I love the Fed IV!!

[scottyrocks]

I have all Imperials. My first was brown but I figured I'd go for the cheaper one to check it out. It was, and is, fine.

My second and third are colors that didn't come in the Heritage grade - Carbon Gray and Tawny Fawn - so I guess I'm an 'all-Imperial' kinda guy. haha

 

[Zombie_61]

I'm glad they sent me the Heritage Grade Fed so I could compare the differences, but I have no complaints about my Imperial Grade Akubras. And now that I know the differences first-hand I probably wouldn't order a Heritage Grade hat unless that was the only way to get the hat in a color that isn't available in the Imperial Grade. But that's just me, and those with a more informed opinion might disagree.

 

[andrew_AU]

I'm glad they sent me the Heritage Grade Fed so I could compare the differences, but I have no complaints about my Imperial Grade Akubras. And now that I know the differences first-hand I probably wouldn't order a Heritage Grade hat unless that was the only way to get the hat in a color that isn't available in the Imperial Grade. But that's just me, and those with a more informed opinion might disagree.

to the extent that my opinion is informed, I agree with you

 

[RJR]

to the extent that my opinion is informed, I agree with you

+1

 

[D00R]

Thanks guys! Im lovin the look of the Fed IV. Has anyone made it look like the Streets of Cairo look? With the Indy Turn?

Anyone think the Imperial is a softer Fedora than the Deluxe?

 

[Zombie_61]

Thanks guys! Im lovin the look of the Fed IV. Has anyone made it look like the Streets of Cairo look? With the Indy Turn?

I don't know if anyone here has done it, but I've seen it attempted with varying results. The hardest part, I think, is replicating that "mushroom/reverse taper" look that was rather unique to the crown on the "Streets of Cairo" hat.

...Anyone think the Imperial is a softer Fedora thab the Deluxe?

Based on my single experience with the Deluxe/Heritage Grade felt I can't say one is softer than the other, but I find the regular/Imperial Grade felt easier to shape. I don't have an adequate way to use steam to shape my hats and have always sprayed them with distilled water to set the shape, so that might be the reason. My process is basically to dry crease the crown to the rough shape I want, spray it (soak it, actually) with distilled water, refine the shape, and let it dry. With my Imperial Grade hats, this worked well the first time. With the Heritage Grade, not so much. Wet or dry the crown wanted to revert to it's original open crown shape, so I had to repeat the process two or three times before it held the shape I wanted. Also, because of the shallow flange they use on the Fed IV the front of the brims (at least on mine) don't have that "snap down/snap up" quality like most fedoras, so I use distilled water to snap them down as well. The brims on my Imperial Grade Feds took their new snapped-down shape the first time, but the brim on my Heritage Grade, like the crown, kept reverting to it's original shape so I had to spray and shape it five times before it held the shape I want.

That being said, I attribute this to the differences in the felt and not the amount of stiffener used on each hat. Akubra's Heritage Grade felt seems to be more resilient, and if you were somehow able to subject an Imperial Grade hat and a Heritage Grade hat to the exact same wear and tear through years of use I suspect the Heritage would outlast the Imperial.

 

[D00R]

I was reading from a youtube review that “the Deluxe is made with fur from a rabbits undercarriage/breast and is maybe 5 to 10% softer and it also has a slightly deeper sweatband than the Fed IV and the lining is also White saturn like Indys.”

 

[Just A Hat Rack]

I don't know if anyone here has done it, but I've seen it attempted with varying results. The hardest part, I think, is replicating that "mushroom/reverse taper" look that was rather unique to the crown on the "Streets of Cairo" hat.

Based on my single experience with the Deluxe/Heritage Grade felt I can't say one is softer than the other, but I find the regular/Imperial Grade felt easier to shape. I don't have an adequate way to use steam to shape my hats and have always sprayed them with distilled water to set the shape, so that might be the reason. My process is basically to dry crease the crown to the rough shape I want, spray it (soak it, actually) with distilled water, refine the shape, and let it dry. With my Imperial Grade hats, this worked well the first time. With the Heritage Grade, not so much. Wet or dry the crown wanted to revert to it's original open crown shape, so I had to repeat the process two or three times before it held the shape I wanted. Also, because of the shallow flange they use on the Fed IV the front of the brims (at least on mine) don't have that "snap down/snap up" quality like most fedoras, so I use distilled water to snap them down as well. The brims on my Imperial Grade Feds took their new snapped-down shape the first time, but the brim on my Heritage Grade, like the crown, kept reverting to it's original shape so I had to spray and shape it five times before it held the shape I want.

