Stetson bummer from Miller

[Neil]

Ordered a Stetson "Murphy" from Miller Hats recently.
Disappointment.
The color in real life is considerably darker than what's displayed on the website. The felt is starched to near-cardboat stiffness, and the size, while marked 61, or 7 5/8, was considerably snugger than my Pinnacle, which is marked as that same size.
Further, Miller does not refund your money. They issue a "store credit," which basically means buy something else from us, or just bugger off.
Defeated, I used the $160 paid toward a Borsalino Como. Which I don't even really want.
You can bet a weeks pay, lads, that Miller will never see another penny of my business.
Village Hats, on the other hand, delivered exactly what I ordered (packable Borsalino Allesandro), and enclosed a nice letter offering a refund or exchange in the event I am not satisfied.
Village Hats, as you can imagine, will get more of my business.

 

[besdor]

I have never heard of the Stetson Murphy so I cant comment on the quality of the hat. What I can say is that Stetson did ship out quite a few hat to us that were rather heavy in weight and stiffness to our stores. The quality is the same as before but the stiffnes may cause the hat to fit differently.
As for the store credit issue with Miller Hats, you need to read each stores refund policy. We give our customers a full refund on the price as always for 61 years. We have gotten quite a few repaeat orders because of this.


Steven
www.bencrafthats.com

 

[Neil]

I know, I know.

It was a foolish consumer mistake, albeit one that will never, ever be repeated.
No beef here about Stetsons. They make a nice hat. But I'm steering clear of Miller after this.

 

[carldelo]

It was a foolish consumer mistake, albeit one that will never, ever be repeated.
No beef here about Stetsons. They make a nice hat. But I'm steering clear of Miller after this.

I've never managed to pull the trigger and buy a hat from Miller because of this policy - sorry it bit you in the wallet like that...

 

[marvelgoose]

I've never managed to pull the trigger and buy a hat from Miller because of this policy - sorry it bit you in the wallet like that...

Looked at the hats there several times, but missed that policy. Never mind!

 

[Goose.]

Looked at the hats there several times, but missed that policy. Never mind!

Yep...what the other Goose guy whose name starts with "Marv" said...
"DANGER!! WILL ROBINSON!!! DANGER!!!"

Goose.
(AKA: Marvin.)

.

 

[jpbales]

it doesn't look like Miller did anything wrong- they have their policy posted on their website and if you can't deal with it then buy from somewhere else (which I'm sure you'll do). They certainly aren't at fault for Stetson's poor quality hat either.

Of course, the "store credit only" refund policy isn't a good one, especially in the online sales of hats where finding the right size can often be hit or miss. Could you not have simply exchanged the hat for one of the same model that fits? It seems like in your post you put the blame on Miller Hats for a hat that Stetson made and a detail you overlooked in your purchase.

 

[Not-Bogart13]

I'm with jpbales on this one. We shouldn't take it out on a vendor when the issue isn't their fault. This was a combination of customer error and manufacturer quality. Always know what you are getting into when buying anything from anyone... especially sight unseen.

I have dealt with Miller many times, and they have been very good to me. They keep their word and make no false claims. If I can't find at least one back-up hat in the event of an exchange, I don't order to start with.

 

[Blackthorn]

Being fairly new to hats, I have twice ordered hats that were too small (I started out thinking I was a 7 1/4, then thought I must be a 7 3/8, finally realized I'm a 7 1/2). One was from http://www.hats-plus.com/ and the other from http://www.noggintops.com/page.cfm?p=1. In each case they cheerfully exchanged for the right size. I'd order again from each of those companies.

 

[Neil]

Stetson

I shouldn't have made so much of the hat's stiffness. It wasn't a big deal. The mis-depiction of the color on the website, and then the no-refund policy, is what irritated me.
I could have switched it for a larger size, had I liked the color. But I just wasn't in the market for that color.
Stetson makes a good hat. I'd buy another. Just not from Miller. Bencraft, Village Hats, anyone with a refund policy, sure.
And yes, I should have read the fine print. My foolish mistake, no doubt about it. Maybe I'll really like the Como.

 

[Blackthorn]

Village Hats, on the other hand, delivered exactly what I ordered (packable Borsalino Allesandro),

I don't mean to hijack your thread, Neil, but how do you like that hat? I need a packable fedora. Have you packed it, and then worn it, many times? How does it hold up over time?

Village Hats, as you can imagine, will get more of my business.

I like Village Hats, too. I bought my very first fedora from their Sacramento store. I wish I lived closer to that store.

 

[jpbales]

well...

pertaining to the color, different monitors display colors differently and lighting can play a role as well.

 

[ScottF]

it doesn't look like Miller did anything wrong- they have their policy posted on their website and if you can't deal with it then buy from somewhere else (which I'm sure you'll do). They certainly aren't at fault for Stetson's poor quality hat either.

