Sinai and Palestine Campaign

[Mojave Jack]

A bit early for this forum, I know, but can anyone recommend some good references for the Sinai and Palestine Campaign and/or the Desert Mounted Corps?

Thanks, folks!

 

[Story]

I suggest you start with the official Australian history for the Light Horse, along with the British official history for the campaign(s). I just saw reprints online somewhere for $35-45 @.

A quick google offers -

The Australian historiography of the Palestine campaign is still dominated by Henry Gullet's Volume VII of the Official History of Australia in the War of 1914-18, The AIF in Sinai and Palestine. [5] To this book can added the two volumes of the British Official History by George MacMunn and Cyril Falls which, with a reputation for being much drier, are little used by Australian students of the war except when Gullet proves unhelpful. [6]

[5] H.S. Gullet, The AIF in Sinai and Palestine, v. VII, The Official History of Australia in the War of 1914-1918 (1923; St. Lucia, Qld: University of Queensland Press, 1984)

[6] George MacMunn and Cyril Falls, Military operations: Egypt and Palestine from the outbreak of war with Germany to June 1917 (London: HMSO, 1928); Cyril Falls, Military operations: Egypt and Palestine from June 1917 to the end of the war (London: HMSO, 1930)

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/The+P...:+causes+and+consequences+of+a...-a0164112345

 

[cookie]

Sinai etc

A bit early for this forum, I know, but can anyone recommend some good references for the Sinai and Palestine Campaign and/or the Desert Mounted Corps?

Thanks, folks!

Ion Idress Australian author

http://www.abc.net.au/capricornia/stories/s1524374.htm

http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071122050523AA7kiPY

http://smallwarsjournal.com/blog/2007/11/beersheba-sunday-1/
http://1914-1918.invisionzone.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t26827.html

I found this comment

Australian writer Ion Idress would be one of my most admired, his book ‘The Desert Column’ was a ripper, it was about the heroic efforts of Australia’s Light Horse [ mounted infantry] in the Holy Land during world war one. Not only did Ion Idress fight with the Light Horse, he survived and wrote a classic book about it, now that’s what I call a bloody good effort.

 

[Baggers]

T. E. Lawrence's Seven Pillars of Wisdom. I've got an extra copy that's yours for the postage if you want it.

Cheers!

 

[Mojave Jack]

Thanks for the suggestions, gents! I came across a couple of these titles in my searching, but the cost is a bit high. While I'd love to add every book I fancy to my library, 1) the house just isn't large enough, 2) the wife would kill me, and 3) I'd go broke. Unfortunately none of the titles are in either my university library or my local library, so I guess I'll have to do an interlibrary loan if I want to see these things. I may just have to break down and get Gullet's Official History, though Ion Idress' book sure sounds like a whopping good story.

Baggers, thanks for the offer on Seven Pillars! I have a copy here, though I've never been able to get through it. I keep picking it up, and never finishing. I found the biography on Lawrence much more interesting. One of the stories I'll never forget is how he blew the brains out of his own camel with his Webley in his first battle, and was knocked unconscious for the duration. I don't think I've ever heard of him mentioning that!

I've also added Gertrude Bell: Queen of the Desert, Shaper of Nations to my Amazon wish list, and in the course of my search on the Palestine campaign I came across Allenby's Military Medicine: Life and Death World War I Palestine, all about the medical services of Allenby's Egyptian Expeditionary Force in Palestine. My wife will like that, though the cost runs about the same as the others I'd like.

Too many books, too little time!

 

[cookie]

Ion Idress

Thanks for the suggestions, gents! I came across a couple of these titles in my searching, but the cost is a bit high. While I'd love to add every book I fancy to my library, 1) the house just isn't large enough, 2) the wife would kill me, and 3) I'd go broke. Unfortunately none of the titles are in either my university library or my local library, so I guess I'll have to do an interlibrary loan if I want to see these things. I may just have to break down and get Gullet's Official History, though Ion Idress' book sure sounds like a whopping good story.