That being said, I attribute this to the differences in the felt and not the amount of stiffener used on each hat. Akubra's Heritage Grade felt seems to be more resilient, and if you were somehow able to subject an Imperial Grade hat and a Heritage Grade hat to the exact same wear and tear through years of use I suspect the Heritage would outlast the Imperial.

I have a Heritage grade Akubra (Lightning Ridge) and today I was trying to add some pinch to it. I was trying to make them somewhat bigger and tighter, as they're only two small dents near the top of the crown. I didn't want to make them too big because I don't want them resting too heavy on my head when I wear it. Like you, I don't have a steamer, kettle, or even distilled water handy. I tried boiling a pot of water covered with foil with a dime size hole in the center of the foil. It seemed to work somewhat, but my pinches wound up being uneven and wouldn't stay where I wanted them. I gave it a couple of go arounds before calling it quits because I thought I read somewhere not to apply too much heat to the felt. I'm sure a lot of my issues were attributed to the Heritage grade felt being a bit thicker, and tougher to take form (as opposed to the Imperial grade, which I don't have...yet). I also may not have applied enough steam to the hat. Like I said, I was a bit weary adding heat to it. I may try tracking down some distilled water and give that a few tries. Unless of course I was wasting my time worrying about the heat. This was my first time playing with felt.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Zombie_61]

I'm far from being an expert, and the difference in softness might be more noticeable if one were to compare a brand new Imperial Grade hat and a brand new Heritage Grade hat. By the time I got my Heritage (the Moonstone Grey in the photo I posted in post #1919, by the way) I had been wearing my Tawny Fawn Fed for two years and my Dark Brown Fed for seven years and they each got softer as a result, so it was difficult to make that determination. They feel pretty much the same to me at this point, so it's probably true.

The "slightly deeper sweatband" is true. If I remember correctly, the Heritage sweatband is 1/8" wider than the Imperial. But it's definitely a different type of leather; it feels a bit softer, and doesn't shrink nearly as much as the Imperial sweatbands. When I first got my Imperial Feds they were so oversized that I could easily pull them down until my head filled the open crown and the sweatband was over my eyes. But when I received my Heritage Fed I thought they had shipped the wrong size because it was only slightly loose; it was only after I took it off that I noticed it was a Heritage rather than an Imperial. But after creasing them and wearing them for a few days (and specifically sweating in them) they all shrunk down to what I considered to be a perfect fit, so that confirmed for me that everything I'd read about their "shrink to fit" quality was correct. That, or it was just dumb luck that their size 60 fit me so well.

I have a Heritage grade Akubra (Lightning Ridge) and today I was trying to add some pinch to it...I may try tracking down some distilled water and give that a few tries...

The reason I use distilled water is because our city puts a lot of additives in our tap water, making it what is commonly referred to as "hard water". I have no idea whether or not that might discolor the felt, so I use distilled water just to play it safe. If you don't have that problem with your local tap water you probably wouldn't need to use distilled water. Regardless, with the Heritage felt don't be surprised if it takes more than one attempt to get the pinch you want. Also, I've read it's more difficult to re-crease a hat with a factory crease than it is to crease or re-crease a hat that was shipped with an open crown, but don't let that dissuade you. With persistence and determination, you'll get the shape you want.

 

[scottyrocks]

For those of you with a lack of a steamer, such as me, get yourself a $7 teapot. I pulled the whistler out of mine, and it shoots a nice blast of steam at full boil, and makes shaping a lot quicker and easier than spray bottles, which I also have used.

 

[D00R]

I had vintage stetson royals with such confortable sweatbands, and I own a Modern day Borsalino Alessandria and its sweatband isn’t pleasant to wear at all. The stitching is rough and the leather sweat band is so flat around the sweatband that its so flat against my head unlike the Stetson Royals that I think someone said had a saddle sweatband? Unsure.

How is the Fed IV Sweatband and Fed Deluxe?
Is the Fed IV called the Imperial?
Im thinking of ordering from Hatsdirect. Has anyone had a good experience through them?

Is the Fed IV the same thickness as the factory made Herbert Johnson Poet? I owned one but wasn’t thrilled with it and sold it.
Is the FedIV Brim a tad bigger than the Poet?

 

[Zombie_61]

...How is the Fed IV Sweatband and Fed Deluxe? Is the Fed IV called the Imperial? Im thinking of ordering from Hatsdirect. Has anyone had a good experience through them?

