Beaver Brand Hats Final Auction

[majormoore]

The western hats 20X and better are nice, the dress hats need to be of rabbit fur or beaver fur, there were some really nice dress hats that were sold, and a ton of low in wool hats also. I felt of some really nice dress velor finish hats and some outstanding western 20X hats while there

Mike Moore

Just out of curiosity, what's the general feel for the quality of the hats Beaver was turning out the last few years? I'm sure it runs the gamut from high to so so, but in general, how did they stack up? If you see a semi finished or finished hat on feebay and suspect it came from the auction, would you tend to bid more or less than you would for a comparable hat in another brand?

 

[TheDane]

jskeen, I wrote a comment on my own experience here: http://www.thefedoralounge.com/show...nd-Hats-gone&p=1659974&viewfull=1#post1659974

That's the only BB I own, and it differs dramatically from older BB's I have seen/handled. The hat in question is by most parameters a lousy piece of work - but please note: I'm only talking about that hat. I haven't got the knowledge to make any statements about their general quality in their later years.

- but I like the design of the box it came in

 

[bowlerman]

I have four. Three are 5x. In my experience, the felt is not great, and does not hold up well to rain, but I like em anyway. My new derby fits very large, and the top hat fits perfect, even a tad snug but not uncomfortable. Both are tagged 7 1/8. The derby is 8x and I can feel a minor improvement in quality. Fun hats, but I'm glad I got them at the prices I did.

Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk 2

 

[johnnycanuck]

Interesting. I got two hats from a small town general store's dead stock after it went out of business. At least 20 years old. Look familiar? I guess I know where it came from now.


Johnny

 

[RBH]

Pretty cool JC.... you never know what you can find.
There were a great many more 'stamps' that I did not get a photo of.
Some looked so cool but were hard to read.
I can only hope they end up on E Bay and not at the scrap yard.

 

[besdor]

Does anyone know what happened to the stuff that didn't sell? I'm sure there was a lot of stuff that didn't go up for sale.

Steven

 

[RBH]

Steven... when we were there Sunday to finish loading up for Mike. Keith, Winchester and we got a few items ready for Brooks.....there was not much of anything left.
I would say all items sold.

 

[besdor]

That's good to know. I guess all those neat lining dies will end up on Ebay or in someone's collection.

Steven

 

[RBH]

Bidding at an auction with somebody else's money is on my bucket list.

I know... I was watching a few things for Graham and also for Mike.
They both had different things they were watching.... [that made it easier]

 

[barrowjh]

It was very interesting to see that BB was making Wormser hats. I know the Wormser store that went out of business in Chattanooga had recent vintage Wormsers that still had Wormser sales price tags, and I have one Wormser thin ribbon myself that probably dates from the 1960s or 70s, but I have never heard anything about a Wormser factory. There may have been a Wormser factory at some point in the past, but it appears that in the end Wormser hats were being made by BB. Interesting.

 

[barrowjh]

I am curious about where did they get hoods? I don't thing they were felting any hoods themselves, and I don't think they were a customer of Winchester, so where did their hoods come from?

 

[John Galt]

jskeen, I wrote a comment on my own experience here: http://www.thefedoralounge.com/show...nd-Hats-gone&p=1659974&viewfull=1#post1659974

That's the only BB I own, and it differs dramatically from older BB's I have seen/handled. The hat in question is by most parameters a lousy piece of work - but please note: I'm only talking about that hat. I haven't got the knowledge to make any statements about their general quality in their later years.

- but I like the design of the box it came in

I've got a navy blue "100% Pure Beaver Fur" Beaver Brand stingy brim fedora that has what may be the best felt I've ever - well, felt. It is eminently shapable and light, but also very dense. The 20x and better are reportedly very good, and I've always wanted to buy the "Major" (BB fedora) but have had bad timing when they came up...

Didn't Beaver own the Lyon/Leone Capelli brands?

 

[bowlerman]

Huh? (Regarding BB manufacturing for wormser)That is surprising considering the infinitely superior felt quality of my Wormsers. When was this?

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[Walt]

Thanks for sharing this with us all. I've been wondering what the status of the disposition of the company was. Too bad there wasn't a new owner to keep it going, but at least the equipment and materials are going to the few remaining hatters keeping the tradition alive.

