Retro-extremists? What are we called?

[Feraud]

I am beginning to believe I am the only conservative left.

Surely you jest? There are many here with conservative views. It's just not worn on the sleeve as a badge of honor.

Religion and politics are best left in the church/home/heart and the voting booth.

 

[Carlisle Blues]

We just tend to get shouted down.

Yes we all get a dose of that....

If you read earlier posts you would see that I was told I was no longer welcomed here because those posters made assumptions about me that were unfounded and without merit. Well I am here and here I will stay.

Now I have to go and feed my wood stove so the fire does not go out. That is how I heat my house.

 

[Lokar]

This is why politics are banned, people. Keep it out of the thread, please. This is interesting and I don't want to see it closed.

 

[Miss Neecerie]

Honestly folks.

Anyone who has terminated employment over a 'vintage related issue' (dress, music, atmosphere etc.)


Has much bigger issues in life then 'what do I call myself'


Honestly....the working world sucks for pretty much everyone, in one way or another. If one wishes to earn at the best potential....you suck it up, deal with it for 8 hours a day and go home and change into your 'true self'....This is the way it has been since the dawn of time....nothing new about sacrificing your 'personality' to earn a paycheck.

The factory workers of the industrial revolution were sometimes -locked- in rooms with no bathroom breaks and in unsafe conditions........hearing some crappy music or having to wear a polyester polo shirt because its 'what is done here'....pales in comparison to that.

 

[LizzieMaine]

This is why politics are banned, people. Keep it out of the thread, please. This is interesting and I don't want to see it closed.

As was said earlier, political beliefs really have nothing to do with atavism as such -- an atavist might be a New Dealer, a Liberty Leaguer, or anything in between.

(PS, I'm being facetious. Please don't start in on court-packing or the constitutionality of the NRA.)

 

[LizzieMaine]

Honestly....the working world sucks for pretty much everyone, in one way or another. If one wishes to earn at the best potential....you suck it up, deal with it for 8 hours a day and go home and change into your 'true self'....This is the way it has been since the dawn of time....nothing new about sacrificing your 'personality' to earn a paycheck.

Which brings up another interesting point -- would an atavist, as described in this thread, *generally* make employment-type decisions based on such issues? I think the Senator's case was likely an extraordinary one, but I can think of other situations where this issue might come up. For example, during my years in radio I worked at a couple of different "adult contemporary" radio stations. I was in news, so I didn't have to deal with the music much, and I learned to just tune it out and ignore it -- after a while, it just became part of the routine buzz of office noise, and it didn't bother me.

But I don't think I could have worked at a hard-rock station -- leaving aside the fact that I wasn't the type who gets hired at such places in the first place, I don't think I could have tuned it out to the extent that I did the other stuff, and I don't think I could have successfully worked in such an environment. It'd just be a culture too far afield from my own for me to successfully assimilate into it, and I probably wouldn't have even tried.

 

[Lokar]

I'd also like to point out that a large part of this forum's membership are not American, and our politics are quite different to what they are in the US. Not only does this mean discussions about US politics are not particularly interesting, but it "locks us out", so to speak. If atavism/anachronism were to include conservative US political views (not that it does), it would be a US only club.

Apologies for the irony of trying to stop political talk by mentioning it, but I thought it was a somewhat important point.

 

[scotrace]

Apologies for the irony of trying to stop political talk by mentioning it, but I thought it was a somewhat important point.

Yes it is, but it's still politics. It's best to not put a toe in that water at all.

 

[SGT Rocket]

Conservative

Pick a name Lizzie and Senator. I can see it is something you both and I am sure many others that can relate want to do.

so funny that I picked this forum years ago because I thought it was for very conservative people that liked to dress in the formal attire. I am beginning to believe I am the only conservative left.

I'm conservative.

But, I'm also in it for the pin-up girls!

 

[dhermann1]

(Deep breath . . . . )
What I'm seeing so far is a simple attempt to find a label that will enhance rather than undermine or diminiish our sense of identity. The problem has been, what is it exactly the this label will denote? That's how we stumbled into this raucous but still (more or less) civilized discussion. The problem is, no matter what label we give, it will always apply in varying degrees and differing ways to each individual it's applied to. We're all secure enough to know that NO label can define or confine us. The label will have to be applied across a spectrum of lifestyle choices, attitudes, emotional profiles, etc., etc. We have nouns, we have adjectives. We can say "I'm a hardcore atavist", or "I'm a bit of an atavist", or "I'm a closet atavist." "I'm an ultra-conservative atavist." "I'm a commie pinko atavist." That's how it's gonna be.
I'm finding myself gravitating to the word atavist. Not by conscious decision, but by internal consensus.
(Deep breath . . . . )
Next . . . .

