Help with Purchase of First Fedora

[ajax]

I dream about Fedoras. For three months I've been obsessed with buying one. I've done some research and find that a truly informative, comprehensive, and trustworthy website doesn't exist. I've registered here in hopes of tapping into what appears to be a large bulletin board of experts.

First, I do not mind spending upwards of $200 to $300 if I would be guaranteed a high quality yet very durable hat. I wouldn't mind spending less. In other words, I know that at some point the law of diminishing returns must kick in and eventually to spend more money simply doesn't get you much if anything more. Further, I have absolutely no idea if a fine hat is like fine furniture - that is to say, when one spends a lot on a dining room table, it will look fantastic, but needs to be protected from virtually everything. I want a great hat, but one that I can wear everyday and not worry that it will rain or snow.

Does a hat like this exist? What is the most weather resistant material?

What are the best brand names? I've heard much about Optimo and Borsalino. Stetson and Dobbs.

Optimo seems to be a custom arena and frankly I don't know enough to know whether the expense is worth it. Plus never owning a Fedora really hurts in me being able to tell them what it is I want.

What would be ideal for me is to be able to either visit one massive store where hats from many companies are presentable or many stores in one location. I don't know my hat size. I really think it would be best to actually try a hat on, look at it in the mirror, and then buy it. Online purchasing of a hat scares me a bit.

I am aware of a location in NYC that has hats available for sale. 310 fifth avenue. It is the address of JJ Hat Center, Dobbs, and Stetson Retail, as well as Borsalino. I have no idea if this is just one store at one location or several competitors all at one site, which seems a bit bizarre.

Has anyone ever gone there? Would it be a waste of my time, driving says 5 hours one way to get there? Do they have experts there? Do they have a huge selection?

I really just want to own a nice black fedora that is built to last and will look fine to. I've put three months of casual research into this and haven't learned much. I hear conflicting opinions on material, etc. At this point, I'm just hoping that either some good, fine sirs here can point me in the right direction, or at least tell me that 310 fifth avenue is awesome and that I will surely find a hat there.

Thank you very much for your help.
Andrew

 

[Not-Bogart13]

You've come to the right place!

This forum is filled with people who know their stuff about fedoras. I've learned a great deal here over the last few months, and I've come to trust their opinions and knowledge. Price and quality don't always go hand-in-hand with hats, so heed the advice you get in The Lounge!

In a nut shell, if you're ready to spend that much money on a lid, and you want maximum bang for your buck (durable and high quality), go custom. If I were going to go custom (which I may soon), I'd order from one of the guys here. (The Lounge "veterans" will be better at remembering them all, but "Fedora" pops to mind).

For "off the shelf" I can say from personal experience that a current Stetson fedora won't take much punishment for the money. I recommend Akubras or older stetsons. Ebay is good for vintage hats, and hatsdirect.com has a nice selection of Akubra hats (explore all categories on the site). I'd love to browse a hat store, but I'm not driving 5 hours to do it. Online isn't all that bad. As for Optimos and Borsies, I've never seen them in person.

To figure out your size, measure around your head with a tape measure, just above the ears and eyebrows (not too tight, though). Record the inches to the nearest eighth of and inch (round fractions up). You can then find hat size conversion charts on hatsdirect.com or noggintops, or most other hat-selling sites.

Good luck, and welcome to the Lounge.:fedora:

 

[Prairie Shade]

Welcome aboard!!

What do you intend to do with your hat (aside from wear it)? Are you just beginning to get interested or at least think you are, then go for something inexpensive!! Ebay really isnt a bad way to start. Follow the above advice and determine your hat size, then look for older vintage hats. If your lucky (?) your head size will be 7 1/8 or 7 1/4 and you can run in the open field on ebay. If your normal (?) then you will find more competition. Regardless, you should be able to find a good starter under 50.00 if your patient. I have to remember sometimes that a hat is nothing more than a piece of clothing. Our tastes and sizes are all just a little different. Width of brim, color, texture of felt, crown height, taper etc.etc. I have had good luck with Miller hats as a web site. I have worn hats long enough to know my size and so I may have an advantage on you!! If you have 130 Bucks, you should be able to get a really good starter hat, Akubra, Stetson, Dobbs, Ebay or whatever. Good luck and go for it!!!

 

[Bebop]

Try one of Steve Delk's fedoras

If you are looking for a top quality fedora that is 100% beaver you should give Adventurebilt.com a look. Steve makes custom fedoras that run in the mid $200's and are made with any specs you want.

 

[Hemingway Jones]

ajax,
I would do a little soul-searching and decide what sort of hat it is that I was looking for. There are many variants in the world of fedoras. Do you want a hat like Bogart in "Casablanca," something from "Seabiscuit," Indiana Jones, or "The Untouchables?"

