Questions About the United States Navy Peacoat

[Peacoat]

I don't have my notes with me, but I believe that 1966 was the last year for corduroy pockets. So that would be the only year for coats that buttoned one way with corduroy pockets. I'll check my notes when I get home to make sure.

 

[jake431]

My apologies for likely repeating an oft-asked question in this thread, but, I would like a vintage peacoat - specifically of the 4 button (plus one under the collar) rather than the 3 button (plus one under the collar) variety that seems to be in use now. Ideally I'd like a ww2 era one, but any before the late 60's would seem to be just fine.

The only problem is that I am a 42 in a modern peacoat, and need a jacket that measures at least 23 inches pit to pit (my chest measures 44 inches).

Besides eBay, are there any secret online haunts for these lovely and oft-overlooked coats?

What am I really looking to spend here?

Thanks for your time!

-Jake

 

[Jovan]

I trust you mean eight buttons, four to close? You can buy 'em new from Sterlingwear in wool blend or pure wool. Look for the "Classic" and "Mariner." There's also a military surplus store that sells similar ones for a bit less, but they are only in wool blend. They don't have a sizing chart for the latter like Sterlingwear, so I'd email them about the exact chest and sleeve measurements. Compared to a lot of fashion peacoats (which are way overpriced IMHO) you wouldn't spend a whole lot at $90-140.

 

[jake431]

I trust you mean eight buttons, four to close? You can buy 'em new from Sterlingwear in wool blend or pure wool. Look for the "Classic" and "Mariner." There's also a military surplus store that sells similar ones for a bit less, but they are only in wool blend. They don't have a sizing chart for the latter like Sterlingwear, so I'd email them about the exact chest and sleeve measurements. Compared to a lot of fashion peacoats (which are way overpriced IMHO) you wouldn't spend a whole lot at $90-140.

Yep, that's what I meant - how many buttons to close; sorry for the confusion. Thanks for the links!

-Jake

 

[Peacoat]

If you want a Navy issue coat in the style you described, it will have to be a WWII peacoat. The style was changed from 8 buttons showing to 6 buttons showing right around the end of the war. I don't know the year. Or, you can do as Jovan suggested. Another option for a civilian coat is Schott Brothers.

If you want to try for the real thing, they sometimes are available on ebay. First narrow your search to Clothing>Men's>Outerwear. That will eliminate a lot of the junk. Or you could try a WWII vintage search. Might miss a few that way. Also try spelling both "Pea Coat" and "Peacoat," as you will get slightly different results depending on which way the seller listed the coat.

Be careful of any coat advertised as WWII, as most sellers really don't have a clue. Many think that if a coat has corduroy pockets, it is WWII. Not so. Corduroy pockets were used until, and including, 1967. In 1968 white cotton was substituted for the liner in the outer pockets. If WWII, it will have 8 buttons showing, a throat latch, 100% wool and corduroy pockets.

Another source for issue coats is this link:

http://www.vintagetrends.com/milita...tage&CA=Men&SC=Jackets/Coats&ST=Navy+Pea+Coat

 

[Peacoat]

I don't have my notes with me, but I believe that 1966 was the last year for corduroy pockets. So that would be the only year for coats that buttoned one way with corduroy pockets. I'll check my notes when I get home to make sure.

Never rely on memory alone when something important like peacoat dating is at stake! A check of my notes shows that 1967 is the last year for corduroy pockets.

 

[Jovan]

Nice link. Gonna check back on that... $50 is about how much I paid for the cheapo one! Thanks.

 

[sfflyfish]

Try these.
http://www.monstervintage.com/Vintage_Clothing/Mens/Militarywear/Pea_Coats/list_026_000.html
http://www.vintagetrends.com/Milita...tage&CA=Men&SC=Jackets/Coats&ST=Navy+Pea+Coat

First to get us all speaking the same language. These coats are usually referred to by the number of buttons showing when the coat is being worn and buttoned up. Thus, there are 6 button coats (with 7 or 8 buttons total) and 8 button coats (10 buttons total). We usually do not count the buttons hiding under the collar. The 6 button coats that appeared in 1966 ere the ones that have 7 buttons total. These coats only button to the right and have one button under the collar on the right side. Prior to 1966 the coats could be buttoned to either the right or the left and had collar buttons on both sides.

Coats with 8 buttons showing can be hard to find in good condition these days. They do appear on eBay though. The best bet is to go for a 6 button model. I have a Viet Nam era 6 button coat dated 1970 that looks absolutely stunning. It cost me all of $47

You will definitely want a coat sized 42 or 44. I have a couple of 42 sized coats and they both measure 23" pit to pit on the outside. The early 6 button coats with the US Navy label or the Naval Clothing Depot label are fitted more closely than the later ones that appeared in the second half of the sixties. For example, I wear a size 40 in a coat made in 1970 but I wear a 42 in the coats made in the fifties or early sixties.

