Funny Aeroleather Review I found on Schott Website

[nick123]

I do two laps outside the mall every weekend. Shoot me.

 

[Edward]

I'm somewhat wary of reviews in general, and particularly rosy reviews of products posted on the product manufacturer's own website. But when a reviewer also singles out the manufacturer's competitor for criticism...well, let's just say it raises some red flags as to credibility.

Heh. I never thought of that. I should think that Schott are big enough to not need to resort to that sort of thing. It's funny, though, how human it is to take sides even on something as banal as other people's choice of clothing. We all do it.

I like Schott. Not on the same level as the smaller, niche manufacturers, but that's not what they're trying to do either. I wish they were more widely available here, at US prices. A Perfecto in the UK is GBP100-150 cheaper than an Aero MC; in the US it's closer to GBP200-250.

 

[ButteMT61]

I think Schott is becoming overpriced, so I only buy their gear on sale. I still have a couple new jackets I haven't even worn yet. I like that they offer other things as well. A good all-around shop. And some of the stuff is made here.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

With all the manufacturers now making extremely similar jackets, and ripping each other off on design like there's no tomorrow (see the recent volcano of rip-offs of Himel designs, the Alexander Leathers ongoing debacle, and Mr Freedom's Wall of Shame, for example), the issues of fit between Mfrs will come up. Clearly the reviewer liked the fit of a Schott jacket better than the fit of a similar Scottish jacket.

Some of the wording in the review really reminds me of Lost Worlds guy. Maybe they've been taking notes.

 

[Edward]

With all the manufacturers now making extremely similar jackets, and ripping each other off on design like there's no tomorrow (see the recent volcano of rip-offs of Himel designs, the Alexander Leathers ongoing debacle, and Mr Freedom's Wall of Shame, for example), the issues of fit between Mfrs will come up. Clearly the reviewer liked the fit of a Schott jacket better than the fit of a similar Scottish jacket.

Mr Freedom's Wall of Shame?

Some of the wording in the review really reminds me of Lost Worlds guy. Maybe they've been taking notes.

Oh, jinkies.... his obsession with manliness and masculinity is outright hilarious. He's like something out of a Will Ferrell film.

 

[ButteMT61]

He bought completely different Schott and Aero jackets! And if it didn't fit right, Aero would have made good on it from the stories I've read here - even the old regime. So I say yeah, the angst in that post is telling...

 

[Edward]

Clearly the reviewer liked the fit of a Schott jacket better than the fit of a similar Scottish jacket.

Yip. Comes back to being misinformed or not understanding the nature of the HWM. Clearly he wanted something more fitted - like the Perfectos are, mostly - so the HWM wasn't the right choice. Fit is definitely an important part of the equation with any jacket, IMO.

 

[Sloan1874]

As they say in Hollywood: show, don't tell.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Yip. Comes back to being misinformed or not understanding the nature of the HWM. Clearly he wanted something more fitted - like the Perfectos are, mostly - so the HWM wasn't the right choice. Fit is definitely an important part of the equation with any jacket, IMO.

I don't think the reviewer on the Schott site says which Aero model he bought …

Mr Freedom's Wall of Shame?

Sorry, Hall of Shame. My bad. The Mr Freedom site's down right now, or I'd post a link, but along the top of the front page, one of the links is to the "hall of shame" where he displays many of the more egregious (Evisu et al.) rip-offs of his original designs/patterns. I think Himel should do the same or similar.

[EDIT] Here's the link, for when the site's up again:

http://www.misterfreedom.com/hall-of-shame/

 

[Monitor]

He must be either comparing two completely different jackets, or didn't get an Aero tailored to his size, even though his review suggests he did. Thing is, until recently I probably would've agreed with the review - I've bought and sold two used Aero jackets because quite frankly I found the fit to be just horrible. There's no doubt that Aero's jackets belong to a class of its own, but I've always found Schott's stuff to fit me much, much better - until I tried on an Aero Highwayman which was exactly in my size, and realized how wrong I was. I've found that if you get an Aero that's too big for you, it will make you look ridiculous - moreso than any other leather.

 

[ButteMT61]

I don't think the reviewer on the Schott site says which Aero model he bought … Sorry, Hall of Shame. My bad. The Mr Freedom site's down right now, or I'd post a link, but along the top of the front page, one of the links is to the "hall of shame" where he displays many of the more egregious (Evisu et al.) rip-offs of his original designs/patterns. I think Himel should do the same or similar.[EDIT] Here's the link, for when the site's up again:http://www.misterfreedom.com/hall-of-shame/

Ripoffs of his designs? What exactly is an original design these days? There's only so much one can do with a hide and a torso and two arms. Same goes for denim. Every maker could do this and every maker has used inspiration from other designs. Some flat-out copy, but what are you going to do? Just make them better. That's what separates the copycats usually. Another thing - most of these guys only make small sizes. They can't complain if someone copies a design and sells to the gorillas in the group - someone has to! lol

 

[nick123]

That wall of shame showcase is borderline hipster. Sorry!

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Ripoffs of his designs? What exactly is an original design these days? There's only so much one can do with a hide and a torso and two arms. Same goes for denim. Every maker could do this and every maker has used inspiration from other designs. Some flat-out copy, but what are you going to do? Just make them better. That's what separates the copycats usually. Another thing - most of these guys only make small sizes. They can't complain if someone copies a design and sells to the gorillas in the group - someone has to! lol

Well, someone passing something off as a Mr Freedom T-shirt when it's not should be prosecuted, of course. That's a rare case, though (one of 'em on the wall).

