Miss, Mrs. or Madam? The demise of Ms?

[Miss Neecerie]

See I am now almost 40....but having never been married....leaves me with Miss.....which is fine for screen names but in real life is sort of non-reflective of any sort of maturity....

Ms. works...but makes people think of divorcees...or rabid feminists.


There is no -neutral of subcontext- female title. Period.

 

[Carlisle Blues]

Ms. works...but makes people think of divorcees...or rabid feminists.


There is no -neutral of subcontext- female title. Period.

A title does not insure a personality type or behavioral pattern.

It is a matter of perspective and preconceived notions. When using my professional title I know that some people will think I am a money hungry, scummy person.

The good news is I am anything but that. I am retired and do pro bono work, exclusively for the disabled and US veterans.

Quite frankly, I do not want to be around those who have biases with negative connotation to begin with. [huh]

 

[Miss Neecerie]

A title does not insure a personality type or behavioral pattern.

It is a matter of perspective and preconceived notions. When using my professional title I know that some people will think I am a money hungry, scummy person.

The good news is I am anything but that. I am retired and do pro bono work, exclusively for the disabled and US veterans.

Quite frankly, I do not want to be around those who have biases with negative connotation to begin with. [huh]

Oh I agree....just saying that Ms. is a particularly laden title.....

 

[Miss Sis]

I think 'miss' often becomes a term of address for children to use for adult women in their lives - teachers, neighbors, etc. with no real thought to the woman's relationship status.
When my daughter was three and we moved to this house, the next door neighbor became Miss Joyce, and still is, all these years later. The dance teacher was Miss Jo, a favorite bookshop employee was Miss Grace.....

Yes, I think it does particularly for teachers. However all my married teachers, whether for school or ballet were "Mrs ......" and the unmarried ones "Miss......"

Perhaps they were all just a bit old fashioned? Even in the 90s I didn't have any teachers who were "Ms".

 

[MsStabby]

Oh I agree....just saying that Ms. is a particularly laden title.....

If my personal reasons for using the title are "feminist" (with whatever connotations that phrase holds for others, good or bad) then so be it. But we (women) have the right to a title that is not dependent on our relationship, or lack thereof, with a man. Which is why it is, for some, a word to be re-claimed and used in the way we each wish to use it, as is our culture's tendency.

Also, I am 41. I really have no cultural "baggage" around the word Ms. I remember in the 70's that some divorced women used it, and there was some comment from the adults when the issue was raised, but nothing dramatic and no mean conversations about it. There are far more laden words in our society.

 

[MsStabby]

When using my professional title I know that some people will think I am a money hungry, scummy person.

So my guess is...lawyer? Says the paralegal

 

[Carlisle Blues]

So my guess is...lawyer? Says the paralegal

So much for my theory.......... I should have taken singing lessons..

 

[Countess]

I'm widowed and have been trying to get away with calling myself Mrs. but I'm noticing that I'm increasingly starting to tick the Ms. box in forms.

I'm not quite sure what the etiquette with prefixes is when one is widowed but I think by the end of this year, I'll have stopped fighting the Ms. status and will accept it!

 

[Miss Sis]

I'm widowed and have been trying to get away with calling myself Mrs. but I'm noticing that I'm increasingly starting to tick the Ms. box in forms.

I'm not quite sure what the etiquette with prefixes is when one is widowed but I think by the end of this year, I'll have stopped fighting the Ms. status and will accept it!

A widow is still a Mrs, if she wishes to be. My Nana was a widow for 50-odd years and she was always Mrs.

What makes you feel you should change to Ms, Countess? Do you feel society expects you to change, or is it more an internal thing on your part? Just curious.

 

[Mr_D.]

Sure ...so the definition states....


I think the spirit in which you address the person is the most meaningful. I generally use Ma'am when in a professional situation or even a social setting if I do not know the person's name. I certainly would not use Madam unless the person was my grandmother's age.

Ma'am is used as term of respect in the military. It was not used in my area growing up.

I do not meet too many woman who wish to be called Mrs., Ms, Miss or espcially ma'am unless they are my mother's age.

Naturally, should someone wished to be called by a particular title why not.

I am the same, but I think it's mostly because growing up we were taught yes ma'am, no ma'am so it's imprinted on my brain that all women are ma'am, same with Sir.

 

[MsStabby]

So much for my theory.......... I should have taken singing lessons..

Sir, you are one of the good ones.