Once you have an idea of the look you are trying to achieve, then you can find a product to match.

Steve Delk of Adventurebilt Hats is my hatter. We discuss what it is that I am looking for and he produces it for me. I have three of his and I love each dearly.

I usually start with a film or a photo.

Good luck!
-HJ

 

[Doh!]

I would just add that you should be aware that hat sizes are not consistent; with some makers, I take a 7 1/2, others a 7 3/8. I was told that European sizes run larger (it might be a metric thing).

If you have any hats available to try on in person (used or even low-end ones), I'd make notes and then if you have a custom one built let the maker know you take a 7 1/4 in Stetsons or whatever. Good luck!

 

[ajax]

More Info

First and foremost, I want to thank everyone for their comments so far.

I can narrow things down a little bit. I'm not sure what will look good on my head which is part of the reason I wanted to see what 310 Fifth Avenue, NYC (aka JJ Hat Center) had in store for me, but if I had to pick from a movie or photo I'd say I like some of the Fedoras I saw in the Godfather. But there were so many. And some times they look completely different from the sideview. I think I like a longer brim than a shorter. I like the front to fold down a bit and don't care for when hats are turned up on all sides. The rim should also be bordered or edged (I don't know if that's the right term). It should be black in color with a black band too I suppose. I want one whose band isn't too wide or too small and I don't want a hat that stands really tall on my head. Also, I'd like to consider using different color feathers inserted from time to time. Does anyone do this? Where can one get like a ten pack of feathers? One hat that I like on line and have considered purchasing was this:

http://www.millerhats.com/presidentste_index/president.html

"The Humphrey" or even the "The Landry"

Also, this one looked cool
http://www.hatsinthebelfry.com/Merc...9-black&Category_Code=mens-dress-hats&Image=1

But its so cheap I have to wonder if it's any good...

I have questions about either of these:

Is it beaver? (And while we're at it is beaver the best material?)
Will it be fine in rain or snow?

Should I take a picture like that and send it to a custom dude like Steve Delk and ask him to make the same hat but simply make it in the best materials?

I should add that I only really want one black hat to go with my coat, rather than say a starter hat. For instance, when I bought a kitchen mixer I bought a KitchenAid, because I never wanted to have to buy another. The same will apply here. I want one damn nice hat that is high in durability as well as looks and comfort - one that should last for a very, very long time. Silk lining, best outer materials whatever.

Do the stetson hats come with silk insides? Do most custom hats have silk insides?

Thanks again folks.

 

[Not-Bogart13]

A Man who knows what he wants!

First off, the hat from hatsinthebelfry.com is made of wool felt, which is inexpensive, but won't last long if put to the real test. You want some kind of fur felt (Beaver or otherwise). I'm not an expert on what's the best, but that might be a matter of opinion, anyway.

The term you're looking for, I think is "bound brim" or "bound edge". Check out this picture of a hat with a ribbon binding on the edge. Is that what you mean?
http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/michaelgarcia13/detail?.dir=ae0a&.dnm=3bafre2.jpg&.src=ph

I don't know if Steve does bound brims, but I'd like to know, too. At any rate, with pictures and dimentions (like those on the Millers) you should have no problem getting a custom job from Steve.

As for Miller hats, I have a new acquisition from them, and it's a nice hat, but I'm not sure what the elements would do to it. It might be like that fine furniture comparison you made...

 

[Bebop]

One thing you won't get from Adventurebilt hats is a bound edge. I believe Steve is not too fond of bound edges on hats. I think beaver is the best material for a long lived and comfortable hat. Steve will make you a rabbit hat if you like (less expensive) but I think that beaver is more water resistant and feels alot softer and more comfortable. I would stay away from wool hats if you want something to have for a long time as you described. Keep in mind that sometimes the hats you see on the internet look quite different once you get them on your head. If you are going to buy through the internet, I would buy a cheap hat in the style you think you like and then look for a top quality hat in the same style and measurments as the one you know fits your face. Spending alot of money on a hat only to find that the crown is too high or the brim too wide once you try it on is depressing to say the least.
I do not like feathers on hats. I think it is distracting and makes the hat look cheap but that is just a personal thing. I don't know where you can purchase feathers. I suppose anywhere that sells hats would sell them to you.

 

[Sardou]

Local Lore

Living in New York, maybe I can help with some local detail.

JJ on Fifth Avenue is an independent, old-fashioned hat shop that deals the various lines you refer to, as well as Biltmore. That said, their "flagship" line is Borsalino. Loungers have also said nice things about the Lago Marsino and Puerto Fino hats, which are noticeably cheaper. The store is beautiful, and the attentive service is the best I've seen anywhere. They will make you feel special. As always when shopping in Manhattan, I'd wear a tie and something nicer than jeans.

