Myths of the Golden Era -- Exploded!

[V.C. Brunswick]

You mean Wheeled Satan?

:rofl: :eusa_clap

 

[vitanola]

Yes, by the same sorts of folks who claim that the economy was in worse shape in 1936 than it was in 1932.

 

[jamespowers]

Yes, by the same sorts of folks who claim that the economy was in worse shape in 1936 than it was in 1932.

We are edging on politics here but suffice it to say that it was the War that brought us out of the depression not a thing that government did during that period---in some cases it made it worse and extended the depression---a fact bourne out by:
“No, gentlemen, we have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work. ...I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started.” – U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Morgenthau, Jr.

 

[vitanola]

We are edging on politics here but suffice it to say that it was the War that brought us out of the depression not a thing that government did during that period---in some cases it made it worse and extended the depression---a fact bourne out by:
“No, gentlemen, we have tried spending money. We are spending more than we have ever spent before and it does not work. ...I say after eight years of this Administration we have just as much unemployment as when we started.” – U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Morgenthau, Jr.

Ah!

When Burton Folsom first promoted that quotation in his book, in articles, and throughout the conservative blogosphere back in 2009 he claimed that Morganthau said this in testimony before the House Commerce Committee on May 9th, 1939, and the quotation included the phrase "after TEN years of this administration..." (emphasis mine). After it was pointed out to Folsom that the administration had only taken office on March 4th, 1933, and that the House Commerce Committee had not met in May of 1939, he stopped using the quotation for a time.

I see that it is back, changed to "after EIGHT years of this administration..." (emphasis again mine) with an attribution of "Transcript of a private meeting at the Treasury Department, May 9, 1939, F. D. Roosevelt Presidential Library". Now Morganthau's diarys, which were published in three volumes in (as I recall) 1958 or 1959, make no mention of such a meeting, but they do mention being home in Dutchess County New York between May 3 and May 25th, 1939.

When initially asked about the questionable nature of this quotation, Dr. Folsom said that its strict accuracy was immaterial, as it conveyed an essential truth.

(edit)

I see that the new, improved version of this quotation may be traced back to a paper published in EconJournalWatch, Volume6, Number3, Sept. 2009, about four months after the original quotation was
shown to be spurious.

Now the original quotation, false though it was, can at least be traced back to a Golden Era source, an
editorial in Robert McCormack's Chicago Tribune. The current version appears to be somewhat more modern.

 

[V.C. Brunswick]

We are edging on politics here but suffice it to say that it was the War that brought us out of the depression...

Ah!

When Burton Folsom first promoted that quotation in his book, in articles, and throughout the conservative blogosphere back in 2009 he claimed...

 

[matrioshka]

Speaking of AMC:

I had a '72 Matador. Not a bad car, considering. The four wheel drum brakes left a bit to be desired, though. The AMX, in the right hands, could be pretty interesting, and I've seen stuff done to a Gremlin that just wasn't right, but oh so fun...

 

[John in Covina]

Do you mean "Since Yesterday"?

That's it!

 

[AtomicEraTom]

My mother had an '81 AMC Eagle. She bought it in '83 from her parents who had bought it new. It was a junker and constantly broke down. Went through multiple engines and transmissions. Old Ernie VonShledorn didn't wanna cover it either, but ended up having to (due to warranty.) It actually broke down the day Mom and Dad were supposed to take me home from the hospital after I was born. Good thing Dad had the LTD wagon! lol

Speaking of AMC:

I had a '72 Matador. Not a bad car, considering. The four wheel drum brakes left a bit to be desired, though. The AMX, in the right hands, could be pretty interesting, and I've seen stuff done to a Gremlin that just wasn't right, but oh so fun...

 

[jamespowers]

Ah!

When Burton Folsom first promoted that quotation in his book, in articles, and throughout the conservative blogosphere back in 2009 he claimed that Morganthau said this in testimony before the House Commerce Committee on May 9th, 1939, and the quotation included the phrase "after TEN years of this administration..." (emphasis mine). After it was pointed out to Folsom that the administration had only taken office on March 4th, 1933, and that the House Commerce Committee had not met in May of 1939, he stopped using the quotation for a time.

I see that it is back, changed to "after EIGHT years of this administration..." (emphasis again mine) with an attribution of "Transcript of a private meeting at the Treasury Department, May 9, 1939, F. D. Roosevelt Presidential Library". Now Morganthau's diarys, which were published in three volumes in (as I recall) 1958 or 1959, make no mention of such a meeting, but they do mention being home in Dutchess County New York between May 3 and May 25th, 1939.

