Post New Hats Here!

[Blare]

Hey Joe where are you going with this hat on your head?
it is a splendid example of Borsalino made before the second world war and probably immediately after the first.
The brim edge is a specialty of the "old" Borsalino and of the mastery of the craftsmen of Alessandria.
Keep in mind that at that time the quality in Italian hatters was made of unusual and elegant construction solutions.
Third point is a Borsalino made for a European market, Thessaloniki is in Greece, not as large as other countries and probably the shape was suggested by the fashions of the moment in the port on the Thermaic Gulf of the Aegean Sea.
Exciting hat and a rare or very rare historical find.
Congratulations Joe

Thank you Daniele. Unfortunately yesterday it only made it around my house and backyard. I do plan to get it out and about soon! I had suspected it was made for the Greek market based on the store name. Excited to add one as rare and unusual as this one. That said.. it can take some adjustment Getting used to wearing something as different as this…. But it is growing on me rapidly. So no worries there.

All credit is due to Stefan for keeping tabs on this gem.

Thank you again for your assessment, historical and geographical context…. and compliments. Very much appreciated.

 

[jeffgarf]

This was (and still is) in a bit of a condition. I did have a go at cleaning and steaming it, but it still needs work. With some moth damage it's a beater anyway, bit nice enough to bring it back.

Borsalino Feather in a grey colour called Lupo (wolf). Size 58 (but curiously enough it fits me) with the overwelt brim at 6cm and the center dent at 10cm. They were not kidding when calling it feather, because it is indeed very lightweight at only 67 grams. Sweatband is grosgrain ribbon with the liner sewn onto it. All reducing weight.

Do you have any idea of the age of this hat? I have an offer to buy one in my size for $80 that looks to be in pretty good condition, but I'd like to know more about its age.

 

[steur]

View attachment 693816

Pre War Borsalino - Black
Approx 4 1/2 Crown as shaped (about 6 inch open)
1 7/8 brim with very tight curl
2 1/8 black grosgrain ribbon

Stefan @steur had posted this old Borsalino sometime back that was listed on eBay for a king’s ransom. Aside from its age.. the it was very notable for the unusual tight brim curl treatment. However at the price it was listed it didn’t look like it was going to be rescued by anyone on the lounge.. and kinda drifted off my radar. Luckily Stefan continued to keep an eye on it and when its asking price plummeted to within range, he kindly alerted me. Being it was still slightly out of my comfort zone I attempted to put it aside…. However after a fairly sleepless night.. I knew HAS had taken its hold and I put in an offer I was more comfortable with and was accepted. So it appears this interesting hat is rescued after all.

Dating wise… I will leave more specifics to Stefan and Daniele. Though I think I feel comfortable enough to say pre war. (If I’m wrong… my apologies and no worries). I’m generally thrilled to find per war hats of any make.. of European make maybe even more so for obvious reasons. Also amazing to see hats this old with most of their basting stitches still in tact. It does need a stitch or two to fully reattach the front half of the bow.. but for now a teeny bit of double sided tape is doing the trick.

OK. The million dollar question. What is the deal with the brim treatment?? As near as I can tell it is actually just a very tight brim roll the ends precisely where it touches back to the brim. I believe it is attached with some kind of hidden stitching as it does appear to be attached… you can’t just unfurl the curl. In playing with it to see if I felt anything inside the curl… I did not detect anything other than air however, I believe I did hear/feel a thread pop… kinda confirming my suspicions of stitching. I’ve not seen anything quite like it… almost makes the look of a comically large hand felted edge. Very unusual.

The tight brim curl leaves the brim fairly stingy at around 1 7/8… so I had to do some playing around with the bash to come up with something that didn’t look too stovepipe-ish proportionally. I arrived at this kinda wide diamond crease. I tend to think hats of this era.. often favor a deep center dent with wide side dents ala cowboy/bankers crease. This was no exception…. but I just felt it looked a bit tall on my head that way and I shifted to what you see.

A Big Thank you to Stefan for not abandoning hope on this old gem! And also for thinking of me. To diminish any regrets on not pulling the trigger himself… the 4 1/2 punti size that should equal size 7 US felt a bit more like a snug 6 7/8.. though it is loosening up a bit with wear.

All said.. combined with age and having never seen a brim treatment like this on any other hat… makes this one a fairly special addition to the collection.