I would start there, because their staff, like all good hatters, have an eye for size, proportion and what looks good on a particular face that is attached to a particular body. The first time I walked in, they pegged my size exactly (without asking or measuring), and every hat they picked out for me to try on looked better on me that any hat I asked to try on. Bring a cloth tape measure and take notes on which brim widths, crown heights, etc. work for you. Remember, you don't want to look like you're wearing Indiana Jones's hat, you want to look like you're wearing yours! If you don't buy from JJ, you'll at least have some data to help with mail order.

While in Manhattan, you may want to check out Worth & Worth --- much downsized since giving up their store (they operate out of a hotel suite), but still very good stuff.

You're lucky that you're looking for black, as the Orthodox/Chasidic communities provide a steady demand for black fedoras. To save $25-$50 off of Manhattan prices, brave the subway to Brooklyn: specifically to either or both of Bencraft's stores. For addresses and directions, see www.bencrafthats.com. Not as posh as JJ, but good stock and good people. And they do a lot of black fedoras. Of the two stores, 13th Avenue has more stock than Williamsburg (236 Broadway), but the latter has some great old stock, including some leftover Habigs from Vienna, and is easier to get to from Manhattan (but note that Broadway in Brooklyn is nowhere near Broadway in Manhattan).

You said that you are five hours away. If you're coming from New England, you might also want to check out Delmonico Hatters in New Haven. I've only seen their website, but it looks like a good source.

Hope this helps,

Sardou

 

[Sardou]

Oh and by the way . . .

If this hat is intended to go with a specific coat, bring the coat. What's below the neck can strongly affect the appearance of what's above.

Sardou

 

[Not-Bogart13]

A-Men to that, Sardou!

 

[SHARPETOYS]

100% handmade beaver custom.

I have had several hats/fedora's custom made. I sent pictures of the fedora I wanted along with my head size to the hatter.

Art Fawcett a member here is a very fine hatter. His hats start at $125.00 Rabbitt up to $275.00 in 100% pure beaver. He can do a bound edge also. No new factory hat will hold a candle to a custom made fedora. Check with Art he can build you a beauty in your price range!!

http://www.vintagesilhouettes.com/m_hats_new_felts.htm

Phone # 541-865-7878

 

[Michael Mallory]

I'm a Biltmore man. They seem to have the best blocks and a good quality felt for the money. I don't do the $400 hats. I have a lot of other things I can spend that money on. But Biltmore's run in the $100-to-$150 range, and are good quality. Check out Miller Hats online. All their brand name stock is Biltmore.

 

[MattC]

Question on brims

I guess this is for anyone who knows Art's work: does he do over or underwelts as well as bound brims? What about Steve?

 

[SHARPETOYS]

Art Yes Steve Soon

I guess this is for anyone who knows Art's work: does he do over or underwelts as well as bound brims? What about Steve?

Art does. I spoke to Steve and soon he will offer bound brims

 

[ajax]

Thanks a bunch

I am truly grateful for everyone's input. Really, it seems that there are differences in a opinion, but all opinions coming from those in the know, but yet with personal preferences.

I think my first hat will be a direct purchase, but if I branch out beyond that I may very well go custom. Special thanks to Sardou who has convinced me to check out JJ Hat Center. I'll be travelling from Syracuse next week, will visit my daughter at college and go to the store. I'll be surprised if they don't have something that looks good, is somewhat durable, and is in the $200 range.

Should I ever get back to wearing suits every day on the job, I'm going to seriously consider getting a custom built set of hats.

Andrew

 

[Mycroft]

I am truly grateful for everyone's input. Really, it seems that there are differences in a opinion, but all opinions coming from those in the know, but yet with personal preferences.

I think my first hat will be a direct purchase, but if I branch out beyond that I may very well go custom. Special thanks to Sardou who has convinced me to check out JJ Hat Center. I'll be travelling from Syracuse next week, will visit my daughter at college and go to the store. I'll be surprised if they don't have something that looks good, is somewhat durable, and is in the $200 range.

Should I ever get back to wearing suits every day on the job, I'm going to seriously consider getting a custom built set of hats.

Andrew

OK, late coming in, but I just got back from J.J.'s with my first fedora bought there. Look at Lago Masinos, they are about $150ish, very water resitant and keep their shape so well, not to menchin they are very soft. Also, get a hat brush at J.J.'s it is worth ectra $12 or so. And Welcome to the Lounge.

 

[besdor]

Dont forget that trip to Brooklyn!! It's worth the trip to Bencraft from anywhere .:cool2: :cool2:

 

[Sardou]

Amen to that!

Indeed, how could one NOT check out Brooklyn, the storied borough of lore and legend? And of Bencraft Hatters!

Sardou,
A Brooklyn immmigrant, but at home nonetheless