Safari Express rifle pic thread

[Oldsarge]

Probably the most painful rifle I ever shot was a Weatherby 30/06 with a composite stock in that silly Weatherby California shape. Man, three shots of that thing was too much! I gave it back to the owner and went back to my .375!

 

[Roving_Bohemian]

I was getting hyped about Safari rifles and was perusing another forum where a "poster" said that "express" just implies "open/iron sights"... is that true, or was this individual mis-informed?

I'm really excited about the possibility that I might get a "Safari gun" and now I'm researching the smoke out of them! They (guns) are really addictive, but I guess it's better than drugs!

Any suggestions from those with more experience (anyone) than I are welcome to make suggestions as to the rifle+caliber I should look for... and PLEASE,
post more pics!
I've really enjoyed seeing all your guns, so if you've run out of photos and shown every Safari Express you have then pose with them, show them in action, let us enjoy (with our eyes) the finesse of your beuatiful creatures!

 

[Oldsarge]

Express sights are for young eyes. Alternately, they are for double rifles that are handled like heavy weight shotguns to stop a charge. For the vast majority of shooters, peep sights are best in the bush. It's very rare that you will encounter a shot in Africa that is at sufficient range that a scope is really worth while. I've never shot a single animal in Africa at over a hundred and twenty-five yards and most shots have been under fifty. So a good peep sight, like the CZ 550 shown above, or a vintage Lyman 48 works beautifully. As to caliber, most Africa hands will tell you that there is no cartridge superior to the .375 for general African shooting. You would have to shoot extremely accurately with one to stop a charging elephant, rhino, etc. and they are a bit heavy for duiker. But the fact remains, as Boddington has so eloquently said, that on safari you simply don't want to be to far away from a .375. Once you have one of those, you can consider something heavier. I use a .404 Jeffery or a .450 Rigby but if I were to start out fresh, I'd go to the CZ 550 Safari Classic in .505 Gibbs. That's really a very specialized caliber, mostly used to solve a problem that you really shouldn't have had in the first place but things happen, yanno? Anyway, start with a .375 and have a good, steel peep sight put on it. You'll never regret it.

 

[jkingrph]

Express sights are for young eyes. Alternately, they are for double rifles that are handled like heavy weight shotguns to stop a charge. For the vast majority of shooters, peep sights are best in the bush. It's very rare that you will encounter a shot in Africa that is at sufficient range that a scope is really worth while. I've never shot a single animal in Africa at over a hundred and twenty-five yards and most shots have been under fifty. So a good peep sight, like the CZ 550 shown above, or a vintage Lyman 48 works beautifully. As to caliber, most Africa hands will tell you that there is no cartridge superior to the .375 for general African shooting. You would have to shoot extremely accurately with one to stop a charging elephant, rhino, etc. and they are a bit heavy for duiker. But the fact remains, as Boddington has so eloquently said, that on safari you simply don't want to be to far away from a .375. Once you have one of those, you can consider something heavier. I use a .404 Jeffery or a .450 Rigby but if I were to start out fresh, I'd go to the CZ 550 Safari Classic in .505 Gibbs. That's really a very specialized caliber, mostly used to solve a problem that you really shouldn't have had in the first place but things happen, yanno? Anyway, start with a .375 and have a good, steel peep sight put on it. You'll never regret it.

After I saw that peep on the CZ Bruno, I promptly ordered one from Brownells. I have one on a Ruger #1, it's much blockier looking and not nearly as elegant, but I did not know that they had one for the CZ, and had been thinking about a peep for a long time.

 

[Renault]

So far I can still see the express sights on my Whitworth pretty well. But I do have a 1.5 x 5 Leupold on it with Leupold quick release rings. But a ghost ring peep, as many have stated above, would be the ultimate on the back country hunt.

I was suprised at the shots I was making the other weekend with OS on my 9.3 x 57! Without glasses!!!! And I'm going "blind" fast!!!!

Renalt

 

[jkingrph]

It would certainly be great fun but trying to assemble the entire Lounge in one central location would be a challenge. On the up side, there is certainly more room for shooting in the Heartland than there is on the Urban coasts!

Now, on the subject of perceived recoil. When a heavy rifle is custom built by a knowledgeable smith, you will find that it has several features. As you pointed out, it will definitely weigh more. My .450 Rigby weighs 10 1/4 lbs, empty and I wouldn't want it an ounce less! The fashion for fly weight rifles in heavy calibers is a sad commentary on the physical fitness of the shooting public. Additionally, the butt stock will be a good two inches wide and heavily padded. The third factor, and one that may not be obvious to all, is that the length of pull should be at least as long as your favorite shotgun. Target shooters, especially international competitors, tend to go for very short LOP so that they can keep their arms as close to their bodies as possible. It's steadier. In a heavy caliber, however, that will get your thumb driven right into your nose, a very unpleasant sensation! I am having the .450 restocked this autumn and I have arranged for the LOP to be 18". Admittedly, I'm six feet tall and have very long arms but that isn't really the point. I want my thumb farther away from my face!

