Black Tie waist covering?

[brendond]

Hi i have a dinner dance next weekend which is black tie optional. my question is i have a marcella front shirt with detachable wing collar , is it ok to wear with just braces and no waist covering . I dont like cummerbands and dont own one and the black waistcoats i own are not a good fit at all. only other option is to go for just a normal suit and tie . i dont think many will be in black tie . thanks in advance for your help.

 

[Tomasso]

The only exception to the 'rule' requiring the wearing of a vest/waistcoat or cumerbund is if the jacket is double breasted. Is your dinner jacket double breasted?

 

[F. J.]

Cover that waist!

Mr. brendond,

Wearing black tie without a waist covering is a major faux pas. However, a sharp alternative to the conventional black is a white waistcoat, much as one would wear with full dress. You can see Mr. Cary Grant so attired at the link at the end of this post.

I am by no means affiliated with the site, but the Black Tie Guide is perhaps the definitive Internet resource for the conventions surrounding formal dress. Everything you ever wanted to know about the history and current trends of White Tie, Black Tie, Morning Dress, &c., can be found there. A good starting place for you might be the article "Classic Waistcoats and Cummerbunds".

I hope you find this helpful.
Sincerely,

 

[Guttersnipe]

A.C. and F.J. are indeed correct. However, these days lots of men wear semi-formal rigs without a vest or cummerbund, so you could do that if you like. Clooney and Craig look pretty snazzy sans waist coverings here:

 

[brendond]

A.C. and F.J. are indeed correct. However, these days lots of men wear semi-formal rigs without a vest or cummerbund, so you could do that if you like. Clooney and Craig look pretty snazzy sans waist coverings here:

thank you every one for all your help a waistcoat is a no go as the 2 i own dont fit well so i think i might just go for a normal suit.

 

[BR Gordon]

If I had a physique like either Cloony or Craig, I probably wouldn't worry about a waist covering either.

 

[F. J.]

Hmmm . . .

A.C. and F.J. are indeed correct. However, these days lots of men wear semi-formal rigs without a vest or cummerbund, so you could do that if you like. Clooney and Craig look pretty snazzy sans waist coverings here:

[IMAGES REDACTED FOR CONCISION.]

I would like to point out that both of the gentlemen pictured are wearing bottoned jackets. Both very possibly are wearing either cummerbunds or low-cut waistcoats that are not currently visible, but would be when either unbuttoned his jacket to sit down.

Also, most men aren't "cut out" to be sans waist covering. It simply looks funny on them, unless they never unbutton the jacket.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Nope. What they're both wearing is modern tuxedos that feature waistbands faced in satin. It's a streamlined look that became a "thing" in the '60s.

But I agree that semi-formal without a vest or cummerbund looks odd . . .

 

[Tomasso]

tuxedos that feature waistbands faced in satin .

My uncle had tuxedo trousers with a cummerbund built into the waistband. They were high waisted with a drop-down front. I think they were made by Pucci, a Chicago tailor.

 

[SteveAS]

This picture of George Clooney brings to mind a personal pet peeve: dressing (semi-) formally, with mussed hair and a few days' beard growth. That look may be de riguer on a camping trip or a tropical vacation, but just seems way out of place on a dressy evening.

 

[RegentSt1965]

Nowadays, for most black_tie events in the UK (thankfully there appears to be reversal of their recent sad decline) a cummerbund feels redundant and a trifle once_a_yearish. I haven't worn one for quite a while now. They seem to worn here by the hire it/haven't worn the suit for years crowd. Main thing is, of course to tie ones own bow, and as a strong personal preference I eschew the wing collar.

 

[HudsonHawk]

A formal or semi-formal suit without *some* kind of waist covering (even if it's a narrow band a la Clooney and Craig) is being only partly dressed. It would be the equivalent of not wearing a tie. Neither are appropriate. Ever.

 

[avedwards]

If you don't unbutton the jacket at all (even when seated) it would be acceptable not to wear a waist covering. However, if you are wearing a single breasted jacket it must be very well cut to avoid draping badly when seated.

 

[Corky]

This picture of George Clooney brings to mind a personal pet peeve: dressing (semi-) formally, with mussed hair and a few days' beard growth. That look may be de riguer on a camping trip or a tropical vacation, but just seems way out of place on a dressy evening.

George Clooney (as a working member of the Screen Actors Guild) might be in the process of shooting a film in which his character requires mussed hair and a certain growth of beard.

Remember when Natalie Portman looked like this:

 

[Fastuni]

Reason why I prefer DB tuxes. No fussing around with either cummerbunds, waistcoats, stiff shirts or wing-collars.

 

[Guttersnipe]

Reason why I prefer DB tuxes. No fussing around with either cummerbunds, waistcoats, stiff shirts or wing-collars.

Those are exactly the reasons they became so popular after the First World War.

 

[Two Types]

Here's an example of the white waistcoat worn with black tie from 1935:

 

[Midnight Blue]

This is why you don't skip the waist covering with black tie:







That exposed patch of shirt navel is essentially the formal equivalent of plumber's crack.

 

[SteveAS]

This is why you don't skip the waist covering with black tie:

That exposed patch of shirt navel is essentially the formal equivalent of plumber's crack.

Hear, hear! :eusa_clap

Incidentally, the little woman and I watched the Fashion Police coverage of the Grammys and not one of the critics said a word about the lack of waist covering on most of the dinner suit wearing men. [huh]