Changes in Attitude in Marriage & Divorce from the Golden Era to Now.

[tonyb]

We learn, over time, to recognize what isn't working in a relationship, and get a pretty good handle on what can be fixed and what is just a matter of points of incompatibility that can't be fixed. Big lessons for me.
And then you find yourself in a relationship that really works, and with a clear understanding of what needs attention and how to go about it, knowing you can work through most anything together. That's the magic to search for. Lucky me, I found it.
Super happy that this happened last weekend.
... ]

Congratulations to you both. I wish you a long and happy life together.

 

[Edward]

We learn, over time, to recognize what isn't working in a relationship, and get a pretty good handle on what can be fixed and what is just a matter of points of incompatibility that can't be fixed. Big lessons for me.
And then you find yourself in a relationship that really works, and with a clear understanding of what needs attention and how to go about it, knowing you can work through most anything together. That's the magic to search for. Lucky me, I found it.
Super happy that this happened last weekend.



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Bravo, and congratulations!

I have a vague memory of that scandal ⇧. What was the real story - insanely stupid youth thing or was there something worse there?

Back in, from memory, 2005, Young Harry was invited to go to a fancy dress party entitled "Colonials and Natives". He and his brother (who dressed as a lion at the event) were taken to the fancy dress shop by royal protection officers (Charles and Camilla were in Scotland at the time), and allowed to choose their own outfits. According to the shopkeepers in later interviews, Harry wanted initially to wear a black SS uniform that they kept in stock, but it was too small, so he hired the Afrika Korps look instead, teaming it with the inaccurate (and clearly badly made) NSDAP armband. A guest leaked a photo to the press, and there was a minor scandal. Nobody really thought he was a Nazi, more it was suggested that the outfit was in poor taste. (I can't comment on that - the following New Year I went to a private party under the theme "2005", and dressed as a parody of Harry in that scandal.) Personally, it was the party theme I found offensive rather than some kid's choice of outfit. Were he not royal, most people wouldn't have cared, and it would certainly never have been reported. There's been quite the sea-change on this sort of thing in the UK in recent decades; during the war, the comedy Nazi buffoon was a common comedy trope; as the war generation die out, it seems to be becoming seen as more offensive.

 

[Edward]

From all evidence it seems to have been just a dumb college kid thing, for which I imagine he was whaled out to holy hell behind closed doors by his grandmother.

Pretty much. It subsequently came out that it was also common practice at Sandhurst, which Harry also attended, for the rehearsal for the passing out parade to be fancy dress, Nazi uniforms being especially popular for that. No real support for the Nazis intended, largely kids either mocking the Nazis in a very traditional British way, or just thinking it funny to wear such outfits knowing their capacity to attract attention and cause offence. Which is not to say I necessarily approve, but one has to be realistic about the nature of any problem rather than fighting the enemy that isn't in the room.

 

[LizzieMaine]

There's been quite the sea-change on this sort of thing in the UK in recent decades; during the war, the comedy Nazi buffoon was a common comedy trope; as the war generation die out, it seems to be becoming seen as more offensive.

I think that's also true here, and I think it's in a way unfortunate, especially with the recrudeseence of home-grown Fascism/Neo-Nazism in this country in recent years. Just this year, a town in my state ousted its town manager when facts came to light that he was an active neo-Nazi -- not some basement-dweller who is stimulated by dressing up in an SS uniform, but someone who actively promotes the whole Blut und Boden/white nationalist/Mein Kampf philosophy. And I think part of the reason he has followers is that we've come to treat the symbols of what he stands for as these untouchable, terrifying images of great evil power.

Well, yes, they were and are. But the more we give them this sort of beyond-the-pale significance the more they -- and the beliefs they represent -- are made attractive to the sort of ingrown misfits who are drawn to such beliefs as a response to their own inadequacy. "Hey kid, you don't have to be just another neckbeard loser, come burn a swastika with us and YOU'LL SHOW THEM ALL!"

Ridicule of their symbols and by extension of their ideology helps rob them of their power to attract attention. The people of the Era understood this, and that's why Charlie Chaplin and Moe Howard and Bobby Watson and Donald Duck and Bugs Bunny were so effective in cutting Hitler down to size. It doesn't minimize our recognition of the evils committed in Hitler's name to mock Nazis and their symbols -- but it does help keep those evils from coming back. "Never Forget" is all well and good, but I prefer "Never Again."

 

[Edward]

I think that's also true here, and I think it's in a way unfortunate, especially with the recrudeseence of home-grown Fascism/Neo-Nazism in this country in recent years. Just this year, a town in my state ousted its town manager when facts came to light that he was an active neo-Nazi -- not some basement-dweller who is stimulated by dressing up in an SS uniform, but someone who actively promotes the whole Blut und Boden/white nationalist/Mein Kampf philosophy. And I think part of the reason he has followers is that we've come to treat the symbols of what he stands for as these untouchable, terrifying images of great evil power.

Well, yes, they were and are. But the more we give them this sort of beyond-the-pale significance the more they -- and the beliefs they represent -- are made attractive to the sort of ingrown misfits who are drawn to such beliefs as a response to their own inadequacy. "Hey kid, you don't have to be just another neckbeard loser, come burn a swastika with us and YOU'LL SHOW THEM ALL!"

Ridicule of their symbols and by extension of their ideology helps rob them of their power to attract attention. The people of the Era understood this, and that's why Charlie Chaplin and Moe Howard and Bobby Watson and Donald Duck and Bugs Bunny were so effective in cutting Hitler down to size. It doesn't minimize our recognition of the evils committed in Hitler's name to mock Nazis and their symbols -- but it does help keep those evils from coming back.

To quote a fictional Nazi (which somehow seems appropriate in the context of this discussion) "That's a bingo!"

 

[GHT]

We learn, over time, to recognize what isn't working in a relationship, and get a pretty good handle on what can be fixed and what is just a matter of points of incompatibility that can't be fixed. Big lessons for me.
And then you find yourself in a relationship that really works, and with a clear understanding of what needs attention and how to go about it, knowing you can work through most anything together. That's the magic to search for. Lucky me, I found it.
Super happy that this happened last weekend.
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What a heartwarming, magical, feelgood post, cheered me up no end. I truly hope that you two have found your lifelong soulmate. I have certainly found mine and on Friday next, we go gold. 50 years ago we walked down the aisle as a new husband and wife. I'll resist waxing lyrical but I am very proud, of both of us.

 

[GHT]

To be fair, though, I suspect Harry is also having an easier time of it because unlike his forebearer, he isn't a Nazi.

Oh, I forgot. Well, scratch that theory.

One thing that I am not, is a royalist. But I do have a grudging sympathy with Prince Harry and this unfortunate photo. His mother, Princess Diana, was probably the first royal to actually engage with full time parenting. Her untimely death left him very vulnerable and alone. His father just farmed out Harry, and his brother, to Nannies. When he did try to be a father he made an absolute fist of it, but then, how would he know how it's done? He was also raised by Nannies, to him that's the norm.

Harry was nine years old when his mother died, and with her death he lost his mentor. She would never have let him wear such an inflammatory costume and she would have ensured that his teenage years would have been a lot more secure. She would have told him of the minefield that wearing such a costume would pose. Harry, in my eye, still is, the be all and end all of our class system, but in this sad case he was just easy prey for the wolves of Fleet Street.