Baggers, thanks for the offer on Seven Pillars! I have a copy here, though I've never been able to get through it. I keep picking it up, and never finishing. I found the biography on Lawrence much more interesting. One of the stories I'll never forget is how he blew the brains out of his own camel with his Webley in his first battle, and was knocked unconscious for the duration. I don't think I've ever heard of him mentioning that!

I've also added Gertrude Bell: Queen of the Desert, Shaper of Nations to my Amazon wish list, and in the course of my search on the Palestine campaign I came across Allenby's Military Medicine: Life and Death World War I Palestine, all about the medical services of Allenby's Egyptian Expeditionary Force in Palestine. My wife will like that, though the cost runs about the same as the others I'd like.

Too many books, too little time!

I'll have a look in a second hand bookstore for you mate ...

 

[Mojave Jack]

I'll have a look in a second hand bookstore for you mate ...

Much obliged!

 

[Story]

Found this, for those who need visual stimulation

I can just imagine that the seated trooper would need an Oz-to-English interpreter (or subtitles).

 

[kokopelli]

7 pillars.. yes

I would agree.. This is (IMHO) one of the premier recollections of the period as well as the mentality of combatants. I'd love to find one of the vintage copies. Ron

T. E. Lawrence's Seven Pillars of Wisdom. I've got an extra copy that's yours for the postage if you want it.

Cheers!

 

[Story]

Related -

Australia claims it captured Damascus first
By Nick Squires In Sydney
UK Telegraph
12:47pm GMT 13/12/2007

It is nearly 90 years old, but T E Lawrence's claim that he and his Arab guerrillas were the first to enter Damascus has rankled Australian national pride ever since.

A new exhibition, about to open at the national war museum in Canberra, endeavours to put the record straight and make clear that Lawrence, a tireless self-promoter, stole Australia's glory in order to give the Arabs a propaganda boost.

The Australian War Memorial exhibition aims to show that it was the legendary Australian Light Horse, and not Lawrence and his Arabs, who captured Damascus in October 1918.

Tim Fischer, a former deputy prime minister and a keen historian, said Lawrence's failure to acknowledge the key role played by the slouch-hat wearing troopers of the Light Horse was an omission repeated by subsequent British historians.

"It has been a frequent phenomenon for various Brits to write Australia out," Mr Fischer, a Vietnam War veteran, said.

He claimed the Imperial War Museum also ignored the 47,000 Australians killed fighting on the Western Front in World War 1.

"So nothing is new. It is my hope that the Australian War Memorial will provide some balance in its new exhibition."

The exhibition highlights the overlooked role of Australian troops and their commander Henry Chauvel, who played a crucial role in the defeat of Turkish Ottoman forces in Palestine and Syria.

Called 'Lawrence of Arabia and the Light Horse', it includes a Lee Enfield rifle presented by Lawrence to King George V, now on loan from the Queen.

In his war memoir Seven Pillars of Wisdom, Lawrence ignored the role of the Australian Light Horse in securing Damascus, instead claiming the victory for his Arab forces.

In fact it was the Australians, under the command of Chauvel, the capable commander of the Desert Mounted Corps, who first swept into Damascus, entering the city at 5 a.m. on October 1, 1918.

But within a couple of hours they pushed through the town to chase fleeing Turkish forces along the Aleppo road, clearing the way for the Arab army to enter Damascus later the same day.

Lawrence made a grand entry in a Rolls Royce.

"What Lawrence was trying to do was make the best case he could for Arab self-determination," said exhibition curator Mal Booth.

"I think he inflates the Arab claims in Damascus. Essentially it was Chauvel who took the town as the overall commander."

The misconception was reinforced in David Lean's epic 1962 film, starring Peter O'Toole as Lawrence, which depicted a triumphant Arab entry into Damascus.

Lawrence, who later joined the RAF, changed his name to Shaw and died in a motorcycle accident in 1935, wrote Seven Pillars with the aim of bolstering the role played by his irregulars in order to strengthen the cause of Arab self-determination.