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So glad you saved that one, Joe. It is a gem and like Daniele said a very early one. Somewhere in the thirties hatmanufacturers got together to reduce the number of leftover hats due to the vast number of models they produced. They decided to limit the number of models introduced and this blindstitched overwelt style hat was unfortunately one of the models that disappeared.
From what I see the model name is something like cronacono (?). We already know of a model called cronaca, so it would make some sort of sense to have a similar name.
It could well be that that bow ends never were stitched to the ribbon, but were meant to be loose. We've seen hats finished like that before.
You wear it well and all credit to you that you were willing to keep it in the family.

 

[steur]

Do you have any idea of the age of this hat? I have an offer to buy one in my size for $80 that looks to be in pretty good condition, but I'd like to know more about its age.

The one I posted is from the sixties, based on the label.

 

[Blare]

So glad you saved that one, Joe. It is a gem and like Daniele said a very early one. Somewhere in the thirties hatmanufacturers got together to reduce the number of leftover hats due to the vast number of models they produced. They decided to limit the number of models introduced and this blindstitched overwelt style hat was unfortunately one of the models that disappeared.
From what I see the model name is something like cronacono (?). We already know of a model called cronaca, so it would make some sort of sense to have a similar name.
It could well be that that bow ends never were stitched to the ribbon, but were meant to be loose. We've seen hats finished like that before.
You wear it well and all credit to you that you were willing to keep it in the family.

Thank you for the insight Stefan. I was having a tough time making out that name. I believe you are correct on the bow ends being loose originally. I thought that was simply the case at first till half the bow flipped back past the knot. One or two stitches back there would secure it in place. Blasphemously or not however the tiny pieces of tape I placed in there are holding quite well for now. I’ll probably forget and some day down the line a next generation lounger will speculate why Borsalino was using little bits of electrical tape to attached the ribbon.

So if we are thinking pre WWII and Post WWI what date range do you think it may be.. 20s in general?

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

Thank you for the insight Stefan. I was having a tough time making out that name. I believe you are correct on the bow ends being loose originally. I thought that was simply the case at first till half the bow flipped back past the knot. One or two stitches back there would secure it in place. Blasphemously or not however the tiny pieces of tape I placed in there are holding quite well for now. I’ll probably forget and some day down the line a next generation lounger will speculate why Borsalino was using little bits of electrical tape to attached the ribbon.

So if we are thinking pre WWII and Post WWI what date range do you think it may be.. 20s in general?

I'd say it's 20s in general but probably even early rather than late 20s - as Daniele said 'shortly after WW I'.

 

[Pellie]

My first bowler hat came in today.
Borsalino from the '30's/'40's. In very mint condition. It needed a little brush and that's it! Very nice!

 

[steur]

Thank you for the insight Stefan. I was having a tough time making out that name. I believe you are correct on the bow ends being loose originally. I thought that was simply the case at first till half the bow flipped back past the knot. One or two stitches back there would secure it in place. Blasphemously or not however the tiny pieces of tape I placed in there are holding quite well for now. I’ll probably forget and some day down the line a next generation lounger will speculate why Borsalino was using little bits of electrical tape to attached the ribbon.

So if we are thinking pre WWII and Post WWI what date range do you think it may be.. 20s in general?

I agree with the others. We don't have anything to go by other than the general style and finishing. But early to mid twenties looks likely.

 

[Blare]

My first bowler hat came in today.
Borsalino from the '20's/'30's. In very mint condition. It needed a little brush and that's it! Very nice!
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Wonderful bowler, Marcel.

 

[Blare]

I'd say it's 20s in general but probably even early rather than late 20s - as Daniele said 'shortly after WW I'.

I agree with the others. We don't have anything to go by other than the general style and finishing. But early to mid twenties looks likely.

Sounds good to me. Thanks guys. It’s been getting plenty of wear last couple days.

 

[Pellie]

Wonderful bowler, Marcel.

Thanks Joe! It really is! You own a nice old Borsalino yourself too, great!!

 

[Blare]

Thanks Joe! It really is! You own a nice old Borsalino yourself too, great!!

Thanks Marcel.