My internship was at Legal Services and it was one of the best experiences of my professional life. I worked with some truly brilliant attorneys. Now that I am newly laid off from a far less than socially useful job I am going to go back and volunteer some hours this winter, both to get some of my skills back and because funding has been decimated and they can use the help. And I miss the work.

Apologies for the OT. Now back to your regularly scheduled programming.

 

[Carlisle Blues]

I am the same, but I think it's mostly because growing up we were taught yes ma'am, no ma'am so it's imprinted on my brain that all women are ma'am, same with Sir.

Yes at the risk of sounding redundant, it is all about respect and honoring the person whom I am addressing.

If someone wants to be called by a certain title that is fine. In fact I do have fun with it...... as I ride on my horse into the sunset with my Stetson el Presidente tilted back....

 

[Carlisle Blues]

Sir, you are one of the good ones.

Thank you very much !!!!!!!!!!!!

Now that is one title I will always welcome. I have done my best to serve others and avoid the trappings of that lifestyle. If not I would still be working to pay off a bunch of luxuries I would never be home to enjoy to begin with. Nonsense total nonsense.

Do not worry I have found that those who know their work always find a means exercise their craft..

 

[Carlisle Blues]

I don't know why i find the term ma'am kind of sexy, " Yes ma'am..."
It has to be said with that Southern-North American drawl though....

Kind of reminds me of Gone With The Wind

[Rhett rescues Scarlett from the panicked streets of Atlanta as war approaches]

Rhett: Panic's a pretty sight, isn't it? We belong together, Scarlett. Let's get out of here together. No use staying here, letting the South come down around your ears. Too many nice places to go and visit. Mexico, London, Paris-

Scarlett: With you?

Rhett: Yes, ma'am. A man who understands you and admires you for just what you are. I figure we belong together, being the same sort. I've been waiting for you to grow up and get that sad-eyed Ashley Wilkes out of your heart... Are you going with me or are you getting out?

Scarlett: I hate and despise you, Rhett Butler. I'll hate and despise you till I die.

Rhett: [amused] Oh no you won't, Scarlett. Not that long.


lol

 

[Countess]

A widow is still a Mrs, if she wishes to be. My Nana was a widow for 50-odd years and she was always Mrs.

What makes you feel you should change to Ms, Countess? Do you feel society expects you to change, or is it more an internal thing on your part? Just curious.

Good question! I was adamant at first about retaining Mrs. but as a little time has gone by and I'm now in a new relationship, I guess I'm starting to feel a little uneasy about using Mrs. Plus it's somewhat awkward when my new partner and I venture out and we're needing to use our full names and titles (hotels, flights, etc) because it feels as though I'm doing something, well, inappropriate by using Mrs. *blushes*

It is very much a personal thing. I don't wish to put myself in a situation of having to explain why I'm a widow in my twenties (I've had to do it so many times and it inevitably ends in tears). I guess my slow switch to Ms. is not a case of forgetting my marriage but somehow trying to move on.

 

[Viola]

What about the difference between Mrs. Jane Doe and signing yourself as Mrs. John Doe?

The latter is more classic but I hardly ever see it anymore. And in fact I've heard it castigated as horrible and oppressive which startled me. And my guy described it as "pretty creepy" which, I don't know.

Edit: I also got in a big fight recently with a handful of people who are all personally offended I'm taking my fiance's last name when we get married, and that's not even counting my dad, who was mostly stirring the pot. ("Why do YOU have to be the one to change your name? Is it 'cause you're the girl? That's so sexist. Tell him to take our name and get used to it!" *troublemaking chortle*)

 

[chanteuseCarey]

If I am called Ms. I politely correct them that I am a Mrs. I've worked hard to maintain that distinction (marriages do take work you know). I am proud to be a Mrs.!

 

[Matt Deckard]

If I am called Ms. I politely correct them that I am a Mrs. I've worked hard to maintain that distinction (marriages do take work you know). I am proud to be a Mrs.!

Sounds like a proud statement. I wonder how many women take offense to this type of behavior.

 

[Yeps]

Just to chip in here, I grew up (as taught by my mother) referring to all adult women as Ms. [first name]. Sounds more like Miss when we say it. Some people got Ms. [surname], but I think that was only if they specifically asked to be referred to as such, or maybe in slightly more formal settings. We almost never say Mrs., even when it is clearly appropriate, but that might just be slurring speech. We do an awful lot of that around here.

 

[Foofoogal]

Originally Posted by chanteuseCarey
If I am called Ms. I politely correct them that I am a Mrs. I've worked hard to maintain that distinction (marriages do take work you know). I am proud to be a Mrs.!

definitely me also. I do Not want to be a Ms.