French Hats and makers.

[drmaxtejeda]

Yes. See your PM section for details

Thank you, Daniele. After work. Grazie!

 

[drmaxtejeda]

I acquired these two Tirards from a lady who lives in rural France and finds them in towns around her area.
Her seller name on eBay is Faded Grandeur.
The first one is dated 7 oct 1942

 

[drmaxtejeda]

This second Tirard Melusine is more modern, I think
Could anyone please help with an age estimate?

 

[deadlyhandsome]

I acquired these two Tirards from a lady who lives in rural France and finds them in towns around her area.
Her seller name on eBay is Faded Grandeur.
The first one is dated 7 oct 1942
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I like them both, but this Diplomatique is the winner. Love the shape and the date stamp.

 

[drmaxtejeda]

I like them both, but this Diplomatique is the winner. Love the shape and the date stamp.

I agree, but I love the shiny felt of Melusine hats.

 

[steur]

This second Tirard Melusine is more modern, I think
Could anyone please help with an age estimate? View attachment 272683 View attachment 272684 View attachment 272685 View attachment 272686 View attachment 272687 View attachment 272688 View attachment 272689 View attachment 272690 View attachment 272691

Both great finds, Max. I'm partial to homburg hats, so like Brent I'm going to give it to the diplomatique. Wonderful that it has a date stamp as well.

 

[drmaxtejeda]

Thank you,Stefan

 

[steur]

Mossant de Luxe perforated hat in size 57. Triple stitched brim at 6,5cm and crown at 9,5cm at the center dent. The moths seem to have been very disciplined, but did take some bites out of order of this one in their spare time. Very light weight at 84 grams and the sweatband had to be cut so as not to block the perforations. This is a cool hat.
I do wonder what the three grommets are for.

 

[mayserwegener]

Mossant de Luxe perforated hat in size 57. Triple stitched brim at 6,5cm and crown at 9,5cm at the center dent. The moths seem to have been very disciplined, but did take some bites out of order of this one in their spare time. Very light weight at 84 grams and the sweatband had to be cut so as not to block the perforations. This is a cool hat.
I do wonder what the three grommets are for.

Stefan, Very interesting + unique find! I have seen similar grommets but not sure of there purpose here. I believe this is only hat I have encountered other than my Janyška's with a thin sweatband.

 

[steur]

Stefan, Very interesting + unique find! I have seen similar grommets but not sure of there purpose here. I believe this is only hat I have encountered other than my Janyška's with a thin sweatband.

Thanks, Steve. I thought it was interesting as well and because of its condition it went for next to nothing, so why not.
This is a picture of the American one that's on auction right now. Slightly different approach but the same principle.

 

[mayserwegener]

Thanks, Steve. I thought it was interesting as well and because of its condition it went for next to nothing, so why not.
This is a picture of the American one that's on auction right now. Slightly different approach but the same principle.

View attachment 284426

Stefan, It's a great looking hat. You need to perform a wind flow test. I see that it also has a corrugated vent.

 

[Daniele Tanto]

Sometimes you have to be bold to have something special.

In this case, two bowler hats sold in Paris by a "brocante" who photographed them well, but the size was completely wrong.

Berteil size 7 1/8 or 58cm in Europe. The internal measure is 20x16 cm.

The exterior is in very good condition, as is the interior except for the unstitching of the front of the sweatband.

Surprisingly there are no drafts or dents in the crown. The toppings are good and still presentable.

It is rare to find a bowler hat of this age so well preserved

 

[Daniele Tanto]

To keep company with the bowler hat Berteil, another piece of hat from years long gone by now

Also this very badly judged for the size, sold as a tight 57 cm.

Mossant size 6 or 59cm in Europe or 7 3/8 US. The internal measure is 20.5x17 cm.

The outside is in very good condition, the inside as well, without lining with the mark on the bottom of the crown which makes me think its old age is greater than the previous one.

Here too there are no drafts or dents in the crown and the shape is the ancient one.
It is not a low, round "bowl" and the brims are very curled.

The toppings are good and still presentable.

I repeat: it is very rare to find a bowler hat of this age so well preserved

 

[AbbaDatDeHat]

Sometimes you have to be bold to have something special.

In this case, two bowler hats sold in Paris by a "brocante" who photographed them well, but the size was completely wrong.

Berteil size 7 1/8 or 58cm in Europe. The internal measure is 20x16 cm.

