Australian Vintage Suits

[The Rag And Bone Man]

Something like that looks like what you'd wear in Melbourne or Hobart during the coldest of winters!

Your not wrong there Shangas, there is no way this would have been looked at in the Australian summer, let alone worn its that thick, the padding in the shoulders made me laugh, it must be half inch thick in places.

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

Nice one. With the one button, peaked lapels and four button waistcoat, it reminds me of continental suits - like the German 'Nachmitte und Abend' suits that were a cross between day and evening wear.
The tailor's name appears to be French, it would be interesting to see close ups of the trousers etc so that the continental suit experts can tell us whether it was made in the French style.

Yes sorry for my average pictures I will take some more tomorrow in a natural light setting, hopefully then you can get a better look at it's construction.

 

[Fastuni]

This is an interesting suit.

The "Nachmittags- und Abendanzug" (German for "afternoon and evening suit") Two Types referred to, was widely worn in Germany, France and other Continental European countries for small, private festivities, church services, smaller cultural/social activities (cinema, dance, teas). It was usually solid black or with subtle stripes and could be worn with long tie or black bowtie as a lesser substitute for a tuxedo. HOWEVER they were cut like normal street suits... These type of suits were very frequent in Germany and a popular export to other countries. It is in the Anglo-American sphere that these type of black suits are rather unusual. But I could imagine that in Australia an undertaker, clergyman or maybe a recent immigrant from Europe would have kept to this type of black garment.

Now this one, with its long, wide lapels, one-button and most of all the low-cut four-button waistcoat, has the cut of a tuxedo!
I'd wager a guess here: It was a Tuxedo which had the silk-facings professionally removed and replaced with matching black lapel facings.

If it is not a converted tuxedo, it is an evening/sunday suit, that was made with the features of a tuxedo.

Regarding the date: 1930's.

BTW I have a 1930's French Tuxedo that is also impossible to wear - the interlining and padding is like steel-concrete.

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

This is an interesting suit.

The "Nachmittags- und Abendanzug" (German for "afternoon and evening suit") Two-Types referred to, was widely worn in Germany, France and other Continental European countries for small, private festivities, church services, smaller cultural/social activities (cinema, dance, teas). It was usually solid black or with subtle stripes and could be worn with long tie or black bowtie as a lesser substitute for a tuxedo. HOWEVER they were cut like normal street suits... These type of suits were very frequent in Germany and a popular export to other countries. It is in the Anglo-American sphere that these type of black suits are rather unusual. But I could imagine that in Australia an undertaker, clergyman or maybe a recent immigrant from Europe would have kept to this type of black garment.

Now this one, with its long, wide lapels, one-button and most of all the low-cut four-button waistcoat, has the cut of a tuxedo!
I'd wager a guess here: It was a Tuxedo which had the silk-facings professionally removed and replaced with matching black lapel facings.

If it is not a converted tuxedo, it is an evening/sunday suit, that was made with the features of a tuxedo.

Regarding the date: 1930's.

Thank you Sir.. I appreciate your information.

 

[Two Types]

Fastuni: I note your comments on the suit style (one button - peak lapel - dinner jacket/tuxedo look) as being different to the 'nachmitte und abend' style. However, I am sure I read something elsewhere on the FL - maybe in a translation from a German clothing catalogue? - that described those suits as being similar in style to a dinner suit but without the silk facings.
I must ty to find the original reference.

 

[Fastuni]

Do you mean these posts by Flat Foot Floey?

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?35641-Black-Suit&p=1389841&viewfull=1#post1389841

Singlebreasted afternoon and evening suit made from black fabric that also can show subtle pinstripes (see fabric sample). It is worn with a doublebreasted bright or dark waistcoat, grey tie or black/white cravat (?). This suit can replace the cutaway and fits occasions in the afternoon or evening and also for dancing. With lighter striped trousers it is suitable for promenade, dinner or the club. For the latter two it has to be worn with a black bowtie or cravat together with a white shirt and a wing collar. In the picture you can see a commendable collar with black bowtie like it would be worn with a tuxedo (black tie). Patent leather shoes complete the correct way to wear this suit. On the street it can be worn with a chesterfield coat.