First, I have no real experience with other modern production hats so I don't really have a frame of reference to compare them with Akubra's sweatbands. I can say I've never found the sweatbands on my Akubras to be uncomfortable in any way, and after 10 years I haven't yet found it necessary to moisturize the sweatband on my oldest Fed IV.

Second, the terms "Imperial Grade" and "Heritage Grade" are references to the quality levels of the hats, not a reference to the model/style names. "Imperial Grade" is the standard felt used on most of Akubra's hats, and "Heritage Grade" is an allegedly higher quality felt used on some of their hats. So you can get an Imperial Grade Fed IV, or a Heritage Grade Fed IV if you're willing to pay a little more. The dimensions and styling are the same, only the materials (and specific colors) are different.

Third, the Fed IV is exclusive to Hats Direct/The Hattery. So unless you buy one that has been previously owned, you can't get the Fed IV anywhere else. That being said, I've received nothing but excellent service from Hats Direct/The Hattery. The staff is friendly and knowledgeable, they've always responded to my e-mails within a reasonable amount of time (taking the time difference into consideration), and processed and shipped my orders quickly. I have no complaints, would order from them again, and would recommend them to anyone.

...Is the Fed IV the same thickness as the factory made Herbert Johnson Poet? I owned one but wasn’t thrilled with it and sold it. Is the FedIV Brim a tad bigger than the Poet?

The one spec I've never seen listed on any hat websites is the felt thickness, so I can't help you there. According to their website the modern Poet has almost the same dimensions as the Fed IV, except the brim is 1/8" wider on the sides.

 

[Krash1974]

First, I have no real experience with other modern production hats so I don't really have a frame of reference to compare them with Akubra's sweatbands. I can say I've never found the sweatbands on my Akubras to be uncomfortable in any way, and after 10 years I haven't yet found it necessary to moisturize the sweatband on my oldest Fed IV.

Second, the terms "Imperial Grade" and "Heritage Grade" are references to the quality levels of the hats, not a reference to the model/style names. "Imperial Grade" is the standard felt used on most of Akubra's hats, and "Heritage Grade" is an allegedly higher quality felt used on some of their hats. So you can get an Imperial Grade Fed IV, or a Heritage Grade Fed IV if you're willing to pay a little more. The dimensions and styling are the same, only the materials (and specific colors) are different.

Third, the Fed IV is exclusive to Hats Direct/The Hattery. So unless you buy one that has been previously owned, you can't get the Fed IV anywhere else. That being said, I've received nothing but excellent service from Hats Direct/The Hattery. The staff is friendly and knowledgeable, they've always responded to my e-mails within a reasonable amount of time (taking the time difference into consideration), and processed and shipped my orders quickly. I have no complaints, would order from them again, and would recommend them to anyone.

The one spec I've never seen listed on any hat websites is the felt thickness, so I can't help you there. According to their website the modern Poet has almost the same dimensions as the Fed IV, except the brim is 1/8" wider on the sides.

Yep. The staff there is exceptional in customer service.

 

[Krash1974]

I had vintage stetson royals with such confortable sweatbands, and I own a Modern day Borsalino Alessandria and its sweatband isn’t pleasant to wear at all. The stitching is rough and the leather sweat band is so flat around the sweatband that its so flat against my head unlike the Stetson Royals that I think someone said had a saddle sweatband? Unsure.

How is the Fed IV Sweatband and Fed Deluxe?
Is the Fed IV called the Imperial?
Im thinking of ordering from Hatsdirect. Has anyone had a good experience through them?

Is the Fed IV the same thickness as the factory made Herbert Johnson Poet? I owned one but wasn’t thrilled with it and sold it.
Is the FedIV Brim a tad bigger than the Poet?

I've only had mine a few months but right out of the box the FED IV standard was very comfortable.

 

[D00R]

Yes the FedIV reminded me of my poet but without the pretentious price tag.
I like that the FedIV brim is a tad bigger. I always thought the Poets Brim was a tad short.
Thanks guys for all your own personal experiences with your FedIV. How everyone wears and bashes theres looks fantastic.

Is the sizing like a Campdraft that it should be ordered a size up because of shrinking around the leather sweatband? Or is it best to order your true size?

I noticed the Deluxe has plastic at the top of the inside liner. Does the Inperialnhave that plastic inside to?

 

[Zombie_61]

Yes the FedIV reminded me of my poet but without the pretentious price tag...

You can almost buy four Imperial Grade Fed IVs for the cost of a single Herbert Johnson rabbit felt Poet. The difference is that Herbert Johnson's website claims each hat is made to order (presumably to the customer's specifications) and would likely be at least a little more like a custom hat. That, and the "bragging rights" of being able to say you own a Herbert Johnson Poet/Raiders hat, might be worth the extra cost to some people, but my brain can't justify spending that much for a single hat when I can get four hats of nearly equal quality for a few bucks more.