 

[Miss Neecerie]

Which brings up another interesting point -- would an atavist, as described in this thread, *generally* make employment-type decisions based on such issues? I think the Senator's case was likely an extraordinary one, but I can think of other situations where this issue might come up. For example, during my years in radio I worked at a couple of different "adult contemporary" radio stations. I was in news, so I didn't have to deal with the music much, and I learned to just tune it out and ignore it -- after a while, it just became part of the routine buzz of office noise, and it didn't bother me.

I was not only referring to his situation......I have known of others who have made employment decisions based on such things as : "oh thats too far to drive to in my vintage car....." etc.....

So perhaps not 'generally'...much like there would not necessarily be anything else that you could say "100% of Atavists do ....."

But I still firmly believe...(and sorry if this makes me a judgmental wretch, I accept that it probably does)...that when you make an employment choice that negatively affects your life (and that negative is for you to decide...fine if you want to live on half the salary you could in order to be able to wear vintage stuff to work).....

You have bigger things to be worrying about then a name.....

In that sense its verging on the guys who -won't- go get a job because it would impinge on computer game time in their life.

It's avoidance of reality. And maybe its coated in a nicer 'olde timey' wrapper then the hard core gamer guys who never move from their chairs..

Those guys also feel a lack of commonality with 'culture' at large and would rather live in their pretend world online........same 'mental thing'...different manifestation.

 

[LizzieMaine]

But I still firmly believe...(and sorry if this makes me a judgmental wretch, I accept that it probably does)...that when you make an employment choice that negatively affects your life (and that negative is for you to decide...fine if you want to live on half the salary you could in order to be able to wear vintage stuff to work).....

I think it would go deeper than just "being able to wear vintage to work," though. That's a surface thing, and something which might apply to any hobby or special interest - "I don't want to take that job because the boss is a Yankee fan, and he'll rag me for wearing my Red Sox jacket."

What I think the Senator was suggesting, and what I was referring to in my comments about working in a hypothetical hard-rock radio station is a fundamental inability to fit into or adapt to the workplace culture -- I was able to do it at the A/C station, because it wasn't too far a reach, but knowing in advance that a hard-rock-oriented culture would not be a good fit for me, I wouldn't have applied to such a station because I would have known I wouldn't be able to give them what the job demanded. That's a matter of cultural incompatibility, not a question of aesthetics.

Or to put in other terms, I had a brother who was discharged from the service for "inability to adjust to military life." The culture he was being required to adapt to was simply too far removed from the culture he was raised in for him to successfully fit into it. I think the situation for an atavist could be very much the same.

 

[Miss Neecerie]

I think it would go deeper than just "being able to wear vintage to work," though. That's a surface thing, and something which might apply to any hobby or special interest - "I don't want to take that job because the boss is a Yankee fan, and he'll rag me for wearing my Red Sox jacket."

What I think the Senator was suggesting, and what I was referring to in my comments about working in a hypothetical hard-rock radio station is an essential inability to fit into or adapt to the workplace culture -- I was able to do it at the A/C station, because it wasn't too far a reach, but knowing in advance that a hard-rock-oriented culture would not be a good fit for me, I wouldn't have applied to such a station because I would have known I wouldn't be able to give them what the job demanded. That's a matter of cultural incompatibility, not a question of aesthetics.

Of course....

But here is where the counter to that is...

I do not fit in at work. Period.

Not because I might wish to wear vintage....at work I look like everyone else...with a leaning toward wearing too much black (goth past)

But because I share -nothing- (and I really mean nothing...zero) in common with any of my coworkers.

I share nothing of myself here at my place of employment, because based on conversations overheard, they would not like me, think me odd, etc.

They all have 19 year old kids, 2 cars, vacation in tropical places, etc....

I struggle to pay bills and make rent...knowing I make 1/4 of their salaries.

But despite having -nothing- positive here in terms of 'fitting in'.....I get up every day, head to work, put on my 'Work self" and deal with it all. I have inane conversations about topics that don't interest me, with people I don't really have things to talk about with.

And then every night, right as I take off my badge in the car....I put back on my -real self-...the one with friends who understand me, conversations I -care- about...

Why? Why do I do this rather then choose to make half as much money in a place where I 'fit in'...?

Because work is not life. Life is life, and nice things require money, and I like having things....(old, new doesnt matter which we are talking about here)....a roof over my head costs money too....

Honestly...does -anyone- fit into 'workplace culture'?????

You play the game of at least meshing enough to not be spotted, you do a damn good job in -case- you are spotted...by then they NEED you, you get a paycheck, you go home and be yourself again.

That's how it works for ALL subcultures....the high achieving goths hide at jobs, so do high achieving rockabillies, etc.

The lucky few work in a field they can be themselves in.

 

[LizzieMaine]

Why? Why do I do this rather then choose to make half as much money in a place where I 'fit in'...?

Because work is not life. Life is life, and nice things require money, and I like having things....(old, new doesnt matter which we are talking about here)....a roof over my head costs money too....

Honestly...does -anyone- fit into 'workplace culture'?????