The exterior is in very good condition, as is the interior except for the unstitching of the front of the sweatband.

Surprisingly there are no drafts or dents in the crown. The toppings are good and still presentable.

It is rare to find a bowler hat of this age so well preserved

Beautiful hats both, Daniele.
How old would you estimate the Berteil to be?
They are not often seen.
B

 

[Daniele Tanto]

Beautiful hats both, Daniele.
How old would you estimate the Berteil to be?
They are not often seen.
B

Thanks Bowen!
Your question is the same one that I asked myself and I have not given myself a definitive answer. Both bowler are of ancient "workmanship". You can see from many details: they are light, have the crown slightly flared downwards and the wings are very curled. As I wrote they are not flat bowls with two freshly curled brims. The Berteil seems to belong to the late thirties or forties. Mossant looks older. Tomorrow or in the next few days I will study better and I will tell you my opinion, perhaps by publishing the paper labels. Certainly the support of the connoisseurs of bowler hats, I am not among them, will have elements to determine their age.

 

[mayserwegener]

To keep company with the bowler hat Berteil, another piece of hat from years long gone by now

Also this very badly judged for the size, sold as a tight 57 cm.

Mossant size 6 or 59cm in Europe or 7 3/8 US. The internal measure is 20.5x17 cm.

The outside is in very good condition, the inside as well, without lining with the mark on the bottom of the crown which makes me think its old age is greater than the previous one.

Here too there are no drafts or dents in the crown and the shape is the ancient one.
It is not a low, round "bowl" and the brims are very curled.

The toppings are good and still presentable.

I repeat: it is very rare to find a bowler hat of this age so well preserved

Daniele, They are both fantastic and in great condition. The detail work on both is superb. Also the felt + finishes are excellent. I am happy to see these two French Stiff Felts!

 

[Daniele Tanto]

Daniele, They are both fantastic and in great condition. The detail work on both is superb. Also the felt + finishes are excellent. I am happy to see these two French Stiff Felts!

Many thanks Steve for your positive comment on the two French bowler hats, coming from you that you are a connoisseur of this kind of hats is something that enriches the palmares of these two creations of the French golden age hats!

 

[steur]

To keep company with the bowler hat Berteil, another piece of hat from years long gone by now

Also this very badly judged for the size, sold as a tight 57 cm.

Mossant size 6 or 59cm in Europe or 7 3/8 US. The internal measure is 20.5x17 cm.

The outside is in very good condition, the inside as well, without lining with the mark on the bottom of the crown which makes me think its old age is greater than the previous one.

Here too there are no drafts or dents in the crown and the shape is the ancient one.
It is not a low, round "bowl" and the brims are very curled.

The toppings are good and still presentable.

I repeat: it is very rare to find a bowler hat of this age so well preserved

Two fantastic finds, Daniele and in great shape as well. Seeing Berteil hats is always a special treat. Interesting to see the Mossant has a corrugated sweatband-front.

 

[steur]

Been looking for one of these for some time but the French sellers seem to think these are their equivalent of the Whippet Quite the coincidence as well; I managed to find not just this one, but a second one in the same week.
Willoughby Real Nutria homburg. Size 57 with the brim at 6cm and the crown at 11cm at the center dent. Came in a box dated 1937, which seems about right to me. The box mentions Ragon (Rat Gondin -nutria) but also mentions Madelios, which is another retailer with hats under their own brand. The box came wrapped in packing tape
Fantastic hand to the felt and shapes without any steam. Sold to me as black, but I'm very glad it's in fact a mid to dark grey. No label inside the hat. Some light mothing on the front, but more noticeable in the pics than in real life.
Is it really a French hat if the liner says "fabrique a Londres" ? Maybe not, but we don't know enough about Willoughby except that it was based in Paris.

 

[steur]

Willoughby Prince IV G satin finish. Size 57 with the overwelt brim at 5cm and the crown at 11cm at the center dent. This one doesn't have "fabrique a Londres" on the liner, like the previous one has and it does have a label that says "made in France". This one does seem set in its ways and doesn't like to be creased. Very soft longhair felt and the hand is outstanding. Unreeded construction. Likely intended to be shaped brim up, but it does work as a regular fedora as well.
Probably older that it looks. Interesint is that I did find a very similar hat that was named "Prince III". Also found a WIlloughby hat made by Robert Heath, so it's highly likely taht Willoughby sourced their hats from various manufacturers.