Surface Finish on Irvin vs B-3

[avique]

In reading through the various threads here at TFL I've seen a lot of references to the type of finish coatings used on the Irvin and B-3 jackets. From what I've read the B-3's used an acrylic finish and they do not appear to age as well as the Irvin jackets. What type of finish was used on the British jackets?

I'm also curious about references I've seen to using Picards (or other leather conditioners) on these sheepskin jackets. If the outer surface of the jackets are sealed won't the conditioner simply sit on the surface forming a sticky mess?

 

[Dumpster Diver]

You *would* think that, but not so.

Leather is like a sponge, consider it a once living thing, like your skin, no. the finish is on there to preserve the Leather from Oxidizing and dry rotting, Like wood. theres many types of finish for many reasons, not all skin is the same grain. The finish soaks in a little too, thats how it protects. The leather has many Layers to it.

Most sheepskin when its old becomes Fragile even after 10 years it will shrink and dry out. If you like to use Picards, sure!

I personally use Neats foot oil because its cheap!!!

not everyone here has Tens of thousands of dollars invested into Their Jackets...I am one of the younger more financially challenged members here. My vote doesnt count for much.

ok ok, Tangent. NEATSFOOT OIL...Soaks in deep with less working-in. you dont Just have to Use ONE specific product. theres lots of Specific applications when Restoring vintage leather. I dont buy it from the Saddlery because that stuff has more of an industrial un-pleasant chemical smell than what I get at the hardware store.

I have a lot of 70 year old sheepskin Jackets, they are a lot of work to oil and treat, but Ive revived them back to nice ply hunks of hide. Takes years and skill.

People will Tell you the Irvin Jackets out-live the B-3s in terms of Ruggedness and Durability.

Really depends how much you want to spend, you can score a cheap used one pretty good if you Scrounge around awhile, or you can Go huge and commit to the Big dirty Purchase of one of the higher-end Offerings custom fit and made on demand.

I personally Like the Red- Vegetable Tanned B-3 because of how it looks when its time-worn.

 

[avique]

Thanks for the response. However if the surface of a B-3 had an acrylic coating, as mentioned in other threads, and the coating is capable of protecting the sheepskin from rain, chemicals, gasoline, etc. how can the conditioner get through it to nourish the leather below?

 

[rocketeer]

If, as the makers claim for repro B3s, they are tanned and finished as originals were, does that mean they will probably fall apart just like the originals? At least if that was so then it would be someone else's problem in 70 years.
Oh! narly forgot, despite what some makers claim, the finish my 15 year old Eastman B3 after 15 winters of wear in no way compares to an original jacket. And yes I know it's not 70 years old yet.

 

[Dumpster Diver]

LOL, I reeally dont know anything about the finish beyond what I said, Im not a scientist.

Nor do I work at the Tannery.

but what gives the idea that the Coating is capable of protecting the leather at all that way.

I see finished Sheepskin Soaking up stains and all different kinds of Dirt and grime etc. The finish doesnt really form a strong barrier from moisture in my experience, its there to give a nice Tone of colour to otherwise neutral sheepskin more than anything IMO.

If you want to know so bad how it works, personally I would write to Gary Eastman, you never know if hes got the numbers behind the chemistry.

Theres different ways to skin the cat, I figure tanning methods work along the same lines.

all I know is you put the Oil on the leather, then it soaks in with a bit of Rubbing and dabbing. [huh]

I know it SEEMS weird because you dont have to do this with un-finished Leather.

some Jackets Take to it better than others. depends how Dry and thirsty the leather is.

cosmetically you dont have to oil it, but it will help preserve and re-juvinate the natural oil already in the hide.

Its all Acids and bases type biochemistry. I dont understand it at all.

 

[aswatland]

I assume this post is about original B-3 and Irvin jackets. A variety of skins from different breeds of sheep were used for both Irvins and B-3s. Pre-War B-3s were usually made from veg tanned and also chrome tanned fleece and have a hand applied russet colour top coat and are known today as "redskins". They were given a polyacrilate top coat. It is rare for the coating to be 100% in tact these days due to Wartime wear. Similarly Irvins were given a similar protective finish which was supposed to give some protection against flames. From my experience both B-3s and Irvins will absorb conditioner well as the protective coating is porous where it has cracked and flaked.

 

[apba1166]

, I'm also curious about references I've seen to using Picards (or other leather conditioners) on these sheepskin jackets. If the outer surface of the jackets are sealed won't the conditioner simply sit on the surface forming a sticky mess?

I have used leather conditioner on a 30 year old "dried" sheepskin jacket and it did help restore the jacket.

 

[Big J]

My 5 (?) year old Aero B-3 has an excellent coating that has hardly worn off at all (no '50 mission' look for me). This coating is waterproof, and my jacket never soaks up any moisture from rain or snow.

Maybe the Aero coating/coating process is better than the wartime process? No complaints here.

 

[armscye]

If you're looking for a coating that is not fake looking, consider Urad TLC. It's one of the few coatings out there that conditions, and definitely leaves behind a finish with more sheen which dries but remains flexible. TLC smells like pine tar, which I believe is the solvent evaporating. It rejuvenated a sheepskin jacket for me, leaving a rather natural effect like a jacket freshly issued by a quartermaster.