Well, you're a stronger soul than me, Miss N. The one time in my working life I tried to do that I couldn't handle it. I'd come home at night every night with a migraine, throw up, and go to bed. I did it for ten months before I asked myself if it was worth it, said *no, it ain't by a damsite,* and walked off the job. I just couldn't handle the culture of the place, and took a different job at two-thirds the pay just to keep my sanity. That's not quite the same as the Senator's situation, but it does tell me that whatever the particular reasons for it, sometimes there are just situations one is fundamentally incompatible with.

 

[Edward]

Of course....

But here is where the counter to that is...

I do not fit in at work. Period.

Not because I might wish to wear vintage....at work I look like everyone else...with a leaning toward wearing too much black (goth past)

But because I share -nothing- (and I really mean nothing...zero) in common with any of my coworkers.

I share nothing of myself here at my place of employment, because based on conversations overheard, they would not like me, think me odd, etc.

They all have 19 year old kids, 2 cars, vacation in tropical places, etc....

I struggle to pay bills and make rent...knowing I make 1/4 of their salaries.

But despite having -nothing- positive here in terms of 'fitting in'.....I get up every day, head to work, put on my 'Work self" and deal with it all. I have inane conversations about topics that don't interest me, with people I don't really have things to talk about with.

And then every night, right as I take off my badge in the car....I put back on my -real self-...the one with friends who understand me, conversations I -care- about...

Why? Why do I do this rather then choose to make half as much money in a place where I 'fit in'...?

Because work is not life. Life is life, and nice things require money, and I like having things....(old, new doesnt matter which we are talking about here)....a roof over my head costs money too....

Honestly...does -anyone- fit into 'workplace culture'?????

You play the game of at least meshing enough to not be spotted, you do a damn good job in -case- you are spotted...by then they NEED you, you get a paycheck, you go home and be yourself again.

That's how it works for ALL subcultures....the high achieving goths hide at jobs, so do high achieving rockabillies, etc.

The lucky few work in a field they can be themselves in.

Probable the case for most of us. I'm very fortunate that, working in academia where eccentricity comes with the territory, I'm free to dress vintage or vintage inspired every day. a lot of jobs, uniformed or otherwise, that wouldn't be the case.

 

[Miss Neecerie]

Well, you're a stronger soul than me, Miss N. The one time in my working life I tried to do that I couldn't handle it. I'd come home at night every night with a migraine, throw up, and go to bed. I did it for ten months before I asked myself if it was worth it, said *no, it ain't by a damsite,* and walked off the job. I just couldn't handle the culture of the place, and took a different job at two-thirds the pay just to keep my sanity. That's not quite the same as the Senator's situation, but it does tell me that whatever the particular reasons for it, sometimes there are just situations one is fundamentally incompatible with.

And don't get me wrong...I am not disrespecting that choice at all.

I am just saying that in relation to the workplace side of this, I honestly thing we make sacrifices to have other things we want.

I don't fit in.....but i choose to do it anyhow.

Just like I highly doubt, the Naval officer who 'cant ask and cannot tell' thinks he 'fits in the culture' of his work place. He likely drives home, and walks into a house where he can -be himself-......

I think that sort of life compromise is much more common then people think.

The workplace is a constructed social environment and culture. I bet if you asked my coworkers, they would say they have nothing in common with people here.....

I think it is probably less common to decide ones personal lifestyle is -more important- then future potential etc.....

 

[dhermann1]

That's interesting, Ms N, but I don't see how it's germaine to the discussion.

 

[John in Covina]

Anachronist is beautiful, auditorily, but doesn't it have quite a negative connotation? I mean, the words "anachronism" and "anachronistic" are mostly used in a negative sense, kind of like "old-fashioned". In everyday language, it has a connotation of misplacement, error. Just take this into consideration.

Old Fashioned Sundae means better than modern.

 

[Miss Neecerie]

That's interesting, Ms N, but I don't see how it's germaine to the discussion.

Its germane to the overall discussion of -retro-extremists- because it came up that choices had been made involving employment etc...related to ones 'extremism' and inability to deal with 'normal culture'

I am aware that the original topic was 'which word'....but honestly its veered a dozen times since then.....

my veer is at least as related to the issue as any of the veers...

 

[John in Covina]

Honestly folks. Anyone who has terminated employment over a 'vintage related issue' (dress, music, atmosphere etc.)
Has much bigger issues in life then 'what do I call myself' Honestly....the working world sucks for pretty much everyone, in one way or another. If one wishes to earn at the best potential....you suck it up, deal with it for 8 hours a day and go home and change into your 'true self'....This is the way it has been since the dawn of time....nothing new about sacrificing your 'personality' to earn a paycheck. The factory workers of the industrial revolution were sometimes -locked- in rooms with no bathroom breaks and in unsafe conditions........hearing some crappy music or having to wear a polyester polo shirt because its 'what is done here'....pales in comparison to that.

Under these conditions the best thing is to see if you can start your own business. You can do what you want in your own business. (If you get rich instead of being either crazy or quirky they call you eccentric.)