I suppose we have to face the reality that the factory/mass produced hat business continues to consolidate down to a remaining handful of outfits that can or will make at least some decent products and the rest will provide the cheap sh*t stuff from places like China (at least in terms of quality though not always in price) that the masses will consume.

I have a few modern Beaver Brand hats and also a few vintage. Included in the moderns is a thin ribbon and some westerns. They weren't bad for the price. I have looked at some of their 10x and 20x offerings and they were pretty decent felt. Better than comparable Stetsons IMHO (if that's saying much). Beaver had a great selection of offerings in vintage western stylings including period accurate 19th century and pre-WWII "golden age" western styles (extra wide brims and tall crowns). Large selections of felt colors as well. There were able to do quite a bit of custom work as well. You could custom order from their website. They would sell open crown so you could form it yourself.

My local western gear retailer has/had a nice selection of their western styles. Makes me want to pay a visit on Saturday to take a look at what she has left. If only paying full retail prices was in my current budget...

I thought Beaver had a good thing going catering to the hard core Retro Rodeo style fans and Cowboy Action shooting clubs (those people are big on period dress up)--I've seen many of their hats worn in those circles. Apparently that niche segment just isn't enough to keep a factory operation going-- fortunately the smaller custom hatters benefit from those folks.

So long Beaver Brand. Wish I had been able to buy some more of their western hats before it was too late. My heart was really set on those tall crown offerings.

 

[RBH]

i am curious about where did they get hoods? I don't thing they were felting any hoods themselves, and i don't think they were a customer of winchester, so where did their hoods come from?

Fepsa

 

[barrowjh]

Beaver Brand's Liner Dies - pic by RBH

Bowlerman, it was this picture by RBH on the 1st page of this thread that revealed Beaver Brand was making hats for Wormser (at least, by the end of the Wormser brand name). Don Hoy also. Fepsa is the source of many if not most of Graham's hoods at Optimo, so depending on the quality of hood ordered, and the quality of workmanship the contract called for, Beaver Brand was quite capable of making really nice hats with Fepsa hoods.



I think the quality issue comes from mass manufacturing and pay by piecework to facilitate low costs. I fully believe the Hatco folks are quite capable of making awesome hats also. When the Stetson 100 was Stetson's best, that price was nearly triple the price for an ounce of gold. For that same price (in gold) you can get a hat just as awesome from Hatco today (well, almost as awesome). I think the lack of demand led to dilution of quality as the factories tried to get prices down to stimulate some orders and stay busy. Then, the lower quality comes back at them as customers are disappointed with the hats. A self-reinforcing downward spiral.

When the lounge did a fedorafest at Hatco a couple of years ago the attendees were impressed with one of the hats and Mike tried to put together a group deal on a run of thin-ribbons, but again quality became an issue. Pushing one hat through the steps (with a watchful eye) they could produce a knock-out hat, but when they tried to run them through as regular production the quality suffered, so the idea could never work, or, rather, we would have to be willing to pay considerably more per hat to get a little better attention to detail. I think the price being negotiated was under $200 each at that time.

I think the quality issue was relatively simple, like, why can't you sew the ribbon on straight so that it covers the sweatband stitching? How much extra do we have to pay to get the ribbon squared up with the sweatband stitching that it is supposed to cover? I think the only way for them to guarantee the ribbon would cover the sweat stitching was to go to custom hat pricing which sort of defeats the purpose of trying to put together a group order in the first place. There is a thread about it somewhere.

 

[RBH]

Well stated John.

 

[RBH]

...

Didn't Beaver own the Lyon/Leone Capelli brands?

Langenberg Hat Co [Beaver Brand] did own Lion Hats.

 

[TheDane]

RBH, do you know, when Harris Langenberg was bought by Beaver Brand? I know that Harris-Polk, became part of Harris Langenberg in the late 30's - but not that they ended up as part of BB. I have a (probably) mid 50's western dress hat from Worth, and the bottom box in the box-tower made me curious

 

[TheDane]

Sorry RBH, I found the answer here: http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?7894-Beaver-Brand&p=109975&viewfull=1#post109975

American hat companies seem to form a family with a quite complicated genealogy