When initially asked about the questionable nature of this quotation, Dr. Folsom said that its strict accuracy was immaterial, as it conveyed an essential truth.

(edit)

I see that the new, improved version of this quotation may be traced back to a paper published in EconJournalWatch, Volume6, Number3, Sept. 2009, about four months after the original quotation was
shown to be spurious.

Now the original quotation, false though it was, can at least be traced back to a Golden Era source, an
editorial in Robert McCormack's Chicago Tribune. The current version appears to be somewhat more modern.

And it is still true. Nothing they did worked.

 

[vitanola]

OOPS!

I thought that I was merely correcting an error. Now who could possibly object to that?

Perhaps if I substituted something less charged for THAT word, say "Fishpaste", I will not cause offense.

So; "When Burton Folsom first promoted that quotation in his book, in articles, and throughout the fishpaste back in 2009 he claimed..."

I really didn't think that pointing out a dodgy quotation could possibly be considered offensive in a threat entitled "Myths of the Golden Era".



On the other hand, referring to our President as "Wheeled Satan" is not at all offensive, I see.

Well we live and learn.

 

[vitanola]

And it is still true. Nothing they did worked.

But it is untrue. the quotation was created out of whole cloth, it seems.

 

[jamespowers]

OOPS!

I thought that I was merely correcting an error. Now who could possibly object to that?

Perhaps if I substituted something less charged for THAT word, say "Fishpaste", I will not cause offense.

So; "When Burton Folsom first promoted that quotation in his book, in articles, and throughout the fishpaste back in 2009 he claimed..."

I really didn't think that pointing out a dodgy quotation could possibly be considered offensive in a threat entitled "Myths of the Golden Era".



On the other hand, referring to our President as "Wheeled Satan" is not at all offensive, I see.

Well we live and learn.

Wheeled Satan is a term he would have heard back then. It was commonly used by the opposition.

And, I took no offense. Even IF and I do mean if as there are arguments on both side of the quote, Folsum still straightens out the Raw Deal. And that is all I have to say on the subject as it pushes the rules here. The book is self explanatory.

 

[jamespowers]

But it is untrue. the quotation was created out of whole cloth, it seems.

That is debateable.

The underlying facts make the quote true whether he said it or not.

 

[Stearmen]

If government did not bring us out of the depression, then how did WWII? Almost every one worked either directly for the government or for the war effort and tax dollars paid for it all. The old Army joke, "hang the expense, have the tax payers send me another one!"

 

[LizzieMaine]

Wheeled Satan is a term he would have heard back then. It was commonly used by the opposition.

Indeed. Some of the attacks on Roosevelt by his opposition would have fit right in on modern-day blogs and talk shows. A sitting justice of the Supreme Court, James McReynolds, consistently referred to him as "that crippled son of a bi***."

And he laughed at them and welcomed their hatred.

 

[Flicka]

Indeed. Some of the attacks on Roosevelt by his opposition would have fit right in on modern-day blogs and talk shows. A sitting justice of the Supreme Court, James McReynolds, consistently referred to him as "that crippled son of a bi***."

Which is interesting in the perspective of declining standards. I mean, if that's the standard we're starting out from...

 

[MissMittens]

Which is interesting in the perspective of declining standards. I mean, if that's the standard we're starting out from...

Interesting take................we really haven't come a long way by any means

 

[LizzieMaine]

McReynolds was a real prize package. He not only hated the disabled, he hated blacks, women, and Jews with equal passion, and expressed himself similarly about them. He would leave the room whenever Louis Brandeis or Felix Frankfurter were speaking, and refused, as long as he served on the Court with them, to sign any of their opinions.

One of the motivations for FDR's Court Reform plan in 1937 was to minimize McReynolds's malignant influence on the Court, but even as McReynolds grew old and sick he refused to resign, just to spite Roosevelt.

 

[Dixie_Amazon]

I saw a Pacer in a wreck once. The body damage wasn't too bad but most of the glass shattered.

 

[scottyrocks]

McReynolds was a real prize package. He not only hated the disabled, he hated blacks, women, and Jews with equal passion, and expressed himself similarly about them. He would leave the room whenever Louis Brandeis or Felix Frankfurter were speaking, and refused, as long as he served on the Court with them, to sign any of their opinions.

One of the motivations for FDR's Court Reform plan in 1937 was to minimize McReynolds's malignant influence on the Court, but even as McReynolds grew old and sick he refused to resign, just to spite Roosevelt.

One of the differences between then and today is that one could, in many circles. 'get away with' saying things like that, whereas today it is pretty much impossible. So, in a way, some standards, at least that one, has improved.