 

[Mean Eyed Matt]

My first bowler hat came in today.
Borsalino from the '20's/'30's. In very mint condition. It needed a little brush and that's it! Very nice!
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Really a nice one, Marcel, and in big size and inside as new condition, too! Interesting is the seperate size label in 1/4: Should be english sizing, wich is really uncommon for a hat sold in northern Italy, I think. First I thougt, it is one of the rare 'quater sizes' in punti, but that can't match your head. Could it be related to war/early postwar time?

 

[Pellie]

Really a nice one, Marcel, and in big size and inside as new condition, too! Interesting is the seperate size label in 1/4: Should be english sizing, wich is really uncommon for a hat sold in northern Italy, I think. First I thougt, it is one of the rare 'quater sizes' in punti, but that can't match your head. Could it be related to war/early postwar time?

I talked with Stefan about it and he told me that it's an english sizelabel, that's why it fits me perfectly. Also he thinks it's from late '30's, maybe early '40's. So possibly before war, who knows?

 

[steur]

Really a nice one, Marcel, and in big size and inside as new condition, too! Interesting is the seperate size label in 1/4: Should be english sizing, wich is really uncommon for a hat sold in northern Italy, I think. First I thougt, it is one of the rare 'quater sizes' in punti, but that can't match your head. Could it be related to war/early postwar time?

I talked with Stefan about it and he told me that it's an english sizelabel, that's why it fits me perfectly. Also he thinks it's from late '30's, maybe early '40's. So possibly before war, who knows?

For the European market Borsalino basically followed up on what they did for the American market and used the size in inches (in English rather than American). We know from the American market hats that the separate size stickers were early, probably mid to late thirties. Bowlers never were a big item in Italy so most of them were for export.

 

[Blare]

Penn-Traffic Co - Beaver Fifteen
Taupe/Tan Felt
4 3/4 Crown as shaped
1 3/4 Silver/Bronzed Grosgrain Ribbon

I say this one checked the Three C’s. Condition.. Curiosity.. and Cost

It looked to be in immaculate shape… the Penn-Traffic Co and styling had my curiosity peaked as to who may have made the hat…. And cost…. Well when we get the first two C’s for just $25 wrapped it up in a nice bow.

Upon arrival it is definitely in very nice hardly worn shape and only needed a little brushing to release some dust. There is one tiny moth divot in the crown I noticed when it hit the sun. Other than that.. great shape. I would say it may have suffered a bit of shrinking evidenced by the warping on the sweatband which made it a bit snug when pulling on… this did cause me to pop the seam in the rear of the sweat.

As to make.. I’m afraid I don’t have anything much extra to go on than I had from the sellers photos. Only a plain small size sticker under the sweatband.. and a large sweat protector the same size as the sweat. The sellers photo had an image of a maroon “custom made” size tag (that I don’t think made the trip) along with the styling of the liner have me leaning in the direction of Beaver/Langenberg. One interesting note.. Generally when you see model names such as Beaver Fifteen, it refers to the selling price. In the case of this Beaver Fifteen.. the original price tag was $7 at Penn-Traffic Co a Johnstown, Pennsylvania based department store chain. The company behind Bi-Lo Grocer

Really love the proportions and styling… It reminiscent of something you might see from Wormser. Thanks go out to Brent for posting the link to this one on his Facebook group.

 

[Mighty44]

View attachment 694711

Penn-Traffic Co - Beaver Fifteen
Taupe/Tan Felt
4 3/4 Crown as shaped
1 3/4 Silver/Bronzed Grosgrain Ribbon

I say this one checked the Three C’s. Condition.. Curiosity.. and Cost

It looked to be in immaculate shape… the Penn-Traffic Co and styling had my curiosity peaked as to who may have made the hat…. And cost…. Well when we get the first two C’s for just $25 wrapped it up in a nice bow.

Upon arrival it is definitely in very nice hardly worn shape and only needed a little brushing to release some dust. There is one tiny moth divot in the crown I noticed when it hit the sun. Other than that.. great shape. I would say it may have suffered a bit of shrinking evidenced by the warping on the sweatband which made it a bit snug when pulling on… this did cause me to pop the seam in the rear of the sweat.