Of course, the "store credit only" refund policy isn't a good one, especially in the online sales of hats where finding the right size can often be hit or miss. Could you not have simply exchanged the hat for one of the same model that fits? It seems like in your post you put the blame on Miller Hats for a hat that Stetson made and a detail you overlooked in your purchase.

What they did wrong was, as you stated, to have a refund policy that isn't a good one. The result it that they now have a dissatisfied customer who has passed on his dissatisfaction to a public fedora board (with a huge number of potential Miller Hats customers), and he has drawn attention to their poor refund policy.

It's all about customer satisfaction and repeat sales.

 

[carldelo]

...They certainly aren't at fault for Stetson's poor quality hat either.

I disagree with this part - maybe they didn't make the bad hat, but they shouldn't have sold it either. I think it is incumbent on a retailer to check the quality of the merchandise before it goes out the door. If a hat is poorly made, it should never make it to a customer - isn't that part of what we pay a retailer for?

A while back I received an obvious factory 2nd from a different retailer and had trouble getting my money and shipping back - their attitude was that I get whatever Stetson sends them, and admitted they don't inspect the merchandise at all, which is bogus. I wound up eating the return shipping for a hat that the seller should have returned to the maker for sale at an outlet, rather than trying to pass it off on a customer.

 

[babs]

Moderns... I'd consult a pro there if I could on selections

Ya know, being a newb and acquiring a few vintage lids now with only one modern to compare to.. I'd actually be much more careful and skeptical about ordering a modern hat at all from any of the vendors in comparison. One thing's for sure, I wouldn't make the decision without consulting you guys here for sure on the brand/model/etc.

But yeah it helps if they've got a fairly good satisfaction policy to work with you on a good decision. Too bad unless you're actually talking to someone there who's a hat-fan and trustworthy, you're dealing with a faceless web-page though.

There's value in expressing what you like or are looking for in a quality hat and an actual professional being able to filter the "don't waste your time" hats from your selection and explain what makes B-hat better than A-hat or C-hat. I sure wish a good sales-person would have steered my pre-FL 1st hat purchase from a web-store. Something to be said for paying for service I guess.

 

[jpbales]

there wasn't anything else wrong with the hat apart from it being "stiff," like so many other lower-quality hats and all of Stetson's cowboy hats. If the hat was torn up or broken or something, then I could see how it was Miller's fault. Just because the hat doesn't quite match up to your personal "stiffness" preference doesn't mean that it's Miller's fault for selling it. It's the same as going to a high-end fashion store and paying more a "better" brand. I don't think the retailer responsible for the high prices that Stetson passes on to the customer even if it is an "inferior" (according to your preferences) product.
I was surprised to read, though, "Note: Made by Stetson Especially
for Miller Hats."

 

[carldelo]

True

JP, in fact, I agree with you here - the hat was not defective, just not what the OP was looking for. Clearly I was venting prior baggage about lazy retailers, if you don't mind the egregious metaphor-mixing. A retailer should undertake due diligence to make sure they're not selling poor product, which was not the case in this instance.

 

[jwalls]

After 30+ years of wearing hats I have a strict policy, Vintage or Custom made only. If I cannot put my hands on it I will not spend good money on it. A good custom hatter will make every reasonable effort to satisfy his customer, and guide the customer through the process. Guys, you get that for which you are willing to pay.

 

[gtdean48]

Doing it mail order is a trick unto itself, but I have traded with brick & morter stores that only refund in exchange, not return of funds. I guess the figure they are making a sale, just actually of what will get worked out. I see their point in that they are not in business for you to try out something & get if you don't like it, get your money back. Defective merchandise is another issue which I agree a retailer should be dealing with the manufacturer on that quality issue. Some stores do a money back guarantee but charge a restocking fee to get something out of the transaction. Bottom line, make sure you understand the conditions before making a purchase. I will take Neil's experience into consideration should I see something at Miller's I'd like, like the Douglas. I appreciate Neil for sharing it so I am a more informed shopper. What I hate is having to pay of shipping then if I had to return something defective, I've had to pay for return shipping with some shops! Others have issued a return label at no cost to me. Those get repeat bidness!

 

[jpbales]

JP, in fact, I agree with you here - the hat was not defective, just not what the OP was looking for. Clearly I was venting prior baggage about lazy retailers, if you don't mind the egregious metaphor-mixing. A retailer should undertake due diligence to make sure they're not selling poor product, which was not the case in this instance.

ah I see what you're saying.

What I hate is having to pay of shipping then if I had to return something defective, I've had to pay for return shipping with some shops! Others have issued a return label at no cost to me. Those get repeat bidness!

I hate that as well. I think if it's a flaw in the product or false advertising then the customer shouldn't have to pay for return shipping. But... this is the world we live in.