But in 1927 he admitted to a biographer that the Damascus chapter of Seven Pillars was full of half truths, said Mr Booth.

"Lawrence didn’t actually tell lies. If anything, he underestimated his own role in order to praise others. He wanted to beat up the Arab cause."

 

[kokopelli]

Yes.. Very related

My research points to similar conclusions and explanations. I don't believe that Lawrence was the first to enter Damascus. I suppose it was similar to other "famous city entries" throughout history in that the city is taken and then "someone rides triumphantly in". The Australian contribution to the war effort has long been overlooked if not outright slighted. By all accounts, Lawrence was appalled by the "High Command's" indifference to the Arab cause after the conflict and could have played up the Arab contribution in his writing as much to thwart the British "High Command" as anything else. He wasn't exactly a British military advocate and seemed to have a love-hate relationship with them at best. A very complex man, to say the least.
Regardless, Lawrence's efforts failed to create the Arab state he wanted and the result probably helped to get us in the situation we have today; much like the French insistence on punishing the Germans with a 100% liability. The book is a phenomenal work, from memory, and the most comprehensive text of the day that I've found.
I've read everything from the Australian perspective that I can find on the web. Did any of them write an historical account of the campaigns? Ron

Australia claims it captured Damascus first
By Nick Squires In Sydney
UK Telegraph
12:47pm GMT 13/12/2007

It is nearly 90 years old, but T E Lawrence's claim that he and his Arab guerrillas were the first to enter Damascus has rankled Australian national pride ever since.

A new exhibition, about to open at the national war museum in Canberra, endeavours to put the record straight and make clear that Lawrence, a tireless self-promoter, stole Australia's glory in order to give the Arabs a propaganda boost.

The Australian War Memorial exhibition aims to show that it was the legendary Australian Light Horse, and not Lawrence and his Arabs, who captured Damascus in October 1918.

Tim Fischer, a former deputy prime minister and a keen historian, said Lawrence's failure to acknowledge the key role played by the slouch-hat wearing troopers of the Light Horse was an omission repeated by subsequent British historians.

"It has been a frequent phenomenon for various Brits to write Australia out," Mr Fischer, a Vietnam War veteran, said.

He claimed the Imperial War Museum also ignored the 47,000 Australians killed fighting on the Western Front in World War 1.

"So nothing is new. It is my hope that the Australian War Memorial will provide some balance in its new exhibition."

The exhibition highlights the overlooked role of Australian troops and their commander Henry Chauvel, who played a crucial role in the defeat of Turkish Ottoman forces in Palestine and Syria.

Called 'Lawrence of Arabia and the Light Horse', it includes a Lee Enfield rifle presented by Lawrence to King George V, now on loan from the Queen.

In his war memoir Seven Pillars of Wisdom, Lawrence ignored the role of the Australian Light Horse in securing Damascus, instead claiming the victory for his Arab forces.

In fact it was the Australians, under the command of Chauvel, the capable commander of the Desert Mounted Corps, who first swept into Damascus, entering the city at 5 a.m. on October 1, 1918.

But within a couple of hours they pushed through the town to chase fleeing Turkish forces along the Aleppo road, clearing the way for the Arab army to enter Damascus later the same day.

Lawrence made a grand entry in a Rolls Royce.

"What Lawrence was trying to do was make the best case he could for Arab self-determination," said exhibition curator Mal Booth.

"I think he inflates the Arab claims in Damascus. Essentially it was Chauvel who took the town as the overall commander."

The misconception was reinforced in David Lean's epic 1962 film, starring Peter O'Toole as Lawrence, which depicted a triumphant Arab entry into Damascus.

Lawrence, who later joined the RAF, changed his name to Shaw and died in a motorcycle accident in 1935, wrote Seven Pillars with the aim of bolstering the role played by his irregulars in order to strengthen the cause of Arab self-determination.

But in 1927 he admitted to a biographer that the Damascus chapter of Seven Pillars was full of half truths, said Mr Booth.

"Lawrence didn’t actually tell lies. If anything, he underestimated his own role in order to praise others. He wanted to beat up the Arab cause."