Obviously there's not much the reproducer of vintage styles can do. Other makers can always make up a story about how long they've been working on a design, or what was the inspiration. It's just annoying the lack of creativity displayed by straight out copying the work of someone else. Most of Mr Freedom's stuff, for example, is not straight out vintage reproduction. The designs and features are innovative and creative. Sure, he can't copyright a polka dot indigo tunic shirt. But to go out and copy the thing down to the pockets and flaps etc, is just lazy and disrespectful.

Hey, let's all go to China and buy some "Ipods"/"Iphones". There's no problem with stealing creative property right? They should just make them better.

 

[ButteMT61]

You didn't get the gist of my post. I don't condone stealing of ideas/designs. Did MR F or Himel invent anything without influence/borrowing from the past? Don't think so. I'm just saying it's a fine-line.

 

[Justhandguns]

This is a very delicate issue here. There are styles that we call reproductions/repros, then there are copies, and finally counterfeits. If you read some other fashion forums, there are a huge number of people complaining about designs from some famous fashion houses such as Gucci, RRL, Visvim etc.being copied. But of course, the lower brands which are selling those designs under their own brand names cannot be charged because few of those designs are patented. But then ironically, most of the top designers brands are also just copying from contemporary designs such as our beloved vintage flight jackets. And then, we have the counterfeits, needless to say, are unacceptable.

http://gizmodo.com/343641/1960s-braun-products-hold-the-secrets-to-apples-future

Look familiar? I bet that they don't really work the same as your iMacs or iPhones. Do the they work better? It is entirely up to you.

 

[Don Tomaso]

... And if it didn't fit right, Aero would have made good on it from the stories I've read here - even the old regime. ...

The "old regime"?!? Wasn't the FL all praise when Will was still at the helm of Aero's, how nice and smooth the customer service was with Amanda as "queen of customer service" and all? People were doing alterations and mods no longer supported, combining styles, sort of designing their jackets themselves? And didn't they sort out the Mark Moye case quite smoothly?
Not that I'm complaining about the changes at Aero's. I recently bought a jacket and it was a great experience, Holly being extremely helpful and patient, very quick in answering mails, and the result, the jacket, is simply gorgeous. But I got the same excellent stuff with the "old regime". I don't really like seeing them mocked like this.
If I misunderstood your post, Scott, please accept my apologies.

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

On the Mister Freedom thing: In my opinion his recent collections ARE highly original. OK, he started with more tame stuff like nautical inspired chambray shirts and I see how this might be not too "creative".
But in his last few collections he is really doing his own thing.

The Uwe Van Afferden copy baffeled me since he is a Mr F. retailer and his own magazine "heritage post" is pretending to be the defender of good quality, vintage inspired menswear stuff. What a hypocrite. :eusa_doh:

 

[Flat Foot Floey]

The "old regime"?!? Wasn't the FL all praise when Will was still at the helm of Aero's, how nice and smooth the customer service was with Amanda as "queen of customer service" and all? People were doing alterations and mods no longer supported, combining styles, sort of designing their jackets themselves? And didn't they sort out the Mark Moye case quite smoothly?
Not that I'm complaining about the changes at Aero's. I recently bought a jacket and it was a great experience, Holly being extremely helpful and patient, very quick in answering mails, and the result, the jacket, is simply gorgeous. But I got the same excellent stuff with the "old regime". I don't really like seeing them mocked like this.
If I misunderstood your post, Scott, please accept my apologies.

Well we can learn from this.
One bad move can destroy a reputation built over years. Aero had to make up for this mistake of their old team and it was hard work for them.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

My Mr Freedom example is just an example of a practice that is rife among small, medium, and large scale companies. Every garment is inspired from somewhere, and this is particularly true in the vintage styled market. The reality of the vintage inspired market is: if you're original, and people like your innovative designs, you are going to get ripped off. period.

Whether you (vosotros) think this is right and proper (whether it's done to cater for different sizes or to produce at a lower price point or whatever reason) depends on your stance on intellectual/creative property and ethics and pure laziness of ripping off someone elses work. And it also depends on your stance on the inspired vs reproduction vs new creative design debate.

"Oh, I was inspired to produce a pocket exactly like the Mr Freedom shirt pocket, in exactly the same fabric and exactly the same cut of shirt, and strongly inspired to make it of cheap shit poly-cotton in a slave labour Chinese/Bangladeshi/Sri Lankan/Turkish factory" doesn't quite cut it for me. There is a fundamental difference between being inspired by the overall look and feel of the clothing of a time period, and being "inspired" to copy the work of another current manufacturer/designer. While it is of course true that there are those of us who are inspired by those current makers, it is critical (both ethically and intellectually) to do something new with the ideas, not simply copy.

 

[ButteMT61]

The "old regime"?!? Wasn't the FL all praise when Will was still at the helm of Aero's, how nice and smooth the customer service was with Amanda as "queen of customer service" and all? People were doing alterations and mods no longer supported, combining styles, sort of designing their jackets themselves? And didn't they sort out the Mark Moye case quite smoothly? Not that I'm complaining about the changes at Aero's. I recently bought a jacket and it was a great experience, Holly being extremely helpful and patient, very quick in answering mails, and the result, the jacket, is simply gorgeous. But I got the same excellent stuff with the "old regime". I don't really like seeing them mocked like this.If I misunderstood your post, Scott, please accept my apologies.

The jacket must have been made at Aero during the "old regime", due to the post date. I simply stated that they would have fixed it back then as they would today. Because there are some questionable things that happened during that time, I posted what I did. If it sounds like mocking, well, OK. I've heard what Ken has gone through since the changes and I personally have little good to say, but I did defend them on this front. They would have fixed it.