I believe, but am not absolutely positive the looser fitting coats appeared as our involvement in Viet Nam grew larger. I can say with certainty that my size 42 coat from 1970 is cut fuller than my size 42 from prior to 1965.

One other thing to remember is that American males were generally smaller in physical stature fifty years ago. This makes the larger sizes harder to find in older coats and more desirable to today's bigger folks. They are out there but For every size 42 you see, there will be many many more in size 34, 36 and 38.

If you've been through this thread you already know that on pages 6, 7 & 8 there are good references to the labels and the various construction details used through the years to guide you to the correct era.

What you want the coat for is also important. The early 4 button one are cool in the vintage sense. But the 3 button ones are definitely a better looking coat if you intend to wear it on a regular basis. The lapels lay flatter and in my mind, look better. A 6 button coat that fits correctly does look sharp.

Lastly, I've had excellent luck on eBay with these coats. Just look for auction showing lots of pictures that include the labels. DO NOT believe the dates posted in an auction unless you can verify it via the label shown in the auction. I see auction after auction with coats claiming to be WWII that are not even close to that era. That said, some misidentified coats are still really nice ones and worth owning.

I used the info posted in this forum to begin my search to replace a coat I had years ago. Thanks to this forum I was able to get exactly the coat I wanted.

As far as price goes, it can bee all over the dial. The websites I referenced above are on the pricey side compared to eBay. I've gotten superior quality coats for as little as $30 and as much as $94 including shipping. I've seen nice ones go for as much as $150 too.

Regardless, even if you spend as much as $150 you will end up with a coat that would cost many hundreds more to duplicate today.

You can also expect another of our members, the esteemed 'Peacoat', to chime in too. He possesses a wealth of info and a sizable collection of these wonderful coats.

Take your time and enjoy the search for your coat. When you have a question, come on back here and ask it.

Regards,
Doug

My apologies for likely repeating an oft-asked question in this thread, but, I would like a vintage peacoat - specifically of the 4 button (plus one under the collar) rather than the 3 button (plus one under the collar) variety that seems to be in use now. Ideally I'd like a ww2 era one, but any before the late 60's would seem to be just fine.

The only problem is that I am a 42 in a modern peacoat, and need a jacket that measures at least 23 inches pit to pit (my chest measures 44 inches).

Besides eBay, are there any secret online haunts for these lovely and oft-overlooked coats?

What am I really looking to spend here?

Thanks for your time!

-Jake

 

[Peacoat]

There is nothing for me to "chime in" about; Sfflyfish pretty well nailed it. As he says, the button nomenclature is important if we are to speak the same language. That's why I started using "6 buttons showing" and "8 buttons showing" so there would no mistaking the era coat I was discussing.

 

[jake431]

Thank you for all your replies folks, I appreciate it!

-Jake

 

[jake431]

Check out this auction for a size 44 Naval Clothing Depot era coat.

http://cgi.ebay.com/MENS-VINTAGE-19...ryZ52391QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Note the only bidder's name has already been disguised by eBay.

AYMK, This is done per the eBay policy that states: "To help keep the eBay community safe, enhance bidder privacy, and protect our members from fraudulent emails, eBay has changed how User IDs display on the bid history page. Only you and the seller of the item can view your User ID, all other members will see anonymous user IDs, such as x***y."

In other words, even though the bid showing is small, the bidder's total proxy bid is $200 or more. It's too bad that eBay does this to bidder ID's before the price of the item has reached $200 or more in actual bids.

I suppose the bidder's thinking was to simply bid once and win the coat. Unfortunately it also means anyone who understands exactly what the disguised name really means could bid $199.99 and force the original bidder to actually pay $200 or more for the coat. This is a perfect example of being put in the position of bidding against yourself.

This bidder may soon learn this was a financially imprudent bidding tactic? Especially since the bidder could have bid $199.99 and accomplished the same thing with out their ID being displayed as anonymous.

Umm, I'd PM you if I could, but it's not an enabled option. So...I am the bidder. I have not bid that much. I'm not sure what your point is here, can you explain?

Thanks,
-Jake

 

[sfflyfish]

Jake,
You can see I have deleted the original post. I just learned that as of YESTERDAY afternoon, eBay is now disguising bidder names in ALL auctions, no matter what the bid amount is.

See here: http://www2.ebay.com/aw/core/200803.shtml#2008-03-03092747

Prior to yesterday a bidder ID was disguised only if a bid, whether actual or proxy was $200 or more.

Man, does this change ever suck. it eliminates the ability to do any research on competing bidders. before the change one could glean quite a bit by seeing other's prior bidding activity.