A lot of good info about weight and stock design here.

Back in 1963, when I finished high school dad got me my first centerfire rifle. He won it in a sales contest with Underwood typewriter co, a Winchester Model 70 featherweight in 30-06. It came in about mid June so weather was hot when I first shot it. We stopped by a discount store and picked up a box of 180 gr Rem ammo and proceeded to the range. The only shirt I had on was a t shirt, no padding at all. That gun beat the xxxx out of me. Less than a half a box of ammo and my shoulder was weeping a bit of blood.

Like you I am 6' with long arms. First thing I did was install a thick recoil pad without cutting anything off the stock. I think the extra 1 1/4" in lop did more to tame it than the acutal recoil pad. After that I could shoot it all day with no pain.

Nowdays I still like a longer lop, as well as a wider buttplate. I often use one of the slip on or lace on Action eze or Galco type leather pads, where the leather wraps around the end making the pad wider. On some guns, such as my Ruger #1's I make some spacers to put inside the slip on pad to make the lop even longer.
I like to keep the thumb away from my nose and a scope ring away from my eye.

I do not have any really big bores, the largest being a Ruger #1 in 458 Win mag and it's easy to shoot. The same model rifle in 375H&H would come back so fast that off a bench as was required at one public range, I found myself jerking my head back to avoid the scope. I have since mounted a Lyman scout scope so the eye relief in no longer a problem.

 

[Renault]

Shameless plug. Yeah, shooting paper is much easier that the real thing. But the nice thing about this is there were no wild animals injured or killed during the filming of this production! (Which also means nothing to skin and butcher!) However that evening there was quite a massacre of brain cells. I've had to skin & butcher some pretty big game animals in the past and I simply can't imagine having to do one of these !!!!!!

Brained him at 75 then 50 yds, offhand.

Renault

 

[Oldsarge]

LOL!
I've heard that jumbos taste good but are rather like chewing tire treads. An acquaintance of mine years back shot a 60 pounder in Zim. He didn't know it at the time but some scouts from the nearest village were shadowing his hunt. Once the bull was on the ground they hot-footed it back and brought out the whole village. The tusks, ears and "It's the best part, Bwana" trunk were put aside for him and then they set to butchering. From shot to nothing but the largest bones and a red stain in the sand, elapsed time . . . six hours flat! That village had had no meat since February and this was June.

 

[Renault]

Yeah I was reading some of J.A. Hunter's writings the other night concerning the "butchering" techniques of the local villagers on these creatures....... Apparently it was nothing short of a shark style feeding frenzy. With as many knife wounds being suffered by butchers as the poor animal!

RS

 

[J.D. Hunt]

RS, once a rifleman always a rifleman. While our eyes and mind might dim, our bodies never forget how to place metal on the target. I was not suprised by the lads reports from the last hunt. J.D.H.

 

[1961MJS]

Hi

To jump back on the recoil deal (I was out of town for 4 days). I've shot a .270 Winchester Sporter, a .30-06, and a .338 Win Mag. Of the three, the .30-06 kicked the worst. An old friend whose late father was a banker by day, and the great white hunter on vacation, told me that shooting a .300 Win Mag was like having your head attached to a buggy whip. The .338 kicked me further, but more slowly. Dan said the same thing about the .375 H&H, you ended up a few feet back, but it didn't hurt at all. I'll probably never elk hunt because the older you are, the more you need a 2.5 pound .300 Remington Ultra Mag, which would send your shoulder into the next state...

The key to not receiving the "I"m Stupid" scope ring mark on the forehead is to keep your head upright and your cheek WELDED to the stock. I got down over my .270 on the bench, got my stupid mark, and bleed like a stuck pig for about 15 minutes.

Stock shape is also very important, I don't know exactly what to look for, but a Ruger Red Label kicks the crap out of me while a Browning Citori doesn't. I used the SAME BOX of ammo too. I don't own either unfortunately.

Later

 

[Oldsarge]

Okay, not that I've figured out how to use the camera (again!) here we go:


A Greener "African Game Park Warden Model" in the great old .318 Westley Richards. This is the ancestor of the highly touted (but seldom made) .333 OKH which is itself the ancestor of the excellent .338/06. Imaging a 250 gr. softnose at 2500 foot seconds. Penetration is amazing and the exit wounds are . . . impressive!

A BSA .404 Jeffery with an unfortunate mid-fifties Monte Carlo stock. Not terribly aesthetic, perhaps, but very comfortable to shoot and hits like the hammer of Thor on soft-skinned game. Probably the most commonly used caliber by game managers in Africa before WWII, except in Uganda where they preferred the .425 Westley Richards.

