 2/3rds in the back. but that might be tricky for a first try
Keep looking from a distance and ask someone else to check too if you're not sure.
The good thing about soap is that you can just rub it off with your finger when you adjust.

what I did then is cut it, but if you dont feel comfortable doing that yet take a needle and a contrasting colour thread and follow that line with a small up and down hand stitch, that way the line is even more clear for you to check.
you need to have really sharp and sturdy scissors, I use a pair of old heavy tailoring scissors or my rounded scissors that are produced for hatmaking.
the thing you need to look out for is to not cut angles, but a fluid line. Practice makes perfect, some felts are harder to cut that others, but try to feel as you go and don't be too scared.
cut, and take a step back and look, if you see a small angle very carefully mark with you chalk of soap and trim or if it's barely noticable just sand it off after.

if you are happy with your line use sandpaper ( i use a sanding sponge with a rounded edge, you can get those in any DIY store) and sand the edge until you get a nice smooth edge. this may take a while, but it looks the best if you take your time.

Moon, I hope this even makes sense to you since it's hard to explain, it would be easier with some visuals. if you want i can do that.


I'm gonna hide behind a corner now...

 

[T Jones]

This is why I like having the right tools. Rounding Jack tutorial from Tom Gomez. Quicker, far more accurate cut and less imperfections....easy peasy!

 

[kingrat]

Terry call me if you can.

 

[DOGMAN]

jswindle2,good luck on your block hunt.Looking forward to see your conversions.

 

[Joao Encarnado]

Actually, the soundest advice so far (assuming the hat will be cut down) was from Joao. Not the cry of existential angst, but the mention of a free hat for the experience. Get a funky old western of similar dimensions to work on first. They come in handy when testing rounding jacks for sure, and there is always plenty of opportunity to screw things up when trying something new. Best it's not to your 25 when those mistakes could be made on a ratty Bailey instead. And Dr. Jones' mention of pouncing down the weight will come into play as well. You will find to do that properly will require a full dismantling. Another process best done first on that thrift store western instead of the nice one.!

Actually moon have a free western hat for me (still waiting for the shipping cost). My trade was the free hat for the 25. I can live by... the sacrifice of my free hat for that 25 and the "loss" of a 60's Stetson is not comparable to the "loss" of that 25 if he wants to experiment a conversion.

 

[moehawk]

I got that. The point I was making was simply to not dive into a project like this without practicing on a beater first. That would be a good trade on your side though...

 

[DOGMAN]

I think I was different than most.I jumped in with both feet.My 1st conversion I still wear.A Resistol long hair.I won't pay more than $40 with shipping for any of my conversions.So I wouldn't be out alot if I screwed it up.I have to try no matter what people say.That's the only way I know if I can or can't.And I don't much care for can't.I like do!So I just do it.