The suit on the right is described as being such a "Nachmittags- und Abendanzug" (mentioning also the popularity for export):
solid black or subtle stripes.

The cuts are like normal daytime suits. Except that the trousers are often uncuffed like on more formal wear.

 

[Two Types]

Yes, but i think there is another cutting.

I have one that is cut in the dinner suit style (peaked lapel, one button, no turn-ups on trousers) i.e. not disimilar to the Australian suit.

 

[DamianM]

So there are no light suits?

Did they always ran to the hills when the heat came?
I mean its Australia.
Or were the light suit used to death and have disintegrated by now

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

I would say the later.. otherwise I am sure they would have found there way up here for all the members to see.

The same goes for hats, well at least hats with age, they don't exist here..

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

Cookie.. Did any of your old school blazers look like this, or is this earlier, I picked this up today, from the same op shop, where I picked up the other 1940 suit, only a few days ago.

 

[Shangas]

Australia is something like the second driest place on earth. And one of the hottest. So suits would probably all have been lighter weight than what is worn in Europe or northern U.S.A. Even in winter. Linen and cotton suits would most likely have been worn out into handkerchieves and dish-rags long ago.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

No not at all. All the Australian vintage suits/tailored goods I've come across are really very heavy. At least on a par with British fabric weight (14-16 Oz or so). (this thread would tend to bear that out, with the above discussion of Stamina Cloth etc.)

 

[cookie]

Cookie.. Did any of your old school blazers look like this, or is this earlier, I picked this up today, from the same op shop, where I picked up the other 1940 suit, only a few days ago. View attachment 2291 View attachment 2292 View attachment 2293 View attachment 2294 View attachment 2295

Mine had a later decal from memory

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

I was going to upload some pictures of an old Australian suit I found a few days ago, but for some reason I can no longer upload pictures here.

Has the uploading format changed, in the last few months, before I could just upload via the insert image.. but when I do that it does nothing.

Anyone here know where I am going wrong..

Ok sorted, here are a couple of pictures of an old Australian suit, no labels and a heavy weight cloth.

notice the natural flaw in the material on the lapel, not a cag.

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

I was going to upload some pictures of an old Australian suit I found a few days ago, but for some reason I can no longer upload pictures here.

Has the uploading format changed, in the last few months, before I could just upload via the insert image.. but when I do that it does nothing.

Anyone here know where I am going wrong..

Ok sorted, here are a couple of pictures of an old Australian suit, no labels and a heavy weight cloth.

View attachment 7557 View attachment 7558 View attachment 7557 View attachment 7559 View attachment 7560 View attachment 7561 View attachment 7562 notice the natural flaw in the material on the lapel, not a cag.

May be this would be 1940's may be even 1930's.. anyone here have a guess.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

Lovely. Yes I agree on your dating. Awesome corozo (?) buttons on the front.

I love those smiling pockets, a feature very unique to Australian suits of the era. In most other ways identical to British suits, but those pockets! I have an Aussie suit of this age, and it also has the smiling pocket on the rear.

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

Baron Kurtz, that's something I did not see but now you mention it, the smiling pocket.

The jacket buttons reminded me of Bakelite.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

They really look like corozo. Could you take a high resolution picture of the back of one of the buttons. That should clear up the "controversy"!!

 

[The Rag And Bone Man]

I can do that no problem, will upload a couple of pictures tomorrow, its the strike of midnight here, and thanks for your comments.

 

[Baron Kurtz]

I also like the waistband closure, another slight variation on the British model. IIRC the Australian suit I sold to Alan Edwards has a similar closure.

Also note the smiling pockets on the two suits posted by Benny Holiday in the first few posts of this thread. It cetainly appears to be a relatively unique Australian innovation on the vintage trouser pocket.