And "Lily Martel" my 'world rifle'. She's a Paul Jaeger semi-custom on a Whitworth action in .375 H&H. This is my go-to, go-everywhere (especially the Arctic) rifle. Black chrome finish, composite stock, Leupold 1.5x5 scope and capable of putting three 300 gr. Nosler Partitions into a thumbnail at 100 yards. A rifle like that really builds your confidence.

 

[jkingrph]

Okay, not that I've figured out how to use the camera (again!) here we go:


A Greener "African Game Park Warden Model" in the great old .318 Westley Richards. This is the ancestor of the highly touted (but seldom made) .333 OKH which is itself the ancestor of the excellent .338/06. Imaging a 250 gr. softnose at 2500 foot seconds. Penetration is amazing and the exit wounds are . . . impressive!

A BSA .404 Jeffery with an unfortunate mid-fifties Monte Carlo stock. Not terribly aesthetic, perhaps, but very comfortable to shoot and hits like the hammer of Thor on soft-skinned game. Probably the most commonly used caliber by game managers in Africa before WWII, except in Uganda where they preferred the .425 Westley Richards.

And "Lily Martel" my 'world rifle'. She's a Paul Jaeger semi-custom on a Whitworth action in .375 H&H. This is my go-to, go-everywhere (especially the Arctic) rifle. Black chrome finish, composite stock, Leupold 1.5x5 scope and capable of putting three 300 gr. Nosler Partitions into a thumbnail at 100 yards. A rifle like that really builds your confidence.

All very nice, makes my mouth water!

I no longer hunt, and never went after anything larger than Whitetail or wild eurasian boar when I was stationed in Turkey, but If I did I would like a rifle configuered exactly like the little Husqvarna M46 in 9.3x57
I have, but built on a M 98 Masuer action vs the M 96 action on my M 46, and chamberedin 9.3x62, which approaches 375 H&H power,and is generally considered the absolute minumum caliber for dangerous game in Africa. That M 46 is the quickest pointing rifle I have ever handled,the only thing I could think of that would be quicker would be a good double rifle.

 

[Renault]

Be back in a minute fellas. Just now busted another big boar in the yard!!!!!! That's two in two weeks!!!!

Renault

 

[Oldsarge]

I've heard about your Texas piggy problems. For some reason, though we have a bunch of them in California, they aren't completely over running the state. They are, however, the second most popular big game animal in the state.

Anyway, the 9.3x62 really is a whiz bang cartridge. As jk so accurately pointed out, it is a fully qualified Class I dangerous game caliber and one that is very popular in Scandinavia on moose as well as being very popular in Romania for brown bear. The French love it for the boar that are as big a pest in France as they are in Texas! Imagine, hunting the vineyards and fields of France with no bag limits and no closed seasons! If I should ever realize my daydream of a canal yacht on the European waterways, I would definitely have one on board.

 

[J.D. Hunt]

Be back in a minute fellas. Just now busted another big boar in the yard!!!!!! That's two in two weeks!!!!

Renault

RS, one a week is fine. More than that and they might hire a shooter. A bagged pig is good sausage. JDH

 

[Renault]

Okay all, I am back. Just helped my neighbor load the porker in the back of his truck. He takes all the pigs I will shoot. And he can us the help! My son currently has four wild shoats penned up he is feeding out for the freezer. This one tonight (maybe 200 lbs) was the one that's been raiding the local yards here. He was in our yard several nights ago in the wee morning hours. Neighbor across the fencline just put out a bunch of grass in her yard. Lasted one night!!!!!!!! In reality, I really don't consider the pigs that much of a pest. But more like manna from heaven so to speak. We've always have a ready source of fresh meat.

This is the rifle I used this evening. I took a big sow with it, same place in the yard, Monday before last! It's a nice old 98 sporter prolly made right after the war. It's a bit nicer than the usual "cigarette"gun. Calibre? 30-06!!!! And this 06 is a mere pup to shoot! I love it!!!!!! Has see-thru claw mounts and an old 4x Nickel brand German scope with the typical German 3-post recticle..... I suppose if you stretched the definition it might qualify as an "express" rifle. Does have a 3-leaf rear sight.....

Renault

 

[Harp]

R:

I am green with envy. Ever harvest the tusks?

 

[Renault]

R:

I am green with envy. Ever harvest the tusks?

I have one really good set on a boar I killed here April last year. Had the head European mounted. Shot it with my 9.3 x 62. Tonites pig had small cutters. He was maybe 3 years old. My son in law killed another big boar last year a month before i killed my big one. His was much bigger bodied, but the tusks were about the same. Still big and would do a number on you!!!!!!!!!!

Renault

 

[Oldsarge]

The first piggy I shot up near Red Bluff, CA had teeth sharp enough to cut my finger on. That's when I learned the virtues of stoutly built bullets.

Nice piece of walnut on that '98, Renault.