As to make.. I’m afraid I don’t have anything much extra to go on than I had from the sellers photos. Only a plain small size sticker under the sweatband.. and a large sweat protector the same size as the sweat. The sellers photo had an image of a maroon “custom made” size tag (that I don’t think made the trip) along with the styling of the liner have me leaning in the direction of Beaver/Langenberg. One interesting note.. Generally when you see model names such as Beaver Fifteen, it refers to the selling price. In the case of this Beaver Fifteen.. the original price tag was $7 at Penn-Traffic Co a Johnstown, Pennsylvania based department store chain. The company behind Bi-Lo Grocer

Really love the proportions and styling… It reminiscent of something you might see from Wormser. Thanks go out to Brent for posting the link to this one on his Facebook group.

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Beautiful—for some reason I’ve seen a lot of hats from Johnstown, PA over the years.

 

[Blare]

Beautiful—for some reason I’ve seen a lot of hats from Johnstown, PA over the years.

Maybe there was a manufacturer doing private label stuff like this in the PA area. Stetson would make sense. But I don’t see Stetson manufacturing hallmarks.

 

[Rollin Rains]

View attachment 694711

Penn-Traffic Co - Beaver Fifteen
Taupe/Tan Felt
4 3/4 Crown as shaped
1 3/4 Silver/Bronzed Grosgrain Ribbon

I say this one checked the Three C’s. Condition.. Curiosity.. and Cost

It looked to be in immaculate shape… the Penn-Traffic Co and styling had my curiosity peaked as to who may have made the hat…. And cost…. Well when we get the first two C’s for just $25 wrapped it up in a nice bow.

Upon arrival it is definitely in very nice hardly worn shape and only needed a little brushing to release some dust. There is one tiny moth divot in the crown I noticed when it hit the sun. Other than that.. great shape. I would say it may have suffered a bit of shrinking evidenced by the warping on the sweatband which made it a bit snug when pulling on… this did cause me to pop the seam in the rear of the sweat.

As to make.. I’m afraid I don’t have anything much extra to go on than I had from the sellers photos. Only a plain small size sticker under the sweatband.. and a large sweat protector the same size as the sweat. The sellers photo had an image of a maroon “custom made” size tag (that I don’t think made the trip) along with the styling of the liner have me leaning in the direction of Beaver/Langenberg. One interesting note.. Generally when you see model names such as Beaver Fifteen, it refers to the selling price. In the case of this Beaver Fifteen.. the original price tag was $7 at Penn-Traffic Co a Johnstown, Pennsylvania based department store chain. The company behind Bi-Lo Grocer

Really love the proportions and styling… It reminiscent of something you might see from Wormser. Thanks go out to Brent for posting the link to this one on his Facebook group.

View attachment 694717 View attachment 694718 View attachment 694719 View attachment 694720 View attachment 694721 View attachment 694722 View attachment 694723 View attachment 694724 View attachment 694725

Amazing find! and it looks like it was made for you!

 

[Pellie]

View attachment 694711

Penn-Traffic Co - Beaver Fifteen
Taupe/Tan Felt
4 3/4 Crown as shaped
1 3/4 Silver/Bronzed Grosgrain Ribbon

I say this one checked the Three C’s. Condition.. Curiosity.. and Cost

It looked to be in immaculate shape… the Penn-Traffic Co and styling had my curiosity peaked as to who may have made the hat…. And cost…. Well when we get the first two C’s for just $25 wrapped it up in a nice bow.

Upon arrival it is definitely in very nice hardly worn shape and only needed a little brushing to release some dust. There is one tiny moth divot in the crown I noticed when it hit the sun. Other than that.. great shape. I would say it may have suffered a bit of shrinking evidenced by the warping on the sweatband which made it a bit snug when pulling on… this did cause me to pop the seam in the rear of the sweat.

As to make.. I’m afraid I don’t have anything much extra to go on than I had from the sellers photos. Only a plain small size sticker under the sweatband.. and a large sweat protector the same size as the sweat. The sellers photo had an image of a maroon “custom made” size tag (that I don’t think made the trip) along with the styling of the liner have me leaning in the direction of Beaver/Langenberg. One interesting note.. Generally when you see model names such as Beaver Fifteen, it refers to the selling price. In the case of this Beaver Fifteen.. the original price tag was $7 at Penn-Traffic Co a Johnstown, Pennsylvania based department store chain. The company behind Bi-Lo Grocer

Really love the proportions and styling… It reminiscent of something you might see from Wormser. Thanks go out to Brent for posting the link to this one on his Facebook group.

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Very nice! Never heard of this brand before.