...I like that the FedIV brim is a tad bigger. I always thought the Poets Brim was a tad short...

I think my comment above wasn't as clear as it should have been. The brim on the Herbert Johnson's Poet/Raiders hat is actually wider than the Fed IV, but the difference is only 1/8"; 2-5/8" on the Poet/Raiders, 2-1/2" on the Fed IV. Otherwise the dimensions are roughly the same--brim widths of 2-3/4" front and back, and open crown heights of roughly 5-1/2".

But here's something to consider--to a point, the brim width on any hat is a matter of perception. What I mean is, a 2-1/2" wide brim is going to be a 2-1/2" wide brim no matter what. But it will appear to be wider on a smaller size hat because the width and length of the crown will be smaller on a smaller size hat. So the exact same brim width will appear to be wider on a size 56 hat than it will on a size 63 hat because of the different crown measurements.

...Is the sizing like a Campdraft that it should be ordered a size up because of shrinking around the leather sweatband? Or is it best to order your true size?

Based on my experience with Akubra hats, my earlier recommendations stand--if your head measurement is close to an exact size, order that size; if you're between sizes, order the larger of the two. Either way, it's not a bad idea to have a Hat Jack on hand just in case the hat might need a little stretching to be more comfortable. My three Fed IVs and my three Campdrafts are all size 60. After the expected "shrink to fit" period the Fed IVs all fit the same and the Campdrafts all fit the same, but the Campdrafts were just a little too snug for my liking. So I stretched the Campdrafts out just a little with my Hat Jack, and now all six hats fit the same.

Since we're on the subject of Akubra's sweatbands and their "shrink to fit" quality, the folks at Akubra know their sweatbands do this and produce their hats accordingly. To the buyer, this means a brand new Akubra right out of the box or off of the shelf should be loose. The new owner needs to wear it, and more specifically sweat in it, to get it to shrink and conform to the size and shape of his/her head. Sweating is the key, because the moisture and sodium in our perspiration slightly dehydrates the leathers that Akubra uses for their sweatband, and this is what causes that initial shrinkage. They might shrink a bit more after years of use, but that hasn't been my experience; the sweatbands on all of my Akubras stabilized after that initial shrinkage, and remain comfortable to this day.

...I noticed the Deluxe has plastic at the top of the inside liner. Does the Inperialnhave that plastic inside to?

Yes they do. The logos printed on them are different to signify the difference between Imperial Grade and Heritage Grade, but all of my Akubras have satin liners with plastic covering the tops of the liners.

 

[D00R]

You can almost buy four Imperial Grade Fed IVs for the cost of a single Herbert Johnson rabbit felt Poet. The difference is that Herbert Johnson's website claims each hat is made to order (presumably to the customer's specifications) and would likely be at least a little more like a custom hat. That, and the "bragging rights" of being able to say you own a Herbert Johnson Poet/Raiders hat, might be worth the extra cost to some people, but my brain can't justify spending that much for a single hat when I can get four hats of nearly equal quality for a few bucks more.

I agree there prices are greed. Always be that way.

I think my comment above wasn't as clear as it should have been. The brim on the Herbert Johnson's Poet/Raiders hat is actually wider than the Fed IV, but the difference is only 1/8"; 2-5/8" on the Poet/Raiders, 2-1/2" on the Fed IV. Otherwise the dimensions are roughly the same--brim widths of 2-3/4" front and back, and open crown heights of roughly 5-1/2".

I had the Herbert Johnson Poet Factory made hat. Im not sure if that brim was shorter? Maybe because that Herbert Johnson Poet reminded me a lot of the Last crusade fedora.

But here's something to consider--to a point, the brim width on any hat is a matter of perception. What I mean is, a 2-1/2" wide brim is going to be a 2-1/2" wide brim no matter what. But it will appear to be wider on a smaller size hat because the width and length of the crown will be smaller on a smaller size hat. So the exact same brim width will appear to be wider on a size 56 hat than it will on a size 63 hat because of the different crown measurements.

Yeah, Im a 57 size.

Based on my experience with Akubra hats, my earlier recommendations stand--if your head measurement is close to an exact size, order that size; if you're between sizes, order the larger of the two. Either way, it's not a bad idea to have a Hat Jack on hand just in case the hat might need a little stretching to be more comfortable. My three Fed IVs and my three Campdrafts are all size 60. After the expected "shrink to fit" period the Fed IVs all fit the same and the Campdrafts all fit the same, but the Campdrafts were just a little too snug for my liking. So I stretched the Campdrafts out just a little with my Hat Jack, and now all six hats fit the same.