 

[dr greg]

ride boldly ride

We covered some of this ground here a while back
http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?p=433588#post433588

 

[kokopelli]

Yes

Yes, I read that earlier. I'm amazed that such threads are on this site. There's not really too many that remember the anniversary of the "last mounted cavalry charge".. Great stuff.. Ron

We covered some of this ground here a while back
http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?p=433588#post433588

 

[Mojave Jack]

Dr Greg, I missed that thread; thanks for the heads up! Great stuff all around, gents. Thanks to all for all the great material. Lots of reading ahead of me!

Cookie, I let a copy of The Desert Column evade me on the 'Bay. I've spent a bit too much on myself in these last days before X-mas, and a wave of guilt prevented me from bidding. It's on my list, though, and I will find a copy.

 

[dr greg]

part two

There was further involvement of Australian troops in this part of the world, in WW2, the Syrian campaign in what is now Lebanon, and 2 VC's were won in the mountains and around the Litani river, which is roughly where the Israelis recently seriously underestimated Hezbollah's capabilities.
The battle there was interesting as it featured a duel between field artillery and Vichy naval units.
http://www.ausvets.powerup.com.au/crete.htm

 

[kokopelli]

Nice website

Very nice addition.. Thanks ron

There was further involvement of Australian troops in this part of the world, in WW2, the Syrian campaign in what is now Lebanon, and 2 VC's were won in the mountains and around the Litani river, which is roughly where the Israelis recently seriously underestimated Hezbollah's capabilities.
The battle there was interesting as it featured a duel between field artillery and Vichy naval units.
http://www.ausvets.powerup.com.au/crete.htm

 

[cookie]

Sir Roden Cutler VC

Sir Roden was the most famous guy ever to come out of my town. He was the only artilleryman to ever get a VC and I actually lived lived next door to his house in Addison Rd Manly years ago.

His old house was tragically pulled down but a fine statue of him as a Digger is to be found outside the Manly Village School. He was also the longest serving Governor of NSW and a distinguished post WW2 diplomat. Anyone interested can read the famous Colleen McCullough's biography of him "Roden Cutler VC". Dr Gregs thread link tells you how he won his VC in Syria/Modern Lebanon.

 

[Story]

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/simpson-may-get-his-vc-yet/2007/12/22/1198175406070.html

GALLIPOLI war hero John Simpson (pictured), who rescued wounded diggers with his donkey, could be among the first recipients of an Australian-issued Victoria Cross.

*
A total of 96 Australians have been awarded the VC, the highest military honour for bravery; six in the Boer War, 64 in WWI, two in North Russia, 20 in WWII and four in Vietnam.

Several Australian war heroes were recommended for VCs at the time but were knocked back by British authorities.

In 1991 the Australian government decided it would rule if an Australian should get the Victoria Cross.

None has been awarded since then, but now several deserving Australian war heroes could finally get their VC if the new tribunal recommends retrospective VC awards to the Government.

These include WWI heroes such as Simpson, who repeatedly risked his life at Gallipoli in 1915, running a gauntlet of machine-gun fire and snipers 12 times a day to bring wounded diggers down from the battle front on the back of a donkey. After 24 days he was killed.

 

[Story]

Seven World War II veterans have visited the Anzac memorial in Sydney's Hyde Park ahead of their journey to Israel for the dedication of a memorial to the Australian Light Horse.

The Park of the Australian Soldier is at Beersheba, the site of a famous World War I battle involving the Light Horse.

The World War II veterans, aged in their eighties, are attending the ceremony in Israel because there are no surviving Light Horsemen from World War I.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/04/22/2223991.htm?section=justin

Pics of one of the vets in uniform here
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national...or-fallen-mates/2008/04/20/1208629731274.html

 

[Story]

When the British sought to quell unrest in Palestine in the 1930s, they turned to an uncompromising Irish policeman, who came up with a drastic and expensive solution - a network of fortresses that today stand as monuments to a lost empire.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19019949