Collar pin/bar or tab collar?

[Hynes]

For those of you guys who wear collar pins/bars or tab collar shirt to keep a better look of the tie knot, I'm curious about which one would you choose and why. Replies and discussions are appreciated!!

 

[MondoFW]

Probably a collar pin because they can make shirts with a slight spread look much more elegant. Also, I'm just salty that I can never find tab collar shirts at stores.

Ashley Weston, on an article where she discusses dress shirts, denounced tab collars and spearpoints, and specifically stated that they'll make you look like your mom dressed you up. That got me thinking, "do a lot of other people think this?"
Then I realized this was the woman that claimed that wearing wide ties signify that you're unorganized and out of the loop, so...

 

[Patrick Hall]

I prefer collar pins, because you can forego them if you want. A tab collar shirt is less versatile because it can't be paired with ties that tie thick knots. I also prefer a pin to a clamp-style bar because a pin doesn't slip down the collar points during the day. I don't like eyelet collars because they are a bit affected, in that they telegraph that they were MADE for a collar bar. Also, they suffer from the same versatility issues as a tab collar.

 

[Fading Fast]

I'm a big fan of tab, pin and eyelet collars as I like the way they pull the tie knot and collar together in a "finished" look. I also like how they "pop" the tie knot out a bit.

I have no interest in the collar bar that clips on as I find they almost always slip or come off during the day and part of enjoying clothes for me is not having to think much about them once I put them on.

While Patrick is correct about the limitations of tab collars, etc., when I was working in an office (I work from home now) and wore a suit and tie everyday, it was no big deal to have a percentage of my shirts be tab collars, etc.

But again, my real passion for them comes from the way they make the tie knot and collar look neat and the way they keep everything "stable" throughout the day.

 

[Edward]

I prefer collar pins, because you can forego them if you want. A tab collar shirt is less versatile because it can't be paired with ties that tie thick knots. I also prefer a pin to a clamp-style bar because a pin doesn't slip down the collar points during the day. I don't like eyelet collars because they are a bit affected, in that they telegraph that they were MADE for a collar bar. Also, they suffer from the same versatility issues as a tab collar.

If I have my druthers, I'll always prefer a collar with a pin, though I find that the most practical option with modern shirt collars is to use a pin with a collar that has eyelets, otherwise I find I end up with holes in the collar that don't disappear with washing. Never had a tab shirt, but I agree they have that same drawback of lacking versatility.

The main problem I find with pins is the same as ties. New ties these days are often too thick and too long, meaning either the end hangs down past my crotch (I loathe wearing a tie that stops lower than an inch or two above my beltline), or I end up with a knot the size of my own head (equally unacceptable. I'm not a soccer player). Likewise, pins smaller than 2" long are like hens teeth. All to do with the fact that it's almost impossible (outside of vintage repro places working on a small scale and therefore more expensive) to find a collar that isn't too wide spread for anything else. If I could find a source selling silvertone and goldtone pins, new, at a reasonable price, I'd buy a dozen.

 

[Patrick Hall]

agree about modern tie lengths. Because most of my suits are vintage, I tend to pair them with quiet modern foulards from Drakes/Cappelli/Marinella et al to avoid a costumey vibe. Often end up sticking many inches of back blade down the front of of my trousers. Thankfully, among those makers at least, unlined, untipped ties with hand-rolled tips are back in vogue. So small knots are possible again.

 

[MondoFW]

I can't even find the safety pin style ones for sale. It is unfortunate that the demise of a suit and/or tie as everyday wear was also the demise of accessible accessories.

Also, some people think my ties are cheaply made because they're minimally/unlined ones from the 30s-50s (Rayon isn't a cheap fiber, is it?)

 

[Fading Fast]

I can't even find the safety pin style ones for sale. It is unfortunate that the demise of a suit and/or tie as everyday wear was also the demise of accessible accessories.

Also, some people think my ties are cheaply made because they're minimally/unlined ones from the 30s-50s (Rayon isn't a cheap fiber, is it?)

Check out this seller's page (link below) on Ebay as he/she has several in silver and gold (colors) and 2" and 2.5" lengths. Also, click on one, scroll down a bit and look at the "People who viewed this item..." section, as there seem to be more listed there as well.

Good luck, hope this helps.

http://stores.ebay.com/24-7-Jewelry...54374014&_sid=494254084&_trksid=p4634.c0.m322

 

[Mathematicus]

Also, some people think my ties are cheaply made because they're minimally/unlined ones from the 30s-50s (Rayon isn't a cheap fiber, is it?)

I find that, more than lining, it is the excessive length that makes modern ties unpractical (unless you have a 18'' collar and you wear your trousers at the crorch level). Indeed, the longer is the tie, the less dramatic is the width decrease from the front blade to the diagonal seam. So if you are wearing your trousers correctly and you want the tie to end above the waistline, you are forced to start the knot at a point in which the blade is still rather wide, ending up with a huge and disproportionate knot.
There are remedies for that, like having the tie shortened and reshaped but there are limitations on the amount of the alteration - and of course you need to find someone who understands your needs and is willing to do that.

 

[Patrick Hall]

I run into this problem often. Even if you are willing to tuck the back blade down your trousers, there is just a maximum point after which any knot you try to tie will look unsightly in size. I remain mystified about why tie makers haven't remedied the problem, given that trouser rises have been creeping back up the past few years.

EDIT: For this reason I often order ties from EG Cappelli and Sam Hober, both of which allow you to select your own length, width, and lining. More expensive than vintage ties off of eBay, but if you want modern ties that suit, those guys are your best bet.

 

[Edward]

I think it's probably time we had a thread on modern ties that are a reasonable substitute for vintage, given that vintage ties are a limited resource. Folks keep telling me they're available and cheap, but I only see the prices going up and up, and alas the do get wear and tear if worn regularly...

 

[Mathematicus]

I don't have problems with modern ties, apart from some questionable design. Also I don't like the trend of fat, loose knots which is around since some time. When I lived in Rome finding a tie which was not thick like my hand was a pain. That's because everybody wanted to tie a loose full Windsor. It looks like big knots are still popular, though less here in England.

The drawback of modern ties is length and shape, as I said. Not much if the tie but definitely yes from 3.25 inches. My father has several ties from Canali and Lebole (both high quality Italian firms) which I would love to incorporate in my wardobe as he doesn't wear them - but they are so long I usually struggle a lot to make a decently sized knot out of them.

I have found that boys' ties have the perfect length for me (47-49 inches) but the disadvantage is the limited variety of colours available. A company that sells good quality ties in this length is Roco clothing (based in UK).

 

[MondoFW]

I think it's probably time we had a thread on modern ties that are a reasonable substitute for vintage, given that vintage ties are a limited resource. Folks keep telling me they're available and cheap, but I only see the prices going up and up, and alas the do get wear and tear if worn regularly...

Really? I find they're the most common vintage garments these days. They're everywhere online and at vintage shops (especially the late 40s ties, because few people care for them)

What I find odd about modern ties are some of the color choices: super bold satin-y shades of pink, purple, blue. Then there are those terrible floral ones that my English teacher sports. At least the knit tie has survived through generations.

 

[Mathematicus]

Not every modern tie is made of shining fabric with questionable colours. There are very elegant designs and shades amongst many brands, but certainly not in the cheap department store.

Floral ties can be rather ugly, I agree.