My PM function won't be enabled until I reach 15 posts which at this rate shouldn't be long.

Sorry for the scare I might have given you.

While I've got your attention; The auction description says "Naval patch at the shoulder can easily be removed without notice if buyer sees fit."
You might ask the seller if the Rate patch on the sleeve is sewn by hand to just the coat's wool shell or by machine through the shell and the lining too?

If it was done by hand to just the outer shell it most likely it can be removed without leaving much of a mark. A good dry cleaning aftrwards should make it all but unnoticeable.

Machine stitching through the inside lining leaves a lot more holes per inch. And since the lining and the shell tend to move in different directions during wear, the lining can take a real beating from the stress.

While the machine stitch marks on the shell will also mostly disappear after cleaning, all the stitching through the lining is where you need to take care. Do not simply rip off the patch. You will be well served to use a seam ripper and take extra care to not tear the lining while removing the patch.

Good luck with the auction. Nice coats like this one have been selling at good prices in the last month. In January they were hitting $150+ in some cases.

Umm, I'd PM you if I could, but it's not an enabled option. So...I am the bidder. I have not bid that much. I'm not sure what your point is here, can you explain?

Regards,
Doug


-Jake

 

[jake431]

Jake,
You can see I have deleted the original post. I just learned that as of YESTERDAY afternoon, eBay is now disguising bidder names in ALL auctions, no matter what the bid amount is.

See here: http://www2.ebay.com/aw/core/200803.shtml#2008-03-03092747

Prior to yesterday a bidder ID was disguised only if a bid, whether actual or proxy was $200 or more.

Man, does this change ever suck. it eliminates the ability to do any research on competing bidders. before the change one could glean quite a bit by seeing other's prior bidding activity.

My PM function won't be enabled until I reach 15 posts which at this rate shouldn't be long.

Sorry for the scare I might have given you.

While I've got your attention; The auction description says "Naval patch at the shoulder can easily be removed without notice if buyer sees fit."
You might ask the seller if the Rate patch on the sleeve is sewn by hand to just the coat's wool shell or by machine through the shell and the lining too?

If it was done by hand to just the outer shell it most likely it can be removed without leaving much of a mark. A good dry cleaning aftrwards should make it all but unnoticeable.

Machine stitching through the inside lining leaves a lot more holes per inch. And since the lining and the shell tend to move in different directions during wear, the lining can take a real beating from the stress.

While the machine stitch marks on the shell will also mostly disappear after cleaning, all the stitching through the lining is where you need to take care. Do not simply rip off the patch. You will be well served to use a seam ripper and take extra care to not tear the lining while removing the patch.

Good luck with the auction. Nice coats like this one have been selling at good prices in the last month. In January they were hitting $150+ in some cases.

Haha, thanks for the clarification, I appreciate it. I don't mind the patch, but I know some take displeasure in leaving rates un-earned. I am more concern with altering the appearance of the jacket as it is a real, used coat (holdover from flight jacket collecting).

-Jake

 

[sfflyfish]

Curious Auction

This one is kind if curious?

http://cgi.ebay.com/US-Navy-Peacoat...goryZ135QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The auction description's included DSA number (DSA 100-72-C-0303) indicates the coat itself is '72 vintage. The embroidered embellishment makes me wonder if the coat was done as some sort of promo for the movie "Pearl Harbor?" since the Dorie Miller name on the coat is that of the character played by Cuba Gooding, Jr. in the movie?

 

[sfflyfish]

Pea Coat Auction

Jake,
You won the auction. Congrats!

Please be sure to let us know the particulars of your new coat after it arrives.

Best regards,
Doug

 

[jake431]

Jake,
You won the auction. Congrats!

Please be sure to let us know the particulars of your new coat after it arrives.

Best regards,
Doug

Thanks Doug, I just submitted payment today - it's only got to travel from Madisonto Chicago, so hopefully I'll have it by next week.

Stay tuned, and thanks everybody for all your help!

-Jake

 

[Peacoat]

Jake, with you living in Chicago, you probably need a couple of peacoats! Wear a sweater under it, and you should be OK in most of the weather there. The Kersey wool in the '72 coats will block the wind with no problem. I used to wear mine with a sweater in the NYC winter and never got cold. You guys have more wind, lots of wind, but the old coats were made for blocking the wind.

 

[jake431]

Thanks, I was eager to get a 100% wool coat. I'm quite excited; can't wait to see this coat in the flesh.

-Jake

 

[sfflyfish]

OOPS! Not supposed to refer to live eBay auctions here...

FYI, Well get back to this after the auction ends.

Regards,
Doug

 

[jake431]

Thanks for all the assistance guys! I just got the jacket and it's aces. I need to sew back on one button - it's loose. But otherwise it's perfect. Couldn't be happier.

-Jake