Its always a gamble.

Since we're on the subject of Akubra's sweatbands and their "shrink to fit" quality, the folks at Akubra know their sweatbands do this and produce their hats accordingly. To the buyer, this means a brand new Akubra right out of the box or off of the shelf should be loose. The new owner needs to wear it, and more specifically sweat in it, to get it to shrink and conform to the size and shape of his/her head. Sweating is the key, because the moisture and sodium in our perspiration slightly dehydrates the leathers that Akubra uses for their sweatband, and this is what causes that initial shrinkage. They might shrink a bit more after years of use, but that hasn't been my experience; the sweatbands on all of my Akubras stabilized after that initial shrinkage, and remain comfortable to this day.

I never owned one, this hat brand just makes menso curious. Always had stetsons and borsalinos. But was never fully satisfied with the look.

Yes they do. The logos printed on them are different to signify the difference between Imperial Grade and Heritage Grade, but all of my Akubras have satin liners with plastic covering the tops of the liners.

Even the Imperial has plastic ic at the top? Doesnt was that make peoples heads hot?

 

[Zombie_61]

I agree there prices are greed. Always be that way...

Herbert Johnson (the company) has been making hats for over 100 years. At this point, I think people are paying as much for the name as they are for the hats.

...I had the Herbert Johnson Poet Factory made hat. Im not sure if that brim was shorter? Maybe because that Herbert Johnson Poet reminded me a lot of the Last crusade fedora...

Another thing to remember is that there wasn't only one Indy hat. For each movie they made a number of hats that were worn by Harrison Ford and the various stunt men who played Indy, so there are bound to be differences. Even if they all started out being the same shape, any number of things can happen to them while filming--run over by a truck, stepped on by a horse, soaked in water, etc., etc.--so each hat's individual "experience" dictated it's shape to some degree. Harrison Ford apparently became quite adept at shaping the crowns and brims of the hats he wore, but all things considered it would be almost impossible for two hats to look exactly the same.

...Even the Imperial has plastic ic at the top? Doesnt was that make peoples heads hot?

I've read comments from a number of members here who say they remove the liners in their fur felt hats during the hotter summer months because it makes them cooler, then replace them during the colder winter months to keep their heads warm. I've never had the guts to do that so I don't know if it actually makes the hats cooler, but with the lack of ventilation I'm pretty sure once the temperature reaches a certain point a fur felt hat is going to be hot no matter what you do...unless you soak it in ice water.

 

[scottyrocks]

Herbert Johnson (the company) has been making hats for over 100 years. At this point, I think people are paying as much for the name as they are for the hats.

Yep.

Another thing to remember is that there wasn't only one Indy hat. For each movie they made a number of hats that were worn by Harrison Ford and the various stunt men who played Indy, so there are bound to be differences. Even if they all started out being the same shape, any number of things can happen to them while filming--run over by a truck, stepped on by a horse, soaked in water, etc., etc.--so each hat's individual "experience" dictated it's shape to some degree. Harrison Ford apparently became quite adept at shaping the crowns and brims of the hats he wore, but all things considered it would be almost impossible for two hats to look exactly the same.

There has been so much discussion on this point. From what I have been able to gather, there was one basic 'hero' hat that Ford wore in most of the movie, and almost definitely one hat person sequence, hence the 'Streets of Cairo' (SoC) hat, etc. There are pictures, and moving pictures, I think, of him tweaking the hat.

As an aside, the SoC hat doesn't necessarily refer to one hat that is different from other(s) in the film. Rather, it refers to what the hat looked like in that part of the film.

I've read comments from a number of members here who say they remove the liners in their fur felt hats during the hotter summer months because it makes them cooler, then replace them during the colder winter months to keep their heads warm. I've never had the guts to do that so I don't know if it actually makes the hats cooler, but with the lack of ventilation I'm pretty sure once the temperature reaches a certain point a fur felt hat is going to be hot no matter what you do...unless you soak it in ice water.

I know a lot of folks wear felts sans liners, but I loathe the thought of sweat stains inside my felts (big head) so I never remove the liners. That's why I seldom wear vintage felt during the summer. I especially don't want sweat stains on those liners. I have a number of modern hats so I wear those.

 

[chicken1616]

I think this site seems more credible than any on the story. At this point in time, this is probably as comprehensive a story as a person can find.
http://www